It's funny to me how many give the one off Klingon character the benefit of the doubt but not M'Benga.
Spoilers Star Trek: Strange New Worlds 2x08 - "Under the Cloak of War"
- Thread starter Commander Richard
- Start date
A Klingon who had a strong motive to want him dead after M'Benga pretty much told him that he was the only one who could dispute the story he told the Federation about what happened on J'Gal.
Agreed.
Horrible double standard, particularly when Dak'Rah murdered civilians and children.
Horrible double standard, particularly when Dak'Rah murdered civilians and children.
Because this isn't Rah's story. He only exists for M'Benga to respond/react to. So any debates of interest center on the doctor's motives and behavior.
If you want to let M'Benga off the hook, fine. But that's got nothing to do with giving Dak'Rah "the benefit of the doubt," or not.
I say it also helps put light on the motives and behaviour of the Starfleet cable trying to stop the klingon peace treaty in undiscovered country.
Most were probably like M'Benga and saw horrific things that meant they could not trust the Klingons. Someone like colonel Cartwright was probably a mid level officer on the front lines and saw what klingon nature truly was.
"Savage nature?" These things are cultural practices, not the product of biology.
Nature or nurture, it's still savage to be killing civilians and children indiscriminately.
Klingons are savages.
And TNG showed they evolved from a rather nasty apex predator.
Being allied to the federation didn't do anything to change them. Soon as the alliance broke up and they went back to war with the federation they went back to their same savage antics of killing civilians and medical personal for the lolz.
Dammit I got West muddled with Cartwright.
From the rank Colonel West would of likely been a junior or captain at the time of ground forces and would have seen everything atrocity Klingons were capable of like the Ground forces in WW2 uncovering NAZI atrocities it would of been something he would never forget. Cartwright was head of Starfleet command so would have know every detail and would likely have been a captain at the time of the war.
Both could see that the Klingons would never change and could see the Klingons inflicting the same atrocities again in the future. Which they did.
Which raises the question. Yes peace is always the ideal. But should it be pursued when it involves tolerating evil?
As Sci said, it's a cultural thing, not a biological thing. Not all Klingons are savages, it's just the ones we tend to see, since we mostly see soldiers and generals. There was that lawyer in ENT who lamented the increasing militarisation of Klingon society.
Let's not forget that what some of the Klingons have done isn't really any worse than what some humans have done. But would you say that all humans are savages?
Let's not forget that what some of the Klingons have done isn't really any worse than what some humans have done. But would you say that all humans are savages?
Considering what we are doing to each other and to the planet now?
Yes
Yet Klingon society never changed. Even after Praxis they still had the same brutal society and attitude to war.
It's easy for a small group to wield undue influence in a society and affect wider cultural attitudes. Even more so when it's warriors vs. scholars. Who do you think is going to become more powerful?
Then the federation should of made a condition of there aid to the dying empire after praxis that there needed to be societal change. If the Klingons couldn't accept that then it was probably best to let the Klingon Empire collapse and just accept non warrior cast refugees into the federation and helped them set up a new Klingon civilization.
All the Kitomeer accords did was put a temporary pause on things until the Klingon Empire could stabilize and go back to their own brutal ways a 100 years later.
Been watching a smattering of TOS and SNW. Including :Under the Cloak of War" and" Charlie X"
had to wonder is the workout gear seen in UTCOF is a nod to the ones seen in "Charlie X."
That's a really nice spot!
I give this episode an 8/10. The ambiguity regarding the fate of the Ambassador is a good thing.
