Agents of SHIELD. Season 1 Discussion Thread

[trekkiebaggio]

For someone who is running a criminal organization and presumably has a lot of money, that room looks very low-key.

 

[RJDiogenes]

Every woman who goes into military situations has to accept this as a possibility if she is captured. Playing the situation off as so light just because it is a male character showed a lack of taste, I thought.

We're not talking about being in a war zone, getting captured, beaten, and gang raped. We're talking about people who are like James Bond, who use sex to manipulate and infiltrate. She didn't do anything to him that he hasn't done to others before-- the only difference being the mind control, which would be the part he'd have difficulty dealing with.

But I'm sure if the roles were reversed and it was a male Asgardian who mind controlled a female James Bond like character making her have sex with him, the episode would have a different tone, especially if her male teammate hits her for admitting she settling for him after everything she went through.

Oh, absolutely. But that's politics, not reality. Obviously, women are no weaker or stronger than men (despite the embarrassing lines they put in Simmons' mouth this episode).

I also like to add, I feel really sorry for Ward's penis. Asgardians are dense enough to take a hit from the Hulk. Unless Lorelei gave Ward a spell to make him stone hard, he shouldn't have much left of his manhood.

Presumably they have superhuman lubrication as well.

 

[Alidar Jarok]

Yeah, and now that I think about it, was that from the show itself, or was it from a commercial that aired during the Marvel special?

Trailer. I found a low-quality version, but I'd have to look for it again to see if I can find it. I also found the part of the special that covered AoS, but, once again, I'd have to look for it to re-find it. I didn't see anything besides Deathlock, the Carrier landing shot, and Talbot as far as new stuff, though.

ETA: The trailer (low quality)

One out of two found.

 

[Turtletrekker]

Spoiler: "End of the Beginning" trailer

Things look dire for Titus Welliver's Agent Blake.

 

[Nerys Myk]

And I guess they're decoupling World War 2 from the backstory of the CinemaVerse edition of Eric Koenig...?

Yeah, I think Patton Oswald as "Eric Koenig" is going to be more a matter of just giving a popular guest star a name from the comics and calling it good.

He is the first name that comes to mind when I think "tall, blond haired, square jawed German pilot."

 

[Locutus of Bored]

Patton Oswald to guest as Agent Eric Koenig.

I like the way he thinks:

"When they first told me the character’s name, I’ll admit the first thing I did is I went on Wikipedia and looked up the M.O.D.O.K. character to see if Koenig was maybe his name before he became M.O.D.O.K., but it wasn’t,” Oswalt told Marvel.com, laughing. “They keep on talking about the Clairvoyant in the show and I’m like, ‘is that M.O.D.O.K.? Am I M.O.D.O.K.?”

He's clearly excited to be on the show.

I love Patton Oswald. He's just such an enthusiastic fanboy, and you can tell he puts that love of the genre into his performances.

His ad-libbed Star Wars Episode VII (and Marvel and more) filibuster in Parks and Recreation was amazing.

[yt]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDUrw7j0UA4[/yt]

 

[theenglish]

I also like to add, I feel really sorry for Ward's penis. Asgardians are dense enough to take a hit from the Hulk. Unless Lorelei gave Ward a spell to make him stone hard, he shouldn't have much left of his manhood.

Presumably they have superhuman lubrication as well.

That was actually funny.

But my point is that the double standard in these types of episodes, of any series, really bothers me. When it happens to a man, it is always treated much lighter than if it happened to a woman. Sorry for being serious on this, but it is an issue and I would have hoped that television writers could be a little more mature about it.

 

[Velocity]

I also like to add, I feel really sorry for Ward's penis. Asgardians are dense enough to take a hit from the Hulk. Unless Lorelei gave Ward a spell to make him stone hard, he shouldn't have much left of his manhood.

Presumably they have superhuman lubrication as well.

That was actually funny.

But my point is that the double standard in these types of episodes, of any series, really bothers me. When it happens to a man, it is always treated much lighter than if it happened to a woman. Sorry for being serious on this, but it is an issue and I would have hoped that television writers could be a little more mature about it.

Really, rape of a man by a woman doesn't involve the physical damage that is caused to a woman raped by a man. He might have some mental anguish afterwards by being used against his will (not at the time obviously or the rape couldn't happen) but he wouldn't be injured like a woman would. This is probably why a lot of people aren't treating it as seriously as you would like. That, and this is fiction and not real. Along those lines, can you imagine trying to get rid of an Asgardian STD?

 

[LaxScrutiny]

But my point is that the double standard in these types of episodes, of any series, really bothers me. When it happens to a man, it is always treated much lighter than if it happened to a woman. Sorry for being serious on this, but it is an issue and I would have hoped that television writers could be a little more mature about it.

Good shows make you think.

SHIELD makes us think about who the Clairvoyant is, and who the next cool Marvel character will be that appears, and how closely they will resemble their print version. There is nothing wrong with that and I indulge in this as much as anyone.

Some shows make you think about issues, the way Gene Roddenberry did with Star Trek, or Patrick McGoohan did with The Prisoner. Or even how the 60s Avengers with John Steed pushed boundaries with obvious fetish references and utilized style.

I don't expect SHIELD to push those boundaries or explore those issues, because no other current show is really doing it much. But certainly I am not going to give it credit for being anything special when it doesn't.

I wouldn't even expect that it might, except that one of the show's creators has this street rep of being some kind of feminist for making this boundary-pushing show back in the 90s.

Really, rape of a man by a woman doesn't involve the physical damage that is caused to a woman raped by a man...

Says someone who, I presume, has been in both situations...

Showing a man experiencing the devastation that a woman would feel in the same circumstance is something that would break out of conventional boundaries and open eyes. It might affect the ideas of the next frat boy who decides to molest a girl passed out on the couch at a party. Or it might not, but it would be an attempt at trying.

The show didn't make that attempt. A few of us noticed.

 

[Christopher]

Really, rape of a man by a woman doesn't involve the physical damage that is caused to a woman raped by a man. He might have some mental anguish afterwards by being used against his will (not at the time obviously or the rape couldn't happen) but he wouldn't be injured like a woman would. This is probably why a lot of people aren't treating it as seriously as you would like.

This is a grossly misinformed statement. A great many rapes do not involve physical violence but instead involve drugs, threats, physical restraint, or verbal/emotional coercion. And it's just as psychologically invasive and traumatic either way.

And yes, men do get raped by a variety of methods, sometimes by women, and it's just as emotionally traumatic for them.

 

[Alidar Jarok]

I feel like every time we go on break we leave off with a strange topic to discuss.

 

[RJDiogenes]

^^ Which is often as entertaining as the show.

I also like to add, I feel really sorry for Ward's penis. Asgardians are dense enough to take a hit from the Hulk. Unless Lorelei gave Ward a spell to make him stone hard, he shouldn't have much left of his manhood.

Presumably they have superhuman lubrication as well.

That was actually funny.

Thanks.

But my point is that the double standard in these types of episodes, of any series, really bothers me. When it happens to a man, it is always treated much lighter than if it happened to a woman. Sorry for being serious on this, but it is an issue and I would have hoped that television writers could be a little more mature about it.

And I completely agree with you. In addition to the double standard, it's currently very fashionable to heap abuse on men as some sort of cultural revenge. I'm just saying that in this specific instance, we're dealing with James Bond and so I don't think a big deal needs to be made of it-- and if it were May in that position I would say the same thing.

Really, rape of a man by a woman doesn't involve the physical damage that is caused to a woman raped by a man. He might have some mental anguish afterwards by being used against his will (not at the time obviously or the rape couldn't happen) but he wouldn't be injured like a woman would.

As I said, we're not dealing with a violent assault. The sex itself was a pleasant experience. It was the fact that it was done against his will, or by bending his will, that makes it rape. It would be the same if it were May. There would be no physical damage, just the anger at being used (and possibly self anger at enjoying it).

 

[Guy Gardener]

Pleasant at the time doen't mean shit legally if it was garnered through deceit.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rape_by_deception

 

[DEWLine]

Yeah. That's become a fact of Canadian law in the past month.

Different particulars in the Nova Scotia case, mind you, but the concept is applicable.

 

[ALF]

I feel like the series has finally picked up this last couple of episodes. They were great.
Wish this show had been like this out of the gate... there's something curiously Caprica~esque about this very long, drawn out beginning that usually means death in the TV world. Maybe they've been vetted by their network for a long run but holy Christ it took forever to get in the air.

 

[bbjeg]

I feel like the series has finally picked up this last couple of episodes. They were great.
Wish this show had been like this out of the gate... there's something curiously Caprica~esque about this very long, drawn out beginning that usually means death in the TV world. Maybe they've been vetted by their network for a long run but holy Christ it took forever to get in the air.

I agree, the start was slow (with a few good ones here and there) but currently, they're surpassing my expectations. They're finally showing the Marvel Universe.

 

[RJDiogenes]

Pleasant at the time doen't mean shit legally if it was garnered through deceit.

We're not talking about legality, we're talking about characterization in the current political climate.

 

[Guy Gardener]

And I still think she's coming back half way through next season with a baby bump like Chakotay and Seska in Voyager and Not like Buffy getting upset about Riley screwing Faith in Buffy's body and how he couldn't tell the difference...

Notice how she made it all about her.

He was raped, but she was angry at him because he was too stupid to know that he was being raped.

 

[Mr Light]

Buffy became completely unsympathetic in the later seasons... remember back in the high school years when she was actually funny? And fun?

I think Joss was molding the character to fit the actress. From what I've read she was a diva and looked down on the show.

 

[Forbin]

I don't think SMG "looked down" on the show at all. But what's been said is that she was a professional actress, and the show was a job. While everyone else in the cast bonded and thought of it as a family and hung out, Sarah basically came to work, worked, and went home. At least that's how I heard it.