Watched it a 3rd time -- it's great!!

[Dukhat]

Something like this would have made it easier to believe that NuOldSpock and Nero emerged from the wormhole into the past of the actual TOS universe. For me, anyway. I also liked the Kelvin's communicator designs. They looked like TOS communicators. the only problem is that they should have looked like the comms from "The Cage" and "WNMHGB" to make it easier to believe that they were actually pre-TOS.

Well, I'm sorry the film wasn't your personal idea of what Star Trek was supposed to be like, but you do understand that it wasn't Abrams's job to cater to obsessive TOS fans who know every little insignificant bit of ST minutiae, right? His job was to make an enjoyable film that would make lots of money and re-energize Star Trek.

If it makes you feel any better, I feel the same way about ENTERPRISE. I just don't see fit to include a rant about it in every post I make, for the sole purpose of getting on people's nerves.

 

[Therin of Andor]

I've actually said on multiple occasions that I really enjoyed the movie. It was very entertaining and fun to watch.

So much expended energy. I am so reminded of the reactions I used to get in 1980, meeting diehard TOS fans in the fan club I'd just joined, and me wanting to discuss ST:TMP with people who simply refused to understand that it was possible to like TMP and TOS at the same time.

 

[I-Am-Zim]

I've actually said on multiple occasions that I really enjoyed the movie. It was very entertaining and fun to watch.

So much expended energy. I am so reminded of the reactions I used to get in 1980, meeting diehard TOS fans in the fan club I'd just joined, and me wanting to discuss ST:TMP with people who simply refused to understand that it was possible to like TMP and TOS at the same time.

Yeah. Watched it again with the kids a couple of days ago on EPIX1 on DishNetwork. My wife asked me why I was watching that movie I hate so much. I just sighed and put my arm around my son and kept watching. I absolutely hate what JJA did to "my" Star Trek, but the movie itself wasn't half bad. As long as I get my mind set that Abrams-Trek is most definitely NOT my Star Trek and that the TOS/TNG/DS9/VOY universe is alive and well and that JJ-Trek exists in its own little corner of the multiverse somewhere far, far away from the "real" Star Trek, I can sit through it.

 

[Dukhat]

Well, good for you.

BTW, I vastly prefer the Kelvin we saw in the movie to the kitbash that you posted above. I have no trouble whatsoever accepting Ryan Church's ship design as pre-TOS.

 

[I-Am-Zim]

Well good for you too.

I do have trouble accepting it as pre-TOS. We shall have to agree to disagree on that. To me, the STXI Kelvin looks more like it came after TOS but before TMP. But that's just me. I just don't buy that it is from 30+ years prior to the Kirk-era in the same TOS universe that we know and love.

And I love the kitbash version I posted. I think it looks fantastic. Give it the same CGI treatment that the Defiant got in "In A Mirror, Darkly" and it would look even better. Better yet, let Deg3D or Vektor get hold of it. Then you'd see a totally amazing Kelvin that would put the movie version to shame.

 

[number6]

Well... It's pretty clear that the Kelvin isn't pre-TOS any more than the Battleship 1701-D was the moment the 1701-C crossed through that anomaly.

It is from the moment the lightning storm in space is investigated that reality is changed.

The writers of XI explained that in interviews about this film and it is ultimately explained by NuSpock in the film.

 

[Admiral Buzzkill]

And I love the kitbash version I posted. I think it looks fantastic.

That's too bad, because it's a really lame kitbash.

 

[Dukhat]

I do have trouble accepting it as pre-TOS. We shall have to agree to disagree on that. To me, the STXI Kelvin looks more like it came after TOS but before TMP. But that's just me. I just don't buy that it is from 30+ years prior to the Kirk-era in the same TOS universe that we know and love.

The NX-01, which was built 70 years before the Kelvin, looks like it came after TOS but before TMP too. Sometimes, like it or not, we have to disabuse ourselves of the notion that there are "rules" of starship design solely based around the TOS timeframe.

And I love the kitbash version I posted. I think it looks fantastic. Give it the same CGI treatment that the Defiant got in "In A Mirror, Darkly" and it would look even better. Better yet, let Deg3D or Vektor get hold of it. Then you'd see a totally amazing Kelvin that would put the movie version to shame.

I never said I didn't like it, just that I prefer what we got over a deliberate kitbash of TOS Connie parts. And although I have nothing but praise for the graphic artists like Vektor who post on this board, I really don't think the problem was with the Kelvin. I think the problem was with the Enterprise. I would agree that someone else could have designed a better alt-Constitution Class for the film, but it didn't happen, and I'm not crying over spilled milk about it, nor did I let it ruin my enjoyment of the movie.

 

[I-Am-Zim]

And I love the kitbash version I posted. I think it looks fantastic.

That's too bad, because it's a really lame kitbash.

In your opinion.

 

[Dukhat]

^Luckily, no one's opinion on a BBS means jack shit, no matter how many times you use it as a qualifier for some silly argument.

There's gonna be a new JJ Abrams Star Trek movie in 2012, and it's gonna be awesome. And I hear Darth Vader is going to be in it. Silly, I know, but that's what I heard.

 

[Flying Spaghetti Monster]

Well... It's pretty clear that the Kelvin isn't pre-TOS any more than the Battleship 1701-D was the moment the 1701-C crossed through that anomaly.

It is from the moment the lightning storm in space is investigated that reality is changed.

the scenarios are different. They are not exactly comparable. The design of the Kelvin would not have changed with a ship going into the past at the moment that it did... the Kelvin was hanging around Klingon space or whatever and saw the lightning storm.

In Yesterday's Enterprise, the ship from the past came to the future, changing the history between the two time points, justifying the change in ship designs.

 

[OneBuckFilms]

The Kelvin is a pre-TOS design. It's just not one you like in that context.

 

[I-Am-Zim]

Well...it's pre-TOS in the Abramsverse anyway.

 

[number6]

Yeah.. The Kelvin we see onscreen could very well be the first thing we see in this alternate reality caused by the lightning storm in space. That's my theory anyway..

 

[OneBuckFilms]

Yeah.. The Kelvin we see onscreen could very well be the first thing we see in this alternate reality caused by the lightning storm in space. That's my theory anyway..

Or *gasp* she's Canon in BOTH realities.

 

[number6]

That's possible, but remember how the bridge and the uniforms changed when the 1701-C crosses the event horizon?? All of a sudden the 1701-D is this entirely different ship with a different history?

 

[Cheapjack]

I think, too, that they should have someone in one of the new films, who is even more of a 'bad boy' than Tom Paris!??

A real 'rogue', but in Starfleet??!!

 

[I-Am-Zim]

Yeah.. The Kelvin we see onscreen could very well be the first thing we see in this alternate reality caused by the lightning storm in space. That's my theory anyway..

That would make a whole lot more sense than trying to shoehorn the Kelvin into the TOS continuity. I like this idea.

That's possible, but remember how the bridge and the uniforms changed when the 1701-C crosses the event horizon?? All of a sudden the 1701-D is this entirely different ship with a different history?

That is also possible, but the difference is that in "Yesterday's Enterprise", the Ent-C disappeared from the timeline and was gone for 22(?) years before reappearing through the rift. Because if its disappearance, history was altered and we get the altered Ent-D battleship and uniforms. Now, it is possible that when Kirk destroys the Narada, some of the parts of the ship may have been drawn into the black/wormhole and transported even further back in time to emerge 20 or 30 years prior to 2233. Those components may have been recovered by Starfleet ships, studied, and used to upgrade their ships. Hence the enormous, advanced, un-TOS-like appearance of the Kelvin. It may not be probable, but it is possible.

 

[Dukhat]

Now, it is possible that when Kirk destroys the Narada, some of the parts of the ship may have been drawn into the black/wormhole and transported even further back in time to emerge 20 or 30 years prior to 2233. Those components may have been recovered by Starfleet ships, studied, and used to upgrade their ships. Hence the enormous, advanced, un-TOS-like appearance of the Kelvin. It may not be probable, but it is possible.

That's a hugely convoluted theory to explain something that doesn't need to be explained. The Kelvin came from the Prime universe before Nero's incursion. Period. And that's not my opinion, that's a fact, because the creators of the movie said so. And before someone pisses and moans that they think the Kelvin doesn't look like a TOS ship or that it's too big, I will remind everyone that this is the same Prime universe from which the NX-01 came, a ship which also doesn't look like a predecessor of a TOS ship, and which was almost as large as the TOS Constitution class even though it was 100 years older.

Now, if you want to argue that something in ENTERPRISE caused a divergence in the timeline, that's different. But then the argument gets thrown out the window because then the "Prime" universe is no longer what we saw in TOS. Or it still could be. Or I might just take some Tylenol because the intricacies of time travel theory gives me a headache.

 

[I-Am-Zim]

My idea is no more convoluted than most of the pure stupidity that is Star Trek XI itself. So if I choose to concoct an outlandish theory to make the visuals and events in this movie fit with what I know of what was the Star Trek universe, so be it. You don't have to agree. And I really don't care if you do or not. You can follow JJA and his so-called writers like a good lemming, and I'll continue to think outside their very limited box. Thank you and have a good day.