I agree with your assessment that it was the right call because at the time it seemed like he had deliberately set up his own capture. So with that being said, was it really all that out of character for Ward to kill him? Ward kills people all the time when they are an immediate threat and there is no other options. He's a tactical guy, it's his job, it's what he's trained to do. Considering letting him go wasn't an option and the situation seemed to indicate that taking him into custody was just part of his plan, is this really that different?
Agents of SHIELD. Season 1 Discussion Thread
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I agree with your assessment that it was the right call because at the time it seemed like he had deliberately set up his own capture. So with that being said, was it really all that out of character for Ward to kill him? Ward kills people all the time when they are an immediate threat and there is no other options. He's a tactical guy, it's his job, it's what he's trained to do. Considering letting him go wasn't an option and the situation seemed to indicate that taking him into custody was just part of his plan, is this really that different?
I don't think that was his call, though. Although that certainly seemed to be his argument when deflecting whether he was acting under orders.
Yeah, that was why I discounted the talk about it being non-lethal. But upon rewatching it, I could see that the gun had the blue markings. If I'd been showrunner and wanted the rounds really to be night-night rounds, I wouldn't make it do that to the glass, but whatev.
It was a non-lethal weapon, but she fired with the intent of hitting him in the chest and head, not just a round in the centre of mass. For someone with her skill and training, that certainly looked like it was meant as a kill shot.
Have they ever said what two doses of that toxin will do? Presumably there's a limit to what a body can take.
Have they ever said what two doses of that toxin will do? Presumably there's a limit to what a body can take.
I think you're overthinking it
How is that over thinking? A small shot of morphine will dull pain and make you feel fuzzy. A somewhat larger shot will knock you out and a big one will shut your lungs down and kill you. Whatever is in those guns, at a certain point, there's bound to be a lethal reaction.
Did she grab the icer because she didn't intend to kill, or because it was the only weapon to hand and a safely unconscious person is much easier to kill.
Look at it logically. What was her end-game intent here? Fitz found something he shouldn't have, so she knocks him out...and then what? If he comes to then she's still outed. The flip side of that of course is what to do if she did manage to kill him? Stage an accident and hope the others buy it? Dump the body out a hatch and play dumb?
One thing is certain though, there's more going on than we know here. Personally my money is still on her being Fury's eyes and ears.
Did she grab the icer because she didn't intend to kill, or because it was the only weapon to hand and a safely unconscious person is much easier to kill.
Look at it logically. What was her end-game intent here? Fitz found something he shouldn't have, so she knocks him out...and then what? If he comes to then she's still outed. The flip side of that of course is what to do if she did manage to kill him? Stage an accident and hope the others buy it? Dump the body out a hatch and play dumb?
One thing is certain though, there's more going on than we know here. Personally my money is still on her being Fury's eyes and ears.
In the real world you're absolutely right. What I think he meant by "over thinking it" is I think you're over thinking how much thought the production people put into where those shots into the glass were placed and what the effect of using two rounds would do to a person.
This seems to be a very standard bait and switch on setting up May as the bad guy.
dansigal described what I meant perfectly so I have very little to add. I will say that I also try to avoid putting too much weight on television visuals because they don't have anywhere near the amount of time movies do to make sure things look as intended.
Right. The point of the scene was to make us think that May was shooting at Fitz with lethal intent. Also, more basically, it needed to convey visually that the glass had been struck by two shots. It's well-known how film and TV tend to exaggerate the effects of bullet hits (e.g. having them spark against metal) so that they'll be visible to the audience; this was another example of the same kind of poetic license.
Wait, where again was the Bus coming from in the final minutes? Wasn't it coming from Thomas Nash's "secret" hideout in Pensacola, Florida and going to the Triskelion in D.C.? Cause it was nighttime when the Bus changed directions, but it was daytime in that ending preview scene where Fury was in D.C. in The Winter Soldier.
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She says that it's "an icer"... the bullet impacts aren't bullet impacts, its the ice bullets shattering on the glass. watch it again kids
edit: see the episode "Seeds"
She says that it's "an icer"... the bullet impacts aren't bullet impacts, its the ice bullets shattering on the glass. watch it again kids
edit: see the episode "Seeds"
Actually, the ICEr is an upgraded night-night gun, introduced in the episode "Yes Men" (see the episode "Yes Men"). The ICE part is just an acronym. Maybe it is just the cartridge shattering on the glass, but that doesn't make it any less confusing.
But, "kids"? Really?
She says that it's "an icer"... the bullet impacts aren't bullet impacts, its the ice bullets shattering on the glass. watch it again kids
edit: see the episode "Seeds"
But, "kids"? Really?
Yeah, ixnay on the condescensionay there sunshine.
You're probably right. I just thought the placement of the impact shatters seemed quite deliberate.
Still, the logical problem on just what May thought was going to happen next had the glass not been in the way stands, but I suppose that's academic now.
If Ward is working for Hand and flying the ship back, why would she order to kill him?
Haven't we seen the agents shoot others in the head before? Plus, Fitz shot that guy on the train multiple times. I think he designed it (with comic book rules) to be non-lethal in any case.
Maybe it was a flashback to while they were apprehending/killing the Clairvoyant. Also, they must have been taking Ward somewhere else (maybe the Sandbox).
Maybe May thinks Fitz is the bad guy. Her and Coulson are generally on the same wave length. While he was putting it all together, she may have been doing the same. She tries to report to Fury (considering she's on the good side) and Fitz cuts her connection? Her endgame would probably be interrogation. From her point of view, Fitz had no reason to fiddle with those wires in the first place.
^Is he a well-known Marvel artist?
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