Agents of SHIELD. Season 1 Discussion Thread

[Guy Gardener]

Everyone who bought the Avengers on DVD, will buy Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. on DVD.

If they sell out in the first day, and then have to print another 4 million units to match demand, I do believe that Marvel Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. can get a zero from the Nielsons and continue being made fearlessly.

 

[Out Of My Vulcan Mind]

Everyone who bought the Avengers on DVD, will buy Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. on DVD.

DVD/Blu-ray sales may be good enough to help the show, but they won't come anywhere close to those of The Avengers.

 

[CorporalCaptain]

Regarding their decision not to use non-lethal weapons, the non-lethal weapons haven't been established as being designed for use as close-quarters assault weapons. The night-night gun has been used as a sniper weapon and pistol, but never as something which might have to hose down an enemy's position with overwhelming firepower while exposed to lethal return fire. Further, even if they'd had the right weapons and the dozens of rounds needed, as non-lethal rounds, by definition night-night gun rounds aren't armor-piercing. Going into a death box, the SHIELD team can't be faulted for refusing to handicap their chances of survival.

It's a further declaration that the SHIELD team members aren't superheroes.

No, but they could have brought both, and used lethal force only if necessary.

When I played Doom II, I loved to go around with all my gear and full ammo, too. All seven or eight of my weapons slung on my back in some sort of bag of holding. It was a blast. Whatever weapon I wanted was always just a keystroke away, and no penalty for carrying all that load either.

OK, I'll try it this way then. If it makes you happy to assume that Ward had a night-night pistol stashed on his body somewhere, so be it. He's a tough guy, used to carrying lots of gear, so he was carrying one of those, too. Thing is, a situation never came up when it was the right weapon to use, when he was sure he could get off a good shot with it without getting killed. Better?

 

[The Old Mixer]

Everyone who bought the Avengers on DVD, will buy Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. on DVD.

As someone who bought The Avengers on DVD, I beg to differ.

 

[Christopher]

Universal owns Namor, not Fox. I'm pretty sure he's his own franchise. But, yeah, not Marvel. Whether that means all Atlanteans, though, is a different issue.

Here's a nice handy infographic for reference:

http://comicsalliance.com/marvel-character-film-rights-infographic/

 

[Guy Gardener]

Looking at that, I remembered that Namor is also a mutant and a member of the X-Men.

 

[Alidar Jarok]

It's neat, but it's only helpful with major characters. Once you start debating which character, who has appeared across the multiverse, belongs to which universe, things get far more uncertain.

Some of those are random. Both Namor and the Man-Thing are characters where I haven't heard anything about a movie, but there's no sign of them being returned. Others had movies (that failed) and are now back with Marvel. I'm assuming the license system isn't "it's better to have not tried at all than to have tried and failed."

 

[LaxScrutiny]

Regarding their decision not to use non-lethal weapons, the non-lethal weapons haven't been established as being designed for use as close-quarters assault weapons. The night-night gun has been used as a sniper weapon and pistol, but never as something which might have to hose down an enemy's position with overwhelming firepower while exposed to lethal return fire. Further, even if they'd had the right weapons and the dozens of rounds needed, as non-lethal rounds, by definition night-night gun rounds aren't armor-piercing. Going into a death box, the SHIELD team can't be faulted for refusing to handicap their chances of survival.

It's a further declaration that the SHIELD team members aren't superheroes.

No, but they could have brought both, and used lethal force only if necessary.

When I played Doom II, I loved to go around with all my gear and full ammo, too. All seven or eight of my weapons slung on my back in some sort of bag of holding. It was a blast. Whatever weapon I wanted was always just a keystroke away, and no penalty for carrying all that load either.

OK, I'll try it this way then. If it makes you happy to assume that Ward had a night-night pistol stashed on his body somewhere, so be it. He's a tough guy, used to carrying lots of gear, so he was carrying one of those, too. Thing is, a situation never came up when it was the right weapon to use, when he was sure he could get off a good shot with it without getting killed. Better?

Did those two security guards they murdered have families who loved them?

 

[Alidar Jarok]

Probably. Maybe they have children too who didn't know what their dads did for a living, which was to guard a facility that performed experiments involving untold suffering for whatever that thing is that was in that tube. Hell, they possibly didn't know either and were just unwitting accomplices to a facility of extreme moral questionability. However, as accomplices, they still followed orders unquestioningly, which included firing on those who came offering a peaceful resolution without any attempt to resolve it without bloodshed.

They were doing their job. Coulson was doing his job. The better shooters won. Is there really anything else that can be added to this damn conversation? I think all sides have said all that can be possibly said. It's a shame Bob is dead. I bet Coulson wishes he wasn't. I'm not sure Garrett feels the same way. Hell, I'm not sure Fitz feels the same way because he's seemed kind of cold-blooded at times as well.

ETA: Would it make a difference if it was a HYDRA facility?

 

[Alidar Jarok]

Doublepost because look what I found:

Not the same insignia, but certainly similarities.

 

[Mr Light]

What's the picture on the right? Is that a version of Ronan the Accuser?

 

[Guy Gardener]

I'm assuming the license system isn't "it's better to have not tried at all than to have tried and failed."

The licence system is this... As long as you're still using it, it's yours. If you go X amount of time without using it, it reverts to the original owners.

Companies will put out a shitty movie, direct to video, whatever, to keep the rights, because, one, they may have plans for down the road, or two, they might be able to resell the rights (or partial rights, or limited rights, or short term rights.) for a packet to someone who thinks they can do something with those rights.

 

[Out Of My Vulcan Mind]

The licence system is this... As long as you're still using it, it's yours. If you go X amount of time without using it, it reverts to the original owners.

True, but the length of time and the exact terms vary widely depending on the contract signed. Some of the film rights contracts Marvel signed when they were in dire economic condition were lousy from their point of view. Universal has had the rights to Namor for years and years without making any use of them, yet the rights haven't reverted. That contract must be very favorable to Universal.

 

[Greg Cox]

I'm assuming the license system isn't "it's better to have not tried at all than to have tried and failed."

The licence system is this... As long as you're still using it, it's yours. If you go X amount of time without using it, it reverts to the original owners.

Companies will put out a shitty movie, direct to video, whatever, to keep the rights, because, one, they may have plans for down the road, or two, they might be able to resell the rights (or partial rights, or limited rights, or short term rights.) for a packet to someone who thinks they can do something with those rights.

Hell, Warren Beatty is still holding onto the rights to Dick Tracy because he says he might do a sequel someday . . ..

 

[Out Of My Vulcan Mind]

^^^
He won a lawsuit to keep the rights, too. From Deadline at the time:

U.S. District Judge Dean Pregerson granted summary judgment in the producer/director/actor’s favor yesterday, ruling that the fact Beatty had begun work on a half-hour TV special, which had Warren dressed as the Dick Tracy character answering questions from film critic Leonard Maltin, satisfied a use-it-or-lose-it clause in an agreement with Tribune to produce a Dick Tracy movie or TV show or lose the rights to the character.

 

[Non Sync]

No, but they could have brought both, and used lethal force only if necessary.

When I played Doom II, I loved to go around with all my gear and full ammo, too. All seven or eight of my weapons slung on my back in some sort of bag of holding. It was a blast. Whatever weapon I wanted was always just a keystroke away, and no penalty for carrying all that load either.

OK, I'll try it this way then. If it makes you happy to assume that Ward had a night-night pistol stashed on his body somewhere, so be it. He's a tough guy, used to carrying lots of gear, so he was carrying one of those, too. Thing is, a situation never came up when it was the right weapon to use, when he was sure he could get off a good shot with it without getting killed. Better?

Did those two security guards they murdered have families who loved them?

One of the Austin Powers' movies had a deleted scene where friends of a guard who was killed (run over by a steam roller) learn that he won't be coming to his party.

 

[Guy Gardener]

Not a deleted scene, unless America got a less fantastic version than the real world.

 

[CorporalCaptain]

Did those two security guards they murdered have families who loved them?

The value of someone's life isn't a function of whether they have a family. Murder is a legal term, and it's an open question whether they were murdered.

 

[Guy Gardener]

I was pretty sure that's how Oliver felt in Arrow during season one when he would kill 30 henchmen to get close enough to put a good scare into the dirtbag villain who failed his city.

Killing billionaires is more immoral than killing henchmen.

 

[Mr. Adventure]

Not a deleted scene, unless America got a less fantastic version than the real world.

In America the theatrical release didn't have those scenes but the DVD has the steamroller scene. I believe however that there is another such scene in deleted scenes and/or Euro version.

EDIT: Actually this details a lot of differences.
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0118655/alternateversions

EDIT: As does this:
http://www.movie-censorship.com/report.php?ID=531109
Interestingly, looks like the US is 1.85 ratio and international has 2.35 widescreen. Not sure if that's true of later/blu-ray releases or not.