Spoilers Star Trek: Discovery 2x10 - "The Red Angel"

Discussion in 'Star Trek: Discovery' started by Commander Richard, Mar 21, 2019.

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Hit it!

  1. 10 - Leaps and bounds ahead of anything Trek has done before.

    10.8%
  2. 9

    23.7%
  3. 8

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  4. 7

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  5. 6

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  6. 5

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  7. 4

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  8. 3

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  9. 2

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  10. 1 - Oh boy, what a mess.

    3.4%
  1. Alan Roi

    Alan Roi Fleet Captain Red Shirt

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    I fail to make any sense of your complaint.
     
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  2. fireproof78

    fireproof78 Admiral Admiral

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    This part I will disagree on. The moment I heard that her parents had been apart of Section 31 and killed in some sort of op I figured this was a possibility.

    Same here. "Damage to the writer's room?" Why? Because they use magic to get out of situations? This is Star Trek, where magic is just technobabble we don't understand yet :D
     
  3. BillJ

    BillJ Fleet Admiral Premium Member

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    You mean ten minutes before the reveal, in the same episode?
     
  4. fireproof78

    fireproof78 Admiral Admiral

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    No, I had a feeling her parents would be connected to the spore drive actually or some sort of spore shadow or whatever.
     
  5. BillJ

    BillJ Fleet Admiral Premium Member

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    The reveal you talk about is in "The Red Angel". Her parents crossed my mind, but seemed like an uninspired choice for what they were going for. It seemed like early on they were going for some kind of religious story that had something to say, then shifted to standard Trek tropes once Harberts and Berg were fired. They must have taken their story notes with them.
     
  6. Alan Roi

    Alan Roi Fleet Captain Red Shirt

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    We knew from day one that her parents were killed in a Klingon attack, but the reason wasn't revealed at the time. Later we learn that Leland and maybe Section 31 was involved. Then we ultimately learn that Michael's parents worked for Section 31 and were the target of the Klingon attack because of what they were working on.
     
  7. fireproof78

    fireproof78 Admiral Admiral

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    Yes, I realize that I wasn't clear in my thought process. I figured that their story would receive more attention this season. With Culber coming back as a spore ghost or whatever I thought the Red Angel might be in kind and connected with Burnham. A member of her family made most sense to me.
     
  8. BillJ

    BillJ Fleet Admiral Premium Member

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    We knew her parents were killed by Klingons early on, the rest was info-dumped in "The Red Angel", IIRC.
     
  9. Alan Roi

    Alan Roi Fleet Captain Red Shirt

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    Just because a story starts seeming about one thing and turns into something else isn't automatically a missed opportunity. A story that starts off with faith and then is unpeeled into science is not a missed opportunity. It is a progression. This season has been all about superstitious ideas being unpeeled into things they aren't. The Red Angel isn't from Heaven. May isn't a Ghost. The Great Balance between the Ba'ul is a lie. etc.
     
  10. Alan Roi

    Alan Roi Fleet Captain Red Shirt

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    No, there was an earlier reference in dialogue between Georgiou and Leland that set's up the 'infodump'.
     
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  11. BillJ

    BillJ Fleet Admiral Premium Member

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    Not always, and anyone that knows me here knows that I'm not a religious man. But sometimes it is good that a story stretches and challenges your belief system, whatever it is. This one is just more of Discovery falling back on well-used Trek tropes.
     
  12. fireproof78

    fireproof78 Admiral Admiral

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    What trope is that?
     
  13. Turtletrekker

    Turtletrekker Admiral Admiral

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    Trek Core made a connection between "The Red Angel" and Voyager's "Future's End", essentially confirming Michael's parent's theory about interference in history from the future.
     
    Last edited: Mar 23, 2019
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  14. CorporalClegg

    CorporalClegg Admiral Admiral

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    Someone already pointed it out. You get the Voyager syndrome.

    Once you carelessly introduce time travel into your stories, it becomes a crutch that inevitably brakes and you sidle down the slope on one leg and end up in the snow pile called "Timeless" and that snowball eventually becomes "Endgame."

    That's not to say the writers of the other shows overly meticulous, but TOS/TVH, TNG, and DS9 did make an effort to cross the Ts and dot the Is whenever they deployed time travel. But writing the Red Angel suit as the result of some pseudo cloak and dagger political intrigue arms race just opens a nasty can of worms.
     
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  15. SolarisOne

    SolarisOne Captain Captain

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    Still gonna call it out when they do stupid stuff. It's almost as if they were reading Steven Moffat's playbook, but instead of copying his good material they copied the bad. :shrug:

    You'll just get glass in your eyes along with the needle. :techman:

    Bingo!

    Yeah. This one really bothers me. Like I said earlier, I almost stopped watching the episode entirely at said point. Which brings up another point--Prime Georgiou was probably bi or pansexual. At least she should have been. In my headcanon, she was.
     
  16. Alan Roi

    Alan Roi Fleet Captain Red Shirt

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    Except this isn't a careless introduction. There's no indication that, as with Voyager, the whole show will be reset at the end of the season like it didn't happen. To the contrary, we are being shown the consequences of reckless use of time travel here.

    Honestly, Voyager was all about the big reset button, whether they were using time travel or not.

    I see no parallel at all in any way so far this season has progressed to Voyager's time travel resets which hardly started with Timeless. Voyager started doing that from the getgo Writing the Red Angel as a consequence to a previous arms race that is no longer going on is exactly the opposite of what Voyager engaged in.
     
    Last edited: Mar 25, 2019
  17. CommanderRaytas

    CommanderRaytas DISCO QUEEEEEEN Premium Member

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    Whereas I think nobody needs to hide their body shape just because it doesn't fit some standard. Tilly is not Hollywood skinny, but she is nowhere near overweight. I find the fact that someone with a different body type gets to exist in a show like this without said body getting forced into an unnatural shape refreshing. There is no reason to hide anyone's body.
     
  18. Doc Mugatu

    Doc Mugatu Captain Captain

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    I am not condemning the behind the scene folks for doing it, however, I still do not believe it was really necessary to make Michael Burnham a member of Spock's family. In fact, so far, it stills feels like a contrivance and done just to do.

    Having said that.

    I like the Michael Burnham character and am enjoying season 2 very much. Ethan Peck is absolutely terrific and won over my skeptical heart. The only downside is since they do have him as Spock we probably won't see him after this season.
     
  19. Doc Mugatu

    Doc Mugatu Captain Captain

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    Ah yes, the old familiar cry of "Deus Ex Machina!" Remember it well during the TNG years on AOL (and every Trek series thereafter). :lol:
     
  20. XCV330

    XCV330 Rear Admiral Premium Member

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    if you grind them up you get protomatter. they emit Braggatron Particles and Berman Waves
     
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