Spoilers Star Trek: Strange New Worlds 2x03 - "Tomorrow and Tomorrow and Tomorrow"

[josiephine]

I am curious how the hell Memory Alpha is going to square this circle, though.

I mean, they even treated that post-credits scene from The Trouble With Edward as if it literally was within continuity for awhile.

I wouldn't have it any other way. Bless them.

 

[Farscape One]

John Billingsley is on the record and on camera saying that the Crewman Rostov transporter accident in "Strange New World" that had rocks and native foliage from the planet stuck in his body and protruding from his skin should have been a far more serious or even lethal accident to convey to the viewers that the transporter at this stage in its history was a scary piece of equipment that might well kill you. But the suits wanted to play things as safe as possible to avoid angering the audience.

I thought it was Scott Bakula who insisted on not having any of his crew killed so early in the series? He wanted the show to not be victim of 'redshirt syndrome', where a crewman dies and there's no mention of it or is just casually dismissed as just another day at the office.

(Which would explain why no one on Enterprise dies until season 3's "ANOMALY", where at least the nature of their mission makes it impossible for deaths NOT to occur.)


(Side footnote: Archer and Sisko were actually the safest captains to serve under. The first crew members to die under either of their commands was in the third season of their respective shows. Kirk: well, the term 'redshirt' started here. Picard: nearly all the crew who died in TNG were actually ON the Enterprise instead of an away mission or something. Janeway: despite the stated number of the crew constantly being 148-150 in every season, the amount of crew killed should have ended her total with around 135 people at the end... but then, it's hard to expect them to keep that straight when they can't keep a proper torpedo count.)

 

[Citiprime]

I am curious how the hell Memory Alpha is going to square this circle, though.

I mean, they even treated that post-credits scene from The Trouble With Edward as if it literally was within continuity for awhile.

For right now, they're classifying this as "a revised 2022 timeline" caused by temporal wars.

 

[Guy Gardener]

Doesn't moving Khan forward a few decades just make the story possibilities better. Why wouldn't fans like this?

I'm OK with this being a Prime-variant timeline.

1. Project Khan in the 70s or 80s, fertilized an ovum and then re-sequenced the DNA, to make a super fetus, that was grown inside a tank, or a college student to produce a superbaby, that grew up to be a sexist dick who ruled a quarter of Asia.

2. Project Khan in the 70s or 80s, fertilized an ovum and then re-sequenced the DNA, and then put that ovum in the freezer and waited 40 to 50 years until they grew it inside a tank, or a college student to produce a superbaby, that grew up to be a homicidal maniac torturer who ruled a quarter of Asia.

3. Project Khan in the 70s or 80s, shut down its offices, burned all it's genetic samples, was annotated as a footnote in black ops history, then 40 to 50 years later, started back up from square one, finding new genetic samples, from completely different people, fertilized an ovum and then re-sequenced the DNA, to make a different super fetus, that was grown inside a tank, or a college student to produce a new superbaby, that grew up to be a homicidal maniac torturer who ruled a quarter of Asia.

 

[Tuskin38]

I still think that this is the timline following the events of First Contact ... everything from there on is an alternate timeline. Enterprise, the Temporal Cold War, Discovery, Strange New Worlds ... it all changed with the interference of the Borg and the Enterprise-E during First Contact!

Nope. Because Voyager references the events of First Contact, and the borg signal sent out from ENT: Regeneration is why there are borg in the Beta Quadrant in TNG/Pre-TNG

Also going with your theory, that would mean the Enterprise-E returned to an alternate timeline.

 

[Ovation]

1. Project Khan in the 70s or 80s, fertilized an ovum and then re-sequenced the DNA, to make a super fetus, that was grown inside a tank, or a college student to produce a superbaby, that grey up to be a sexist dick who ruled a quarter of Asia.

2. Project Khan in the 70s or 80s, fertilized an ovum and then re-sequenced the DNA, and then put that ovum in the freezer and waited 40 to 50 years until they grew it inside a tank, or a college student to produce a superbaby, that grew up to be a homicidal maniac torturer who ruled a quarter of Asia.

3. Project Khan in the 70s or 80s, shut down its offices, burned all it's genetic samples, was annotated as a footnote in black ops history, then 40 to 50 years later, started back up from square one, finding new genetic samples, from completely different people, fertilized an ovum and then re-sequenced the DNA, to make a different super fetus, that was grown inside a tank, or a college student to produce a new superbaby, that grew up to be a homicidal maniac torturer who ruled a quarter of Asia.

Or…it’s a TV show telling a story.

 

[Set Harth]

Despite being declared "an alternate timeline" in the film itself, there was still wholesale rejection of it because the technology was wrong, the Enterprise was wrong, and Pike's age was way wrong.

Technically the phrase used was "alternate reality", but same difference.

I never thought about Pike's age being wrong. If that's true then it would be something set in stone before 2233 and thus not easily handwaved away by the change in the timeline. The same goes for claims ( dubious or not ) of the technology being wrong. If they mean the technology we see in 2233, all of that would have been in place before Nero showed up and thus it would have been the same way in the Prime. Of course, 25 years later is a different story.

 

[fireproof78]

Technically the phrase used was "alternate reality".

Thank you.

Being declared an alternate reality there was still absolute rejection of it because things were wrong.

 

[jackoverfull]

Why didn't they have La'an and AlterKirk go back to the sixties when OG Khan would have been a boy? They could have done that and left out the whole sliding timeline business.

Mainly budged, probably. Still, this sliding timeline thing solves more problems than it creates, so I don’t understand all this resistance to the idea.

- No reference to Gary 7?

Why would he/them be involved? Also, La’han doesn’t even know his group exists.

The Temporal Cold War?

It’s strongly hinted at. Calling it by name wouldn’t have changed anything.

Money is actual magic. It can do ANYTHING.

How much can you win playing chess in Toronto?!

 

[Paul755]

I don’t think saying it’s an alternate reality is rejecting anything.

 

[jackoverfull]

Picard: nearly all the crew who died in TNG were actually ON the Enterprise instead of an away mission or something.

I’m almost sure no crew member of the Enterprise dies until they meet the Borg in Q Who, which makes them even more formidable.

 

[cooleddie74]

The conn officer in "Where Silence Has Lease" is brutally killed by Nagilum and that's earlier in Season 2 than "Q Who?"

 

[Jedman67]

The conn officer in "Where Silence Has Lease" is brutally killed by Nagilum and that's earlier in Season 2 than "Q Who?"

Ninja'd!

 

[Guy Gardener]

Or…it’s a TV show telling a story.

Prove it.

 

[Nerys Myk]

Strange New Worlds itself basically confirmed this is NOT the same timeline as TOS or Prime with this episode.

Sarah the Romulan says all of the Eugenics Wars and Khan's existence was "supposed to happen in 1992" but all the temporal alterations have nudged the events forward. She has been stuck on Earth for 30 years because Khan's existence is a sort of fixed point in time (to borrow a Doctor Who plot device) that resists being altered.

However, the implication of the episode is that all of the changes in Discovery, Strange New Worlds, and possibly even Picard can be explained by saying this is a branched-off, altered timeline created from the Temporal (Cold) Wars.

It’s still the Prime timeline. Things have just gotten “pushed” around due to temporal hi-jinks and time pushing back.

 

[Jedi Marso]

There's also some ambiguity within that episode as to whether that incident actually happened.

How so?

 

[Jedi Marso]

Just saying, Obi-Wan Kenobi is Ben Lars' brother.

The novelizations were said to be canon until TPM.

Heh. In my rewrite of the SW prequels, the Jedi are allowed to marry, have children, and interact with society, and aren't stolen from their families as infants. Beru Lars is Obi-Wan's sister in my version, although I've only written 2 out of the 3 and she has only been mentioned, not introduced.

 

[fireproof78]

I never thought about Pike's age being wrong. If that's true then it would be something set in stone before 2233 and thus not easily handwaved away by the change in the timeline. The same goes for claims ( dubious or not ) of the technology being wrong. If they mean the technology we see in 2233, all of that would have been in place before Nero showed up and thus it would have been the same way in the Prime. Of course, 25 years later is a different story.

No. The objections were the Enterprise was wrong, the technology too advance for that era of "TOS" that Pike was not "about the same age as Kirk" but closer to a father figure. That the ships are way to big for the time period, etc.

Heh. In my rewrite of the SW prequels, the Jedi are allowed to marry, have children, and interact with society, and aren't stolen from their families as infants. Beru Lars is Obi-Wan's sister in my version, although I've only written 2 out of the 3 and she has only been mentioned, not introduced.

Could be good.

 

[Jedi Marso]

I HATED that opening shot. Back to ENT's snowflake "stars" fluttering past the ship at impulse speeds... yuk.

Actually, I was thinking that maybe this was an introductory return to a more traditional 'warp' effect rather than the SW hyperspace version of warp we've been saddled with since JJ-Trek made its debut.

 

[Noname Given]

the episode literally addressed it. it would have been distracting if they hadn't, but they did. the timeline has shifted since Space Seed. maybe the version that happened in this revived timeline, Chekov was actually in the episode.

And the "On Earth...200 years ago..." line from Khan in STII:TWoK now makes sense.