Spoilers Star Trek: Picard 3x04 - "No Win Scenario"

[Danja]

He was high on pain meds.

People who are high on pain meds don't usually advertise it (UNLESS they want the other person to know for some reason).

I was taking Percocet and Xanax together at one point (I'd just had oral surgery). I never felt the need to tell everyone my life story.

I have in group therapy.

Ugh ... Don't get me started.

I went through that in the 80's. Every week, it was an hour of rehashing old issues without accomplishing much of anything.

 

[fireproof78]

I was taking Percocet and Xanax together at one point (I'd just had oral surgery). I never felt the need to tell everyone my life story.

You don't know my wife then.

went through that in the 80's. Every week, it was an hour of rehashing old issues without accomplishing much of anything.

Mine was one week and accomplished much in that 6 days.

 

[Danja]

You don't know my wife then.

Sorry ... I'm trying to hold back laughing.

 

[fireproof78]

Sorry ... I'm trying to hold back laughing.

Don't worry. She knows that on pain meds she will talk anyone's ear off.

 

[pgbka]

I figured out that Shaw isn't who he seems to be.
In the conversation with Picard he mentions Wolf-359. But from the prior season the Borg developed in a totally different way since the Borg Queen went back in time 400 years. Clearly we see it in their actions at the end of season 2.

BUT, Shaw experienced Wolf-359 which didn't happen in this timeline. Therefore he must be from a parallel universe where Wolf-359 took place, possibly the mirror universe, and therefore is an evil Shaw.

Will be interesting to see how it develops.

 

[Ovation]

I figured out that Shaw isn't who he seems to be.
In the conversation with Picard he mentions Wolf-359. But from the prior season the Borg developed in a totally different way since the Borg Queen went back in time 400 years. Clearly we see it in their actions at the end of season 2.

BUT, Shaw experienced Wolf-359 which didn't happen in this timeline. Therefore he must be from a parallel universe where Wolf-359 took place, possibly the mirror universe, and therefore is an evil Shaw.

Will be interesting to see how it develops.

No. Wolf-359 still happened. The Jurati Borg did not replace the original, they were a separate addition to the timeline.

 

[CrellMoset]

No. Wolf-359 still happened. The Jurati Borg did not replace the original, they were a separate addition to the timeline.

I mean, sure, Wolf 359 still happened ... if you believe it happened at all. Do you really think duranium composite beams can be melted by jet fuel? #Wolf359truther #Wolf359WasAnInsideJob

 

[cooleddie74]

#DankPhaserStreamsMeltDuraniumBeams

 

[Mike Doyle]

I figured out that Shaw isn't who he seems to be.
In the conversation with Picard he mentions Wolf-359. But from the prior season the Borg developed in a totally different way since the Borg Queen went back in time 400 years. Clearly we see it in their actions at the end of season 2.

BUT, Shaw experienced Wolf-359 which didn't happen in this timeline. Therefore he must be from a parallel universe where Wolf-359 took place, possibly the mirror universe, and therefore is an evil Shaw.

Will be interesting to see how it develops.

It’s amazing how so many people seem to think Jurati changed the entire timeline from the 21st century onwards.

Jurati Borg we’re a predestination paradox and have always been out there in hiding.

As Shaw even says in this episode, “forget about the weird shit on the stargazer the real Borg are still out there”

 

[pgbka]

It’s amazing how so many people seem to think Jurati changed the entire timeline from the 21st century onwards.

Jurati Borg we’re a predestination paradox and have always been out there in hiding.

As Shaw even says in this episode, “forget about the weird shit on the stargazer the real Borg are still out there”

Is this Shaw reference the only one to the existence of the old Borg?

At a minimum Wolf359 should have been different from the Enterprise (series) Borg encounter; I believe those Borg got out a message to the existing Borg which was hundreds of years earlier than they knew about Earth.
And the Borg Queen was present at Wolf359, so at least Wolf359 would be different without her present. Since we know from Voyager how much influence and decision-making the Borg Queen has.

But we don't really know how the old Borg are out there after Janeway obliterated them in the final episode.

 

[fireproof78]

But we don't really know how the old Borg are out there after Janeway obliterated them in the final episode.

We do because of Season 1. They exist but are fragmented.

Jurati's Borg are a smaller collective and not representative of what Janeway damaged.

 

[Tuskin38]

At a minimum Wolf359 should have been different from the Enterprise (series) Borg encounter; I believe those Borg got out a message to the existing Borg which was hundreds of years earlier than they knew about Earth.

That was a pre-destination paradox. The signal the Borg in ENT sent is the reason why the Borg are there in the first place.

But we don't really know how the old Borg are out there after Janeway obliterated them in the final episode.

She didn't destroy all of them. Remember the ship chasing Voyager adapted to the virus, others could have as well.

 

[Danja]

She didn't destroy all of them. Remember the ship chasing Voyager adapted to the virus, others could have as well.

That's their thing ...

They ADAPT.

 

[Ronin'sCreamyCandle]

People who are high on pain meds don't usually advertise it (UNLESS they want the other person to know for some reason).

I was taking Percocet and Xanax together at one point (I'd just had oral surgery). I never felt the need to tell everyone my life story.



Ugh ... Don't get me started.

I went through that in the 80's. Every week, it was an hour of rehashing old issues without accomplishing much of anything.

Shaw felt no pain on the meds and given his unique personality it gave him the courage to rip Picard a new one for Locutus.

 

[Mike Doyle]

Is this Shaw reference the only one to the existence of the old Borg?

At a minimum Wolf359 should have been different from the Enterprise (series) Borg encounter; I believe those Borg got out a message to the existing Borg which was hundreds of years earlier than they knew about Earth.
And the Borg Queen was present at Wolf359, so at least Wolf359 would be different without her present. Since we know from Voyager how much influence and decision-making the Borg Queen has.

But we don't really know how the old Borg are out there after Janeway obliterated them in the final episode.

“You think in such three dimensional terms”

As was previously said it’s a pre-destination paradox.

The Queen was at Wolf 359 in best of both worlds (we just didn’t see her). She then escaped (the very thing the above quote is about). While all that was happening Jurati and her collective were in hiding somewhere to not corrupt the timeline.

It’s a while since I saw endgame but I’m pretty sure it’s never even alluded to that what they are trying to do is destroy the collective.

They are trying to destroy the trans warp network to slow them down and cripple them.

If the Borg were an assassin chasing you in a car the plan in endgame was always to shoot their tires out, not kill them.

 

[AlanC9]

Sure ... Spill your guts to someone you absolutely despise. Who does that?

Someone who wants the guy he's talking to to feel bad? And wants the other people in the room to dislike the guy a bit?

 

[EmoBorg]

I must say that Captain Shaw's conversation with Admiral Picard and Jack Crusher, is one of the best scenes in recent star trek shows, period.

Captain Shaw was still suffering survivor's guilt and Picard knew that. That is why Picard never stopped Shaw during his angry outburst. Picard was assimilated and used against his will by the Borg. As a result, Picard had to deal with the trauma of the 11 000 causalities he caused during the Battle of Wolf 359.

I am sure many in Starfleet still have strong feelings about Picard to this day, regarding Wolf 359.

Keep in mind, not all 11 000 died. I am sure that an unknown number got assimilated as well and that may include the 40 crew members and lieutenant left behind on the USS Constance.

 

[Cyrus]

Finally saw this. Great episode. Picard is 4 for 4 this season and this one was the best so far.

I am liking Shaw a lot.

fantastic job of directing and acting by Frakes.

 

[Smellincoffee]

The cane should be easy enough for an imposter to replicate if they wanted to do it.

Sure ... Spill your guts to someone you absolutely despise. Who does that?

They thought they were about to die and he was under the influence. Maybe he wanted to get something off of his chest before the end came -- a last grasp at closure, or at least relieving himself of the emotional burden.

 

[fireproof78]

They thought they were about to die and he was under the influence. Maybe he wanted to get something off of his chest before the end came -- a last grasp at closure, or at least relieving himself of the emotional burden.

Catharsis.