Spoilers Star Trek: Strange New Worlds 3x03 - "Shuttle to Kenfori"

[Nerys Myk]

The eyebrows don't help. When Rebecca Romijn first stepped on screen in the role way back on Discovery, she resembled Majel's Number One with dark hair and her own natural look.

Now the eyebrows and hair are really unflattering. Maybe the character is embracing the alien but this week it was distracting.

Other than that...solid horror episode with some good bits for M'Benga.

I'm happy to see Ortegas' PTSD fallout begin to take hold.

She needed her hair tied up for the Zero G scene. I'm sure it will be back to her normal style next episode.

 

[Therin of Andor]

Not a big zombie person either.

They've been done to death.

True enough.

I did quite enjoy this. A much higher percentage of yelling at the screen. "He's behind you!"

I have mostly avoided zombies, and was never tempted even when a star of "The Walking Dead" became the lead in a Star Trek series!

There there was "Spock's Brainssssssss".

And this parody:


"Night of the Living Trekkies" (Quirk 2010) by Ian McLean, on Flickr
by Kevin David Anderson & Sam Stall.


Zombie McCoy from IDW's "Infestation" by Ian McLean, on Flickr


Skele Treks by Ian McLean, on Flickr

I really like Captain Marie Batel. No wonder Pike loves her. So far she keeps escaping certain death.

 

[Pauln6]

What is the "above that" response?

I suppose I mean Corbomite Manoeuvre, Arena, Savage Curtain, Devil in the Dark, etc where knee jerk emotional, revenge-based reactions are shown to be wrong, compared to say Balance of Terror, where they are painted into a corner but the responsibility weighs heavily.

Of course, there is also the order to murder civilians in a Taste of Armageddon but I think most people think that's so heinous, it must have been code...

 

[Tosk]

She needed her hair tied up for the Zero G scene. I'm sure it will be back to her normal style next episode.

And as we all know, there's only one "tied up" hairstyle, so they had no choice but to make her look like that.

 

[Ssosmcin]

It's funny how much hair suddenly matters in Trek, beginning with Mount Mount. The next Trek musical should be called Hair.

Oh, please, it's mattered since Shatner showed up with a curly black wig in the first movie.

 

[Mudd]

Of course, there is also the order to murder civilians in a Taste of Armageddon but I think most people think that's so heinous, it must have been code...

And yet, it wasn't.

 

[Nerys Myk]

And as we all know, there's only one "tied up" hairstyle, so they had no choice but to make her look like that.

Uhura and La’An took the good ones. You gotta show up early.

 

[fireproof78]

I suppose I mean Corbomite Manoeuvre, Arena, Savage Curtain, Devil in the Dark, etc where knee jerk emotional, revenge-based reactions are shown to be wrong, compared to say Balance of Terror, where they are painted into a corner but the responsibility weighs heavily.

Of course, there is also the order to murder civilians in a Taste of Armageddon but I think most people think that's so heinous, it must have been code...

Except revenge isn't always show to be wrong. See Friday's Child.

 

[Nerys Myk]

Except revenge isn't always show to be wrong. See Friday's Child.

#RIPBobTheDiscountKlingon

 

[Jedman67]

I gave this episode a 7. The acting was fantastic, I really enjoyed seeing M'Benga and Pike have a heart to heart mission.
I liked how there were repercussions from last season.
BUUUUT

Klingons
Zombies
Batel still not well. Just heal her or kill her off for pete's sake
Pike mansplaining her dying
Stitched together plot reminiscent of TNG S2. (If we turn off the lights, they won't be able to see us.)

I dunno, maybe i was hot (no AC by the TV) or tired but I had to force myself to focus. Glad there wasn't a space battle with the Klingon ship or I would have given it a 5.

 

[Noname Given]

I suppose I mean Corbomite Manoeuvre, Arena, Savage Curtain, Devil in the Dark, etc where knee jerk emotional, revenge-based reactions are shown to be wrong, compared to say Balance of Terror, where they are painted into a corner but the responsibility weighs heavily.

Of course, there is also the order to murder civilians in a Taste of Armageddon but I think most people think that's so heinous, it must have been code...

I think you need to rewatch TOS S1 The Corbomite Maneuver, (my absolute favorite and #1 STAR TREK franchise episode still to this day) as there is no 'knee-jerk" reaction by Kirk or anyone else. they destroy the Space Buoy only after trying everything to first run away from it, and only when the radiation it emits reaches lethal levels.

And when they real away from the alien ship, once Kirk learns its in distress and its life support systems are failing he beams over to help (even after being under threat of total destruction) to find it was all a test to find how Humans really are; and that he passed to the point diplomatic contact is wanted/can begin.

But up until that point, it's the First Federation that is showing itself as overly aggressive.

 

[Fateor]

I just assumed in those situations that Starfleet had been informed (it would've been bloody hard to keep it a secret from them) and decided no further action was necessary, due to 1 and 2 being Klingon business, and 3 being Klingon business that was going to get everyone killed by the Dominion if it wasn't resolved quickly.

If M'Benga had admitted what he did, Pike had reported it to Starfleet

Picard might have informed Starfleet about his.

But there's no way Sisko told them about Jadzia and the Albino hunt, and I doubt he told them about his encouraging of Worf either.

 

[Pauln6]

I think you need to rewatch TOS S1 The Corbomite Maneuver, (my absolute favorite and #1 STAR TREK franchise episode still to this day) as there is no 'knee-jerk" reaction by Kirk or anyone else. they destroy the Space Buoy only after trying everything to first run away from it, and only when the radiation it emits reaches lethal levels.

And when they real away from the alien ship, once Kirk learns its in distress and its life support systems are failing he beams over to help (even after being under threat of total destruction) to find it was all a test to find how Humans really are; and that he passed to the point diplomatic contact is wanted/can begin.

But up until that point, it's the First Federation that is showing itself as overly aggressive.

That's what I meant. In the face of aggression Kirk wasn't all, that radiation was going to kill us, eat my torpedoes. I meant more that Bailey's knee jerk emotional reaction was clearly portrayed as inappropriate and unhelpful.

 

[Ray Hardgrit]

But there's no way Sisko told them about Jadzia and the Albino hunt, and I doubt he told them about his encouraging of Worf either.

Sisko might have actually discussed the Worf thing with Starfleet (or Admiral Ross at least) before he told him to do it. Starfleet was aware of his plan In The Pale Moonlight, he tends to keep them in the loop about this stuff.

 

[Pauln6]

And yet, it wasn't.

Quite. Just like we never saw Maltz again because Kirk clearly carried out his threat to "kill you later ".

Also, the reason why Kirk was able to play evil Kirk for so long in Mirror Mirror was because the Federation also has general orders to massacre civilian populations from orbit.

Except revenge isn't always show to be wrong. See Friday's Child.

It's not one of my favourite episodes and I don't recall that being the message of the episode, so you might have to help me on that one. I do recall there was a strong thread of respecting the traditions, laws, and culture of an alien civilisation except where it was being influenced by outside enemies.

 

[fireproof78]

not one of my favourite episodes and I don't recall that being the message of the episode, so you might have to help me on that one. I do recall there was a strong thread of respecting the traditions, laws, and culture of an alien civilisation except where it was being influenced by outside enemies.

KIRK: There's just one thing I want.
SPOCK: The Klingon?
KIRK: One of us must get him.
SPOCK: Revenge, Captain?
KIRK: Why not?

 

[Pauln6]

KIRK: There's just one thing I want.
SPOCK: The Klingon?
KIRK: One of us must get him.
SPOCK: Revenge, Captain?
KIRK: Why not?

Thanks! I'm unconvinced by the simplistic interpretation of that exchange. Kirk has a very strong streak of deadpan gallows humour so that you shouldn't take everything he says at face value. There is also a lot more at stake than mere revenge on that mission. The Klingon presence is an immediate, if indirect, threat to the landing party and to the Federation on many levels. If he gains a foothold of trust among the population, the Federation loses an important asset. It's not a case of revenge for revenge's sake, it's an alignment of goals.

 

[fireproof78]

Thanks! I'm unconvinced by the simplistic interpretation of that exchange. Kirk has a very strong streak of deadpan gallows humour so that you shouldn't take everything he says at face value. There is also a lot more at stake than mere revenge on that mission. The Klingon presence is an immediate, if indirect, threat to the landing party and to the Federation on many levels. If he gains a foothold of trust among the population, the Federation loses an important asset. It's not a case of revenge for revenge's sake, it's an alignment of goals.

To an extent but Kirk is very direct and it's in the battle situation so I'm inclined towards face value in this instance.

 

[Mudd]

Quite. Just like we never saw Maltz again because Kirk clearly carried out his threat to "kill you later ".

Sorry, but you ought to watch the episode again.

At no point, no matter who Kirk is talking to, is there any suggestion that the order in question is a "code" or not real.

And in fact, when challenged by Anan 7 to the effect that General Order 24 exemplifies human savagery, Kirk acknowledges that as truth and uses it to further his point about rising above our natures.

How much of a hypocrite and fraud do you assume Kirk to be?

All you're doing is making up excuses to ignore a significant story point that stands uncontradicted within the onscreen narrative, because the inconsistency with other more "ideal" portrayals of the Federation apparently makes you uncomfortable. Go right ahead and do that, if you like.

But you're not making a valid argument for the claim by finding anything within the narrative itself to support it.

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[Pauln6]

Sorry, but you ought to watch the episode again.

At no point, no matter who Kirk is talking to, is there any suggestion that the order in question is a "code" or not real.

And in fact, when challenged by Anan 7 to the effect that General Order 24 exemplifies human savagery, Kirk acknowledges that as truth and uses it to further his point about rising above our natures.

How much of a hypocrite and fraud do you assume Kirk to be?

All you're doing is making up excuses to ignore a significant story point that stands uncontradicted within the onscreen narrative, because the inconsistency with other more "ideal" portrayals of the Federation apparently makes you uncomfortable. Go right ahead and do that, if you like.

But you're not making a valid argument for the claim by finding anything within the narrative itself to support it.

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Inconsistent writing has always existed. I'm not ignoring it, I'm attempting to rationalise an extreme inconsistency. The USA wasn't, and still isn't, renowned for its commitment to human rights - that much has become even more obvious in recent times. Trek was always intended to represent something better. If the writers get sloppy and revert to good, old-fashioned colonialist attitudes, instinctive prejudice, or comfortable sexism, I don't give in and assume those were deliberately intended to be part of the fabric of Star Trek. I try to rationalise them. The creators of Star Trek could not have been clearer about their overall intentions.

I admit, I would love to see the notes on this particular plot element. A general order allowing captains to unilaterally order attacks on civilian infrastructure. It's a war crime now. To suggest that the value of intelligent life had become so cheapened that it would be acceptable in a utopian future...? Why do we even need Section 31? Clearly, it was at worst an error of judgement on the part of the writers or it was not intended to be taken at face value.

Memory Alpha's take:

"Kirk invokes General Order 24, which if carried out would have destroyed the entire planet's population. It's unclear if this invocation was a bluff or not. It is also unclear if the order is permitted as a retaliatory action (as the Enterprise was attacked first), and if so, there's no indication that the disproportionate nature of the retaliation (which would have resulted in many millions of casualties and genocide of an entire culture) was ever discussed by the Enterprise crew."