TOS most sexist episodes/moments

[Pauln6]

There's one instance where McCoy needs to give him an injection so he tears the sleeve of Kirk's shirt, in full view of the rest of the bridge crew. Can you imagine him doing that to Uhura or Janice Rand ?

Perhaps he did and that's why he's left the service and looks like a hobo by the time TMP comes around. Perhaps he was drummed out for sexual harassment.

LOL - racist abuse seems more likely...

On the other hand I can imagine Spock as his disciplinary hearing:

Spock: "To suggest that a Vulcan would leer at a Yeoman is not logical. As a member of an emotional species Yeoman Rand must have imagined the insult. We only get the urge once every seven years and I'm not due for at least another year."

Areel Shaw (adjusting cleavage in embarassment): "Erm Mister Spock, my face is up here!"

 

[Hermiod]

^Spock would have been quite right if he had insisted that there is a purely logical reason for assessing a potential mate's ability to feed their offspring.

 

[Kegg]

^That's not a Star Trek thing, it's a media thing. It shows that, however, that society in Star Trek still embraces the same concepts of inequality that mean that American women are ineligible for the draft.

The original series, definitely (though that women are serving at all in a military-type organization is unusual, as I think Christopher insisted upthread).

But as I've said we see women in security from TNG onwards, and even female marines in ENT.

 

[Hermiod]

^Yes, I thought it was clear that I was talking solely about TOS. I'm more than aware that the other shows had female crew being put in just as much danger. Enterprise especially with female MACOs who were specifically military personnel.

 

[T'Girl]

I've never felt the need to ... snog a woman with green hair and a space bikini

Seriously Pauln6, never.

 

[Pauln6]

I've never felt the need to ... snog a woman with green hair and a space bikini

Seriously Pauln6, never.

Meh, stick Zachary Quinto in space speedos with a green chest wig and maybe... but I'd have to be drunk.

And so would he for that matter.

 

[skylark14]

I do remember one instance where a female crew member fought with male aliens (although admittedly the men of Vaal were't terribly difficult to overpower). She was red shirted, but a yeoman and not security, I think. That was in The Apple. Remember being excited about it at the time as it made sense that even the female yeomen would have some sort of self-defense training. Unfortunately, never saw such a thing again on TOS. Can only wonder if some t.v. executive found it unfeminine.

Another point expands on the earlier comments that having the women serving in a pseudo-military organization was in itself groundbreaking. It truly was. This was more of a subliminal thing, but I found myself noticing it over and over. Each week Uhura and other female crew members were on the bridge and at their stations, continuing to do their jobs competently without breaking down or crying, even though the threat of the week was promising they would die horribly in 10 seconds. So even though they rarely went on the landing parties, they were in fact put in extreme danger all the time just by being present on a starship.

I think that was very powerful at the time, even though it was never directly commented on. I guess that's what made it so powerful - the fact that it was routine in the 23rd century.

The funny thing was that the female lieutenants and yeomen on the bridge in TOS seemed much better female role models than the more professional women were - the psychiatrists, historians, exo-archaologists, etc. These women were constantly betraying their colleagues and having to be brought back on the reservation by Kirk. I can only guess that was some sort of glass ceiling kicking in. If you had the ability and drive to rise higher professionally, it had to be demonstrated that you were an unstable wacko.

 

[Pauln6]

I do remember one instance where a female crew member fought with male aliens (although admittedly the men of Vaal were't terribly difficult to overpower). She was red shirted, but a yeoman and not security, I think. That was in The Apple. Remember being excited about it at the time as it made sense that even the female yeomen would have some sort of self-defense training. Unfortunately, never saw such a thing again on TOS. Can only wonder if some t.v. executive found it unfeminine.

Yeah she was cool. If I recall correctly the actress was trained in judo so tehy worked that into the plot. In a similar way, the role of Cathy Gale in the Avengers was originally intended for a man. Because Honor Blackman was a brown belt in judo, she was able to take on the role and keep many of the masculine elements. She was extremely smart and damn foxy too.

 

[DevilEyes]

The funny thing was that the female lieutenants and yeomen on the bridge in TOS seemed much better female role models than the more professional women were - the psychiatrists, historians, exo-archaologists, etc. These women were constantly betraying their colleagues and having to be brought back on the reservation by Kirk. I can only guess that was some sort of glass ceiling kicking in. If you had the ability and drive to rise higher professionally, it had to be demonstrated that you were an unstable wacko.

I think it had more to do with the cliche that what a woman ultimately needs is the love of a big strong manly man. So while those women may be successful historians or archeologists, they would, naturally, forget everything else and start swooning the moment when the hunky villain of the week would appear.

Not just that - we could figure out that the reason why they were interested in their fields was because of certain men. A woman historian? She's of course always been obsessed with a dictator from 300 years ago! And a female archeologist/anthropologist, she must have always had a crush on some of the Greek gods. That's the most obvious reason why a woman would pursue such a career... Right? Right?

 

[Jeri]

The chica from The Apple ("Mary Landon") was played by Celeste Yarnall, and I heard somewhere that she said she has made a nice chunk of change from conventions over the decades.

http://memory-alpha.org/wiki/Celeste_Yarnall

 

[T'Girl]

Yeoman Tamula from A Taste of Armageddon is in a red uniform and is assigned the duty of detaining Mea. One of the definitions for "Yeaman" is bodyguard, or someone who escorts and protects a prominent person.

So maybe there's more to the position of yeoman than just secretarial.

 

[Hermiod]

I think it had more to do with the cliche that what a woman ultimately needs is the love of a big strong manly man. So while those women may be successful historians or archeologists, they would, naturally, forget everything else and start swooning the moment when the hunky villain of the week would appear.

Not just that - we could figure out that the reason why they were interested in their fields was because of certain men. A woman historian? She's of course always been obsessed with a dictator from 300 years ago! And a female archeologist/anthropologist, she must have always had a crush on some of the Greek gods. That's the most obvious reason why a woman would pursue such a career... Right? Right?

It's funny that in some way everything a woman does wrong on this show somehow boils down to it being a man's fault.

 

[Pauln6]

Yeoman Tamula from A Taste of Armageddon is in a red uniform and is assigned the duty of detaining Mea. One of the definitions for "Yeaman" is bodyguard, or someone who escorts and protects a prominent person.

So maybe there's more to the position of yeoman than just secretarial.

Cool - this is why I'm a strong proponent for Yeoman Rand being introduced in the Trek sequel. I think a modern take on the Captain's Yeoman could include the bodyguard role as well as admin assistant. We could have a butt-kicking, phaser-toting blonde saving the Captain instead of it remaining a boy's club.

While I'm favour of letting Uhura enjoy some action away from her console (and her quarters) if they try to shoehorn her into an action role she will remain the only significant female in the franchise. They need to spread the load a bit more.

 

[Hermiod]

^Since when does James Kirk need a bodyguard ?

And let's leave the ludicrous nature of "butt kicking" women out of Star Trek for now, please. We had enough of that with pregnant Kira beating up Cardassian soldiers.

 

[Cheapjack]

I remind you that GR put a woman as second in command, in the Cage, and women, in the test showings, in the 60's said 'Who does she think she is? !!

Here's one for you, that may raise a few eyebrows!

What about when Kirk reckons he's going to spank Elaan of Troyius!!

Acceptable way of dealing with woman who's just thrown a knife at you? Or should he have just taken it in the back, like a submissive, mannequin, Riker, hunk, and said 'Yes dear, you're right.'??

Is there spanking equality in the 23rdC? Do women reciprocate? Or do they find it a laughable and outdated way of dealing with tensions? Do they have tensions at all?

Mature answers please. And I am expecting to take a verbal scratch or two, from the females here, or at least a verbal dose of gonad-shrinking chemicals, or have it sliced off and put in the bin!

 

[Hermiod]

^Kirk dealt with Elaan appropriately. He threatened to spank her because, traditionally, that's what parents do with naughty children and that's all Elaan was.

If I was Kirk I would have locked her in the brig and charged her with attempted murder. It's the knife throwing that's sexist, not the threatened spanking. Extreme violence towards men is deemed acceptable while Kirk makes a minor, non-serious threat towards a woman and you consider that to be a problem.

 

[Cheapjack]

I don't find it a problem at all. You're dead right. Good.

And racial equality was supposed to be a touchy subject!

Where do we go next?? I dread to think!

 

[Hermiod]

I don't find it a problem at all. You're dead right. Good.

Why mention it then ?

For some reason, I don't think humans in the 22nd or 23rd centuries go around randomly spanking each other regardless of gender.

Kirk treated Elaan like he treated others he found to be immature like Trelane and Charlie - both male and both far more capable of causing havoc in reaction to Kirk.

Like most discussions of sexism, this has been a one way street. Uhura's skirt being too short is way worse than the fact that only three of the forty-two Starfleet personnel to die in the original series were female.

 

[Cheapjack]

I mention it, cos I've met women who were rabid feminists, who had no objection to being dead-armed for having an opinion, by other males, but found my stated preferences objectionable. Though I don't mind people having an opinion.

I like the Sigourney Weaver character from Aliens. She keeps the troup together when the men have given up and started crying when they find their guns don't work.

And, I tell you, I didn't like the fact that Janeway had to seem to have a gravelly, masculine, voice, to copy male mannerisms, in order to command. As if command is based on force only. She's supposed to be a decision taker par excellence, mainly! Maybe women in the 23rdC should be not too much like Servalan from Blakes Seven, not too much of and ice queen, but feminine and in command?

 

[Hermiod]

I mention it, cos I've met women who had no objection to being dead-armed for having an opinion, but found my preferences objectionable.

I don't understand what you mean here. What do you mean by "dead-armed" ?

I like the Sigourney Weaver character from Aliens. She keeps the troup together when the men have given up and started crying when they find their guns don't work.

That's because Ripley is the movie's hero, nothing to do with her being female. If they remade Alien or Aliens today, however, the new Ripley would be a "butt kicker" and just beat up the Aliens bare-handed.

And, I tell you, I didn't like the fact that Janeway had to seem to have a gravelly, masculine, voice, to copy male mannerisms, in order to command. As if command is based on force only. She's supposed to be a decision taker par excellence, mainly! Maybe women in the 23rdC should be not too much like Servalan from Blakes Seven, not too much of and ice queen, but feminine and in command?

Janeway did not seem overtly masculine to me. She put on a show for her crew, but then in private we saw her emotions over things like hearing that Mark had moved on with his life.

She was occasionally let down by the writing which had her making bizarre decisions you'd never see from Picard or Sisko, however.