Spoilers On Seven and sexuality

Discussion in 'Star Trek: Picard' started by rfmcdpei, Feb 22, 2020.

  1. rfmcdpei

    rfmcdpei Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    I know that I am not alone in reading, in the particular intensity of the exchanges between Seven of Nine and Bjayzl in "Stardust City Rag", hints of a past intimate relationship. It would have been nice, to be sure, if they had come out and said what they were hinting at; but then, they were not covering up much.

    A canonically queer Seven of Nine would be huge news. I never read the Seven/Janeway relationship through a slash lens; that relationship seemed much more maternal to me than anything else. In any event, I did not and do not think it likely that an adult Janeway would want to take advantage of a younger and much more vulnerable Seven.

    All that said, I do think that Seven not being straight might indeed work. The Borg Collective us hugely flawed, but homophobia likely does not tank as one of those issues. Whatever Seven's orientation, I do not see her as likely to be any more intimidated or inhibited re: a same-sex relationship than an opposite-sex one. She certainly would not stand for others intimidating her.

    (If Seven had in Bjayzl a horrid ex, well, Picard technically can claim the Borg Queen. We can all be unlucky.)

    Thoughts? Are there any bits from Voyager that you think might support a non-heterosexual Seven of Nine? What did you think it the episode? Where would you like this to be taken in the future?
     
  2. The Old Mixer

    The Old Mixer Mih ssim, mih ssim, nam, daed si Xim. Moderator

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    I think they spelled it out as much as they needed to for this episode's purposes. It could be something we see more of in return appearances by Seven, but I could also see her as having been burnt by that relationship so badly that she might have long-term intimacy issues.
     
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  3. Tuskin38

    Tuskin38 Admiral Admiral

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    I honestly didn't get the impression that they were a couple, but just close friends.
     
  4. rfmcdpei

    rfmcdpei Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    I read it as "friends", FWIW.

    Quite. Her sexuality is not likely to form a major part of an arc, but as background ... ?
     
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  5. cosmic mouse

    cosmic mouse Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Same here and then I rewatched the ep... no doubt in my mind now.

    Honestly, this makes me like the character of Seven even more (as if that were possible )... pushing more boundaries, and still kicking ass. I just regret that the VOY writers producers didn't have the cohones to push this angle back in the late 90s.
     
    Last edited: Feb 26, 2020
  6. Hythlodeus

    Hythlodeus Commodore Commodore

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    eh, Berman was pretty hands on on that show. The writers could have had all the balls in the world, Berman wouldn't have agreed.
     
  7. JoeZhang

    JoeZhang Vice Admiral Admiral

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    While I cannot see that as anything but a conversation between ex-lovers.
     
  8. The Old Mixer

    The Old Mixer Mih ssim, mih ssim, nam, daed si Xim. Moderator

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    OTOH, even somebody with intimacy issues might still indulge in intimacy-free one-night stands, if they were inclined to show rather than tell in a future appearance.
     
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  9. Hythlodeus

    Hythlodeus Commodore Commodore

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    agreed. I had almost the same dialogue - word for word - with my ex a couple of years ago.


    What can I say, I needed an eye
     
  10. Guy Gardener

    Guy Gardener Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    In the 1940s, earlier, a woman in a tuxedo is gay.

    It's a given conceit.

    Therefore Janeway who wore a white tux, and Seven were "probably" lovers in the holographic WWII scenario during the episode The Killing Game, since they were living together and French.
     
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  11. Doctor Bombay

    Doctor Bombay Captain Premium Member

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    Sorry, I didn't get any impression other than they were close friends.
     
  12. Ronald Held

    Ronald Held Vice Admiral Admiral

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    I am not certain that Seven can have initimate relations, physchologicall and physically.
     
  13. bookworm8571

    bookworm8571 Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    I think the subtext could be read in different ways, either a sexual relationship that ended in the worst kind of betrayal or a best friend who did the same. Seven of Nine would have been still fairly young and probably vulnerable and at loose ends after returning from the Delta Quadrant when she encountered “Jay.” A best friend who used and manipulated her and killed Icheb could have done as much damage as a lover who did the same. I assume the unfortunate relationship with Chakotay was over as soon as it began.

    As far as whether she is capable of sex, I would assume it’s possible. About 20 percent of her body contains Borg implants and other body parts have been regenerated. When the lizard was mentioning the parts of her body with implants, he did not mention reproductive organs.
     
    Last edited: Feb 22, 2020
  14. Khan Jr

    Khan Jr Lieutenant Red Shirt

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    Given Bjayzl's personality, I think she would have taunted Seven about a sexual relationship if they'd had one. She was trying to be as cruel to Seven as possible in the handcuffs scene and if she had intimate ammo she should have fired it.
     
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  15. The Old Mixer

    The Old Mixer Mih ssim, mih ssim, nam, daed si Xim. Moderator

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    I thought she kind of was taunting Seven, but subtly.
     
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  16. Guy Gardener

    Guy Gardener Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Remember Silence in the library?

    The Doctor says something like "My name, how did you know my name... I would only tell you my real name if I... "

    That lady turned out to be his fricking wife.
     
  17. Guy Gardener

    Guy Gardener Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    In the final episode of Voyager, Seven's cortical-implant (which used to be Icheb's cortical implant) was removed because it was an emotional limiter booby trap.

    To much joy from sex would make her brain blow up.

    The Doctor made her sex ready, and volunteered his services for that sex, which she declined.

    Alternatively she "offered" to bang Harry's lights out in Revulsion, which was very early season 4.

    I think it was a trick, that she was trying to make the scared little boy run away, but if the scared little boy had not run away, and she backed up her joke with grit, then they would have bumped fuzzies and Seven's cortical limiter would have exploded her brain, and Kes would have been allowed back.
     
  18. The Old Mixer

    The Old Mixer Mih ssim, mih ssim, nam, daed si Xim. Moderator

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    I haven't seen that episode since not long after its original broadcast, so my memory is very hazy...tell me this is just Guy being Guy... :crazy:
     
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  19. Guy Gardener

    Guy Gardener Fleet Admiral Admiral

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  20. Longinus

    Longinus Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Yeah, the EMH was a disgusting creep.
     
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