Agents of SHIELD. Season 1 Discussion Thread

[Christopher]

I guess the cringe comes from the PC moment of a 50 year old woman, even The Cavalry, taking down a fighting man in his prime. Perhaps the Berserker staff made her into a Buffy, but we would have had to come to the conclusion on our own from seeing that particular episode.

Ward might be stronger, but May is smarter (well, except when it comes to relationships). She's had at 10 more years on Ward, not including anything her mom taught her.

Yes, absolutely. There was nothing "PC" about this. Ward was actually knocking May around pretty soundly. In terms of raw strength, he clearly outmatched her. She only got the edge by outsmarting him, by using the nail gun to immobilize him and incapacitate him with pain so that she could then deliver the knockout blow.

And that makes perfect sense. That, or so I gather, is how women are trained to defend themselves against male attackers: by fighting dirty, looking for any opportunity to inflict incapacitating pain, because just outmuscling them isn't an option. That's not "PC," it's basic survival.

 

[Pingfah]

The showdown with May was pretty cringe-worthy, but it was the only bad moment in the episode, really.

Utterly disagree. I wanted Ward's ass kicked and May provided that with interest.

I guess the cringe comes from the PC moment of a 50 year old woman, even The Cavalry, taking down a fighting man in his prime.

Yeah, apart from that the episode was 100% plausible.

 

[Reverend]

I guess the cringe comes from the PC moment of a 50 year old woman, even The Cavalry, taking down a fighting man in his prime. Perhaps the Berserker staff made her into a Buffy, but we would have had to come to the conclusion on our own from seeing that particular episode.

Ward might be stronger, but May is smarter (well, except when it comes to relationships). She's had at 10 more years on Ward, not including anything her mom taught her.

Yes, absolutely. There was nothing "PC" about this. Ward was actually knocking May around pretty soundly. In terms of raw strength, he clearly outmatched her. She only got the edge by outsmarting him, by using the nail gun to immobilize him and incapacitate him with pain so that she could then deliver the knockout blow.

And that makes perfect sense. That, or so I gather, is how women are trained to defend themselves against male attackers: by fighting dirty, looking for any opportunity to inflict incapacitating pain, because just outmuscling them isn't an option. That's not "PC," it's basic survival.

Yeah I have no idea where anyone could get "PC" from that fight. It was a knock-down, drag-out clash of pure brutality. Hell, she goes after him with a sodding buzzsaw then nailguns his foot to the floor! And it's not as if he was pulling any punches either.

As for "credibility", well fights aren't determined ahead of time by simply figuring our who's younger and stronger. Wars would be much shorter otherwise. Sure May is a little older but she's still in her physical prime, add to that an extra decade or so of field experience and that white-hot furious RAGE she's been focusing and honing for the past few days and it all adds up to a clear advantage.

 

[sojourner]

Was anyone else just a little bit annoyed that they mention the company expanding just as an excuse to have the construction equipment there for that fight?

 

[bbjeg]

^It's plausible.

 

[sojourner]

Plausible? yes. But it's also a trope for a fight to lead to a construction area.

 

[Mister Fandango]

All fight scenes are set up so that props the writers want to use are available. 99% of Jackie Chan fights, for instance.

 

[Alidar Jarok]

Was anyone else just a little bit annoyed that they mention the company expanding just as an excuse to have the construction equipment there for that fight?

I thought it was clever. They crossed their i's and dotted their t's so the scene made sense. That's fine with me.

 

[gblews]

May is 50? The character doesn't look that old by her face and certainly not her body, but then she is supposed to be in pretty good shape. But still, 50?

I liked the fight, too. I liked that May used anything and everything she could grab onto to hit, stab, or shoot (into his foot) on Ward. I think we can also surmise that a lot of her rage was probably directed inward because of her prior intimacy with Ward and being totally fooled by him. That had to be pretty galling for her. Of course, he was about to get Skye too were it not for having to murder Eric Koenig and turning evil and stuff. Hell, he might have gotten Hand too if he hadn't had to shoot her.

Ward was a serious playa'.

 

[bbjeg]

Was anyone else just a little bit annoyed that they mention the company expanding just as an excuse to have the construction equipment there for that fight?

I thought it was clever. They crossed their i's and dotted their t's so the scene made sense. That's fine with me.

If we're making plays on words I'll go with May crossed Ward's eyes after dotting his feet.

 

[Locutus of Bored]

I guess the cringe comes from the PC moment of a 50 year old woman, even The Cavalry, taking down a fighting man in his prime.

Dammit, PC does not mean "stuff I don't agree with." Every time someone misuses the term PC, a mortally-challenged non-denominational haloed flying entity loses its wings.

- May is acknowledged repeatedly as being one of, if not the best, fighters in SHIELD.

- May is highly motivated in her goal of defeating Ward, whereas Ward has just had his entire reason for being of the last decade and a half ripped away from him.

- Ward still has some lingering respect for these people, while May has none for him.

- Ward may be physically stronger, but May is smarter, more experienced, more skilled, more resourceful, and better trained.

- As you said, she was just holding the Berserker staff recently, though I don't think that's necessary to explain her winning.

- May used her surroundings to her advantage.

 

[The Old Mixer]

I'd thought they'd pretty much set May up as being the better fighter of the two throughout the season.

I had another thought of an angle they might play with Ward....What if he fell into the hands of the U.S. government and worked with Talbot against Coulson's team...?

 

[Mr. Adventure]

May is 50? The character doesn't look that old by her face and certainly not her body, but then she is supposed to be in pretty good shape. But still, 50?

That's how old the actress Ming Na is at least.

 

[Yoda]

Maybe this will explain how it works:

 

[Guy Gardener]

So, they're a continuous explosion between the ages of 51 and 59?

Meanwhile, is that a Logan's Run thing going on with the clothing colour?

 

[Enterprise1701]

On a subject not directly related to "Beginning of the End", I've noticed that on the Marvel Cinematic Universe wiki, the aircraft carrier where the Bus lands in order to pick up Hand, Sitwell, Blake, Garrett, and Triplett back in "End of the Beginning" is labeled as "S.H.I.E.L.D. aircraft carrier" but its image is categorized under "helicarrier".

http://marvelcinematicuniverse.wikia.com/wiki/File:Helicarrier_74.png

I never thought of it before but could the aircraft carrier possibly be the repaired helicarrier from The Avengers?

 

[Davros]

I kept trying to figure out what Marvel character was Paxton becoming .

Garrett was the telepathic cyborg from Elektra Assassin... So really, he had always been becoming himself.

http://goodcomics.comicbookresources.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/05/051811_elektra_garrett.jpg

I don't remember him as telepathic in EA.

 

[Corran Horn]

I didn't consider for an instant that May defeating Ward was anything contrived.

The character has been sold up and down as a badass.

 

[Guy Gardener]

I kept trying to figure out what Marvel character was Paxton becoming .

Garrett was the telepathic cyborg from Elektra Assassin... So really, he had always been becoming himself.

http://goodcomics.comicbookresources.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/05/051811_elektra_garrett.jpg

I don't remember him as telepathic in EA.

He had a psychic bond with Elektra after a near death experience?

I think the nature of this telepathy was broadened in a throwaway issue of something no one read, that no one remembers of cares about from the 90s, but that's neither here nor there.

While researching Elektra's past, Garrett became a victim of a psychic link with her, and she began to influence his perceptions and manipulate his actions.

http://www.marvunapp.com/Appendix/garrettjohnelektra.htm

 

[JD]

I thought Ward/May fight was pretty awesome myself, and I honestly never really gave any thought to the age difference. May's been kick so much ass since the show started that it never occurred to me that she wouldn't at least be a match for Ward.