Spoilers Star Trek: Picard 3x10 - "The Last Generation"

[Quantum21]

Well I tried. I'm giving it a 6 though 5 seems more appropriate.

Seeing the crew was great, it just doesn't override what a mess this is. The Titan G is slightly better than awful as an Enterprise, and Matalas proved himself in the end to be a less-than-average writer and showrunner, not worthy of Chabon's Converse All-Stars. After so much hope I'd really hate it if he ever worked on another franchise series.

 

[Tuskin38]

how a small batch of Changelings from Section 31 managed to procreate and create thousands of themselves,

The Vadic said in her backstory that she could pass her changes onto others that didn't have them.

Worf said Odo told him about the group, which means either the Great Link still has spies in the Alpha/Beta Quadrants, or they went back to the great link at some point, got some more followers that agreed with them.

 

[thribs]

So how many cities were destroyed during that time Spacedock was destroyed and the beacon was shot at? Two? Three?

 

[Tuskin38]

I'm not. I'm tired of dead characters coming back to life.

Then don't worry, Q is still dead/will die.

The one we saw in the credits scene is just him from before he died, He says just as much to Jack.

Writers have been forgetting about quantum torpedoes since NEM in 2002. But I don't remember anything explicitly precluding quantum torpedoes from being at play in this episode?

We see one of the Sovereigns near the Titan firing Quantum torpedoes at the beginning of the episode.

 

[Orac Zen]

Okay.

Walter Koenig as Anton Chekov. So great to hear Koenig's voice. At first I thought the "Anton" was a bit much, but then I saw this

Nice little nod to Anton Yelchin I thought.

which hadn't even occurred to me, and assuming that was the intent it became just brilliant. I hope that was the intent.

Despite bloody Q turning up at the last I enjoyed the hell out of that episode. Everyone got a moment to shine in this episode. Everyone got something meaningful and useful to do. Really liked that.

I imagine that if I bother to think about this season too much it'll fall over. But I do not care. I do not give a single damn about it. TNG was the first Trek series I saw in first run and (Voyager, with the exception of Chuckles / Beltran, aside) this is the cast and the characters I enjoy most. Seeing them together again was brilliant. Seeing the Enterprise-D - by far my favourite Enterprise - again was brilliant. I don't give a fuck if it was contrived or fanwanky or any other stupid pejorative term people want to use. Nemesis was complete and utter shite. This was a proper farewell to a cast and group of characters we in all likelihood will never see together onscreen again. That makes up for everything.

Brief thoughts: Tuvok's alive. Yay! After all the name drops it's weird that we didn't see Janeway but I can deal with it. CAPTAIN SEVEN, and she earned it and is good at it. Good to see Shaw had grown a brain even before his death. Even Raffi's family has grown a brain. The family - the Enterprise-D and its command crew - survived and were together at the last. A poker game with the gang together and enjoying each other's company. Lots of other things I may get around to mentioning when I watch it again.

And now for some thoughts on what other people thought.

Jesus wept.

Over something as trivial as an episode of a TV show? I highly doubt it.

I'm super glad Q's death was retconned.

I'm not. A handful of episodes aside I've always detested Q. Having him turn up yet again at the end was a real letdown, but the good stuff outweighed the bad. As ever, to each their own but I'd hoped Q was really gone forever. I should have known better.

Genuinely surprised at no Janeway.

Same here. After all the name drops I figured she'd turn up, but so long as she's in one piece it doesn't matter.

i earnestly hope this is the end, indeed the last generation of Borg

Good Lord, I hope so too. But given effing Q is still around it's probably a forlorn hope.

And that includes stuff like the crap death of Q last season

Again, each to their own but as someone who - a few episodes aside - has detested Q from day one I reserve the right to be disappointed he's still around. However / whenever / whatever it's done.


Well, that was a bit TL, DR, I suspect but whatever. This has been the first season of Trek in (literal) decades I've actually wanted to discuss. On that basis alone it's been a good thing as far as I'm concerned. The mileage of others, obviously and naturally, varies, but it's been a hell of a ride.

 

[Tuskin38]

I'm super glad Q's death was retconned.

It wasn't retconned, please listen to what Q says to Jack after he mentions it.

Q did die, but the Q exist out of normal time, this is just Q before he died.

 

[Ar-Pharazon]

Okay.

Walter Koenig as Anton Chekov. So great to hear Koenig's voice. At first I thought the "Anton" was a bit much, but then I saw this which hadn't even occurred to me, and assuming that was the intent it became just brilliant. I hope that was the intent.

So...what, Pavel's son, grandson?

OK, never mind, I just got to the next scene

 

[Saul]

Lovely way to end the series. Terry did us good. Actually, the scene that I loved best was between Seven and Tuvok with Captain Shaw's message. Jeri Ryan is a great actress. I love the new crew that we get at the end. I disliked the character of Raffi during season 1 and 2 but have come to like her now. I said months ago that the Titan was fugly but can't say I wasn't happy when I saw that they renamed her the Enterprise-G. I'm ready for Star Trek Legacy!

 

[Quantum21]

It wasn't retconned, please listen to what Q says to Jack after he mentions it.

Q did die, but the Q exist out of normal time, this is just Q before he died.

Why bother then?? Dramatically it's just terrible writing, exactly the same thing Matalas has done all season. We see a scene, we scratch our heads, someone cracks a joke, we smile, and everything seems OK till we use our brain cells.

 

[Sci]

I think only the networked fleet was affected. Spacedock wasn’t a part of that and hence the younglings were not assimilated

Well, the transporter network is a different thing from the Fleet Formation network, so I assume the crew aboard Spacedock was still fighting off assimilated youngsters. But they kept control of the command center and of the weapons system.

I would have had Data meet Soji or Dahj (I forget which one is dead) at the end. Have a father and daughter reunion.

Yeah, the lack of Soji really bothered me. PIC S1 is fundamentally about Jean-Luc and Soji coming to accept one-another as ersatz grandfather/granddaughter. The climax of the season comes with the "that's why we're here -- to save each other" line. That scene was a promissory note to the audience that this relationship would be the foundation of the series going forward. And then... they tossed Soji overboard after one scene in "The Star Gazer."

Particularly now that we have Data 3.0, I would have loved to see Soji and him finally meet. And I would have loved to see Soji and the rest of the "Space Millennials/Space Zoomers" meet -- Soji, Jack, Alandra, Sidney, Kestra, Alexander. Oh well!

Worf said Odo told him about the group, which means either the Great Link still has spies in the Alpha/Beta Quadrants, or they went back to the great link at some point, got some more followers that agreed with them.

Yeah, I always assumed Vadic had returned to the Great Link at some point and recruited her followers from there before they departed to try to find their revenge against the Federation.

So how many cities were destroyed during that time Spacedock was destroyed and the beacon was shot at? Two? Three?

I assume the Enterprise crew were able to cut off the signal before the Borgified fleet managed to fire on the surface.

 

[thribs]

Picard should have contacted the Klingons for help. They wouldn’t have been affected.

 

[dinzy]

I'll give it a 10. It stuck the landing, though wasn't perfect. Q was a surprise for sure, but kind of cool. He knows he died, but still basically lives forever because he is a Q.

It was almost cliched with the Han Solo act with the D, but it worked. It was also amusing that Deanna took the helm to rescue them without bumping into anything.

I am not sure how I feel about the Enterprise G. Was F destroyed? Did they dename it due to it's dramatic failure? Seven making captain was a tear jerker for sure. I guess I am fine with the ship being renamed, I just think they could have instead put them on the F after having a year to patch it up.

Big question here, and I think the only possible answer is yes and will be pissed off if someone undoes it; Are the Borg annihilated? Season 2 was weird because it brought us a different Borg so someone will utilize them somehow, but this show killed the real Borg for good.

I would very much like to see a follow up to this. A movie would be fun. It kind of sucks that it is over. No more needing to wake up and watch this first thing to avoid spoilers.

 

[Scionz]

:/ I'm sorry, but to act like the subject of death is somehow new to fiction or is being used more than it used to be used in fiction is just... not a realistic assessment of the situation. Death has always been common in fiction because, y'know, it's kind of the fundamental fact of human life and always has been. It's the only truly universal human experience.

I wasn't referring to death in fiction in general. That's ancient. I'm referring to "stunt death", "shock death". That is new. It's started showing up in the late 90s and accelerated in 2000s. Walking Dead and Game of Thrones in the past 10 years made stunt death more common than ever to the point the motivating question in so many shows is"who dies?".

You like Stranger Things? The for the past two seasons the speculation has been on who dies (usually Hopper). For next season, it's all on Will or Hopper or Eleven. That is such a perverse thing to be normalized. Rather than speculate as to what events happen and what story is told, or why it happens the speculation is on whose story ends for good.

Not to make too much of a tanget, but I'm I'm not the first to observe there is something deeply amiss in our society with regards to life and death that is very different than how such things were regarded in the 1990s and 1980s. Particularly in the 1980s, there was much more a focus on life.

Also I disagree. There can be no death without life, and the other truly universal human experience is life. It's good this series ended on a note about life continuing on, with more life happening. Picard could have died. But now instead, he's a father. For the first time as he said, his life has something it was missing.

If anything, I'd say popular fiction doesn't really use death enough, since so often it's more "death" than death because characters get resurrected so often.

Well that's just it. They yank the death chain, then, in fiction that allows it, yanks the resurrection chain (or the cameo chain if they can't). Which makes death in fiction meaningless other than a stunt.

Strongly disagree. Star Trek: Picard has always been a series about finding meaning, purpose, and love in the face of grief and mortality. It would have been thematically appropriate for Jean-Luc Picard, having been given a reprieve at the end of "Et in Arcadia Ego, Part II," to finally pass in "The Last Generation."

Hell no. Picard Season 1 and Season 2 were about that, but who gives a shit about those anymore. Picard Season 3 dismissed it all just as Shaw dismissed Jurati's Borg as "weird shit". It would have been lousy to return to Season 1/2 themes when Season 3 started with Picard moving from Earth to enter a new stage in his life. Even there, in the first episode, no longer about grief and mortality, but about opportunity and possibilities of life.

It would have been a violation of that promise in S3E1, to end on a note any different than Picard, in the shuttle with Beverly and his son, seeing the Enterprise G. Picard's days as a Starfleet Captain and Admiral are over, but now he gets to live out his life in a new adventure: a father.

That has so much more meaning than having hime die in that cube just so we could have another crappy funeral scene.

I think I'd rather see a series that gives us happy endings and mortality. Because there's a point where having characters who never die and always get resurrected... it's just dishonest. That's not a happy ending, that's a lie.

The only way to beat that game is not play it at all. The solution is not to kill characters for good. The solution is to not kill characters and have their life take new courses. There is a choice other than ending. You can say Picard and the Enterprise-D crew here didn't get an ending, but rather an Un-Ending. And that's very fitting for TNG.

Which, y'know, whatever. "The Last Generation" was a fun episode and I enjoyed it. But I would have rather seen the salvation of the Federation, the heroes go on to live happy lives, new life in the form of the next next generation, alongside the death of Jean-Luc Picard. Because death is a part of life, no matter how much we pretend otherwise.

Why? So Picard could follow in Kirk's footsteps and die alone making a difference? That would have been a gross betrayal of the series after getting the crew back together. Maybe instead, Picard has a quiet death, 15 years from now, surrounded by loved ones, after spending the last leg of his life as a father, with the next-next generation having taken over anyway.

Just because the book is closed on Jean Luc Picard as captain of the USS Enterprise, doesn't mean the book is closed on Jean Luc Picard the man. The show did right by implying that it isn't. Because now we got a Picard who barkeeps for his friends, beats them at Poker, and (unless I misunderstood the photo in the after credits scene) marries Beverly Crusher finally.

 

[Sci]

Picard should have contacted the Klingons for help. They wouldn’t have been affected.

Or, alternately:

Just after the Titan's cloak is disabled and we think it's going to be destroyed by the Borgified Fleet... they're saved by a fleet of Romulan ships that decloak and take on the Borg fleet. Romulan ships sacrifice themselves to prevent the destruction of Spacedock and save Earth cities.

Why? Because even though the Federation once turned its back on the Romulan people, the Romulan people have seen the Federation change and aren't willing to turn their backs on the people of Earth. They will sacrifice to save the people of Earth in the way the Federation should have sacrificed to save the people of Romulus, because they know and love Jean-Luc Picard for everything he did for them.

And maybe Laris is in command of the Romulan fleet.

 

[NCC-73515]

These Borg are from the upside down

And when in action, the shuttlebays have the same sizes

Gold is so much better on black than dark gray!

And the cook had a white uniform

I wonder who President Chekov's mother was.

A little old lady from Leningrad.

 

[Scionz]

It wasn't retconned, please listen to what Q says to Jack after he mentions it.

Q did die, but the Q exist out of normal time, this is just Q before he died.

It's the non-retcon retcon. It's a non-retcon because Q dies in the future and this is a "past Q" which makes complete sense since he exists outside linear time. It's a retcon because "Q's BACK!" in the show's linear time, which is the only frame of reference that matters to us as viewers.

Matalas and co are very clever. Because killing Q in season 2 was stupid.

 

[KennyB]

I’ve never been a fan of “the fat one” but seeing her weaving around like the Millennium Falcon inside the 2nd Death Star…….was kinda cool and she looked way better being so agile. Silly but cool.

 

[Sci]

I wasn't referring to death in fiction in general. That's ancient. I'm referring to "stunt death", "shock death". That is new. It's started showing up in the late 90s and accelerated in 2000s. Walking Dead and Game of Thrones in the past 10 years made stunt death more common than ever to the point the motivating question in so many shows is"who dies?".

You like Stranger Things? The for the past two seasons the speculation has been on who dies (usually Hopper). For next season, it's all on Will or Hopper or Eleven. That is such a perverse thing to be normalized. Rather than speculate as to what events happen and what story is told, or why it happens the speculation is on whose story ends for good.

Not to make too much of a tanget, but I'm I'm not the first to observe there is something deeply amiss in our society with regards to life and death that is very different than how such things were regarded in the 1990s and 1980s. Particularly in the 1980s, there was much more a focus on life.

Also I disagree. There can be no death without life, and the other truly universal human experience is life. It's good this series ended on a note about life continuing on, with more life happening. Picard could have died. But now instead, he's a father. For the first time as he said, his life has something it was missing.

Well that's just it. They yank the death chain, then, in fiction that allows it, yanks the resurrection chain (or the cameo chain if they can't). Which makes death in fiction meaningless other than a stunt.



Hell no. Picard Season 1 and Season 2 were about that, but who gives a shit about those anymore. Picard Season 3 dismissed it all just as Shaw dismissed Jurati's Borg as "weird shit". It would have been lousy to return to Season 1/2 themes when Season 3 started with Picard moving from Earth to enter a new stage in his life. Even there, in the first episode, no longer about grief and mortality, but about opportunity and possibilities of life.

It would have been a violation of that promise in S3E1, to end on a note any different than Picard, in the shuttle with Beverly and his son, seeing the Enterprise G. Picard's days as a Starfleet Captain and Admiral are over, but now he gets to live out his life in a new adventure: a father.

That has so much more meaning than having hime die in that cube just so we could have another crappy funeral scene.



The only way to beat that game is not play it at all. The solution is not to kill characters for good. The solution is to not kill characters and have their life take new courses. There is a choice other than ending. You can say Picard and the Enterprise-D crew here didn't get an ending, but rather an Un-Ending. And that's very fitting for TNG.


Why? So Picard could follow in Kirk's footsteps and die alone making a difference? That would have been a gross betrayal of the series after getting the crew back together. Maybe instead, Picard has a quiet death, 15 years from now, surrounded by loved ones, after spending the last leg of his life as a father, with the next-next generation having taken over anyway.

Just because the book is closed on Jean Luc Picard as captain of the USS Enterprise, doesn't mean the book is closed on Jean Luc Picard the man. The show did right by implying that it isn't. Because now we got a Picard who barkeeps for his friends, beats them at Poker, and (unless I misunderstood the photo in the after credits scene) marries Beverly Crusher finally.

While I agree with you that "stunt deaths" are vastly overused, I don't think the solution there is to not kill characters. I think the solution there is to only kill characters when doing so actually enhances the story, and to not resurrect characters except very rarely.

Other than that -- I think you and I are looking for fundamentally different thematic content. I'm looking for thematic unity across all three seasons of Star Trek: Picard and for a continuation of the themes of finding meaning in spite of death, and so for me the best way to achieve that thematic unity and bring thematic completion of the series is for it to end with Jean-Luc Picard's death. Same way Six Feet Under pretty much had to end with Nate's death and the deaths of the entire Fischer family.

 

[dinzy]

Then don't worry, Q is still dead/will die.

The one we saw in the credits scene is just him from before he died, He says just as much to Jack.

minor Nit, he used the classic/cliched you think so linear. He knows he died and probably even has that experience, but is still alive too. Assuming this is Q before he died is too linear. For all we know he made himself die to experience it in S2 and death is not the end for a Q or died because the universe ended and just lived his death out as shown in S2, but since the continuum experiences all of time including multiple timelines, we only really know that a version of Q said he was dying and then disappeared.

 

[Scionz]

These Borg are from the upside down
Gold is so much better on black than dark gray!

I was hoping they would do that in Season 2 to signify moving past the 12 year insular era. I imagine they didn't in Season 3 because they made a ton of combade props in season 1 and it saved money keeping them as is for season 2 and 3, before making a half a dozen for the closing moments of Season 3.

But I'm glad they waited, because in a way, it's fitting the change came after the Final Defeat of the borg. The 37 year crisis began in System J-25 in 2364 when Starfleet was knocked out of it's 70 year, post-Khitomer complacency where they felt so safe as to put families on Starships. What followed was Wolf 359, then immensely destructive Dominion War and the Borg Attack of 2372. Then the Romulan upheaval of the 2379. Then The Romulan Supernova crisis of the 2380s. Then the insular era. And then the return of the Borg in 2401. It was a gauntlet. It forced Starfleet to militarize like it hadn't in a century. Millions of Starfleet officers died. Entire planets were ravaged.

Really, it could only be bookended with the return of the Changeling sot the Alpha Quadrant, and the final defeat of the Borg Collective. And now the long crisis is over. So hopefully, the Comebadge change presages a return to an optimistic era of peaceful exploration for Starfleet.