Things that don't add up:

Discussion in 'Star Trek: Discovery' started by Discofan, Jun 12, 2019.

  1. BeatleJWOL

    BeatleJWOL Commodore Commodore

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    To be fair, Sisko did chemical warfare the shit out of a planet and nobody seemed to say anything about it. :P
     
  2. serabine

    serabine Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    Yeah, but no one rewards him for it either, and even people like me who think that Sisko is a great captain recognize it as one of his darker moments. Won't see me twisting into a pretzel claiming what he did was the equivalent to, idk, stepping on someone's toes. :lol:
     
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  3. The Wormhole

    The Wormhole Admiral Admiral

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    So glad we clarified that. :rolleyes:
     
  4. Timo

    Timo Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Yup. A fairly central element to justice today is the sense of proportion: a mass murderer is supposed to get a heavier punishment than a jaywalker, be it for deterring others from attempting same, or for abstract reasons of comeuppance, or whatever. Planeticide and genocide are about as far removed from each other as those two... Although from our puny perspective the former actually is the greater act of destruction, while from the Trek point of view the latter is supposed to be.

    Still, the funny thing is that "war crime" is not in the UFP vocabulary at all, and (be it related or not) killing of billions is a deed the heroes seriously consider at least once per spinoff. They still sorta frown on certain methods, which is a rather good match on how mass murder today is a universally accepted practice but its exact methods of implementation a cause of some debate.

    Timo Saloniemi
     
  5. Novak Senkovic

    Novak Senkovic Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    the second season stardates are so inconsistent and go back before the battle of the binary stars making me think the result of michael burhnam;s interference in the timeline
     
  6. The Wormhole

    The Wormhole Admiral Admiral

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    Because, of course stardates have never been inconsistent before.

    I said sarcastically.
     
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  7. XCV330

    XCV330 A Being of Pure Caffeine Premium Member

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    stardates are garbage. always have been.
     
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  8. Timo

    Timo Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    The first season started out with Burnham nailing the date with a seven-inch chromium steel one and a sledgehammer, pairing an as such plausible stardate with a definite Earthdate. A promise of great things to come? Nope, by the end of the season we had already gotten backward progression.

    The second season started out incoherent - but the finale had Burnham revisit the early adventures in her fancy cosplay suit, quoting coherent, consecutive and theoretically more or less consistent stardates in lieu of the original random ones. A promise of great things to come, part two? Well, the ship has sailed beyond stardates now...

    ...A promise of great things to come, stardate-wise, and by default?

    Timo Saloniemi
     
  9. Longinus

    Longinus Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I sure as hell did!
     
  10. Novak Senkovic

    Novak Senkovic Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    yeah but even though the other shows and movies have inconsistencies, discovery's inconsistencies for such short length of seasons are the most inconsistent out of all the star treks. Incidentally I have written a book on stardates explaining how they work and outlining explanations for where it doesn't and the inherent inconsistencies for all the star trek tv shows and movies, and explanations for those inconsistencies, discovery's was the hardest to explain.
     
    Last edited: Aug 2, 2019
  11. King Daniel Beyond

    King Daniel Beyond Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Where can one find this book?
     
  12. The Wormhole

    The Wormhole Admiral Admiral

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    Bold statement. I think you'll find the other Treks are just as spotty with their continuity, even within the time frame of the first twenty-nine episodes as Disco is currently in. I mean, within the first twenty-nine episodes of TOS they cycled through three different names of the service the Enterprise and its crew belong to and made at least two contradictory references to when the show is supposed to takes place, neither of which correspond with what we now consider the canonical time frame for the show. And don't forget James R Kirk. TNG's first season finale had first official contact between the Federation and Romulans in sixty years despite just a few weeks earlier both fleets were facing off at the Neutral Zone about to go to war.

    I could go on, but citing examples from the other shows will likely be written off as "not true Star Trek."
     
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  13. BillJ

    BillJ History’s Greatest Monster Premium Member

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    Stardates are gibberish.
     
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  14. Amasov

    Amasov Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I don't know.

    On Discovery, 31 seemed to mostly hide in the shadows and only appeared when necessary. They had a vested interest in what was going on with the Red Angel and Spock, so, naturally, they are going to be far more present. And it wasn't as if they appeared before the whole fleet; it was in front of DIscovery and the Enterprise. Even with Control getting out of hand and destroying most of the subspace communications network, there's every reason to believe that aside from those directly involved, all of those events went entirely unnoticed by the rest of Starfleet.
     
  15. Novak Senkovic

    Novak Senkovic Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    other treks went on for alot longer TOS had 30 episodes a season, TNG VOY AND DS9 have 26 epsiodes a season and went for 7 seasons each, but DISCO has so far only had 10 or 15 epsidoes for it's first season and 14 for its second.
     
  16. The Wormhole

    The Wormhole Admiral Admiral

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    Which is why I specified in my post "the first twenty-nine episodes." Disco has had twenty-nine episodes so far, so I used that point to measure it to the other series when they were at their twenty-ninth episodes. Which means:
    TOS Operation Annihilate
    TNG Elementary Dear Data
    DS9 Second Sight
    VGR Prototype
    ENT Minefield
     
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  17. Novak Senkovic

    Novak Senkovic Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    On another
    Oh sorry, I stand corrected
     
  18. Novak Senkovic

    Novak Senkovic Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    And speaking of my book on stardates I am trying to get it published, does anyone have any connections that can help get it published or give me some advice?
     
  19. Prax

    Prax Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I'd imagine TOS has some discrepancies regarding stardates, but I'd also imagine TNG/DS9/Voy having an impeccable record for tracking them correctly.

    if you Google "List of TNG/DS9/Voyager episodes," you'll get the Wikipedia pages for them, and they have them all listed with each episode. By the time you get to DS9 and Voyager, you'll see a stardate for like every episode, including time travel stories.

    Enterprise doesn't use them, but gives the date for most episodes and they also track the passage of time very accurately.
     
  20. Tuskin38

    Tuskin38 Vice Admiral Admiral

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    While stardates meant nothing in universe (except in the Kelvin Timeline movies where the first 4 digits were the earth year), the TNG era shows were about 90% consistent, they tried to make sure each stardate for each following episode was a higher number than the last. It didn't always workout, but it did most of the time.

    Out of universe, the second number of the stardate represented the season in TNG. For example, an episode of TNG with a stardate in the 41000 range is Season 1, 42000 is Season 2 etc.

    At first the '4' stood for the 24th Century, but that rule was ignored in later seasons and shows. DS9 and Voyager however did keep up with the second number increasing after every season. Voyager season one was mostly in 48000, Season 2 49000, season 3 50000 etc.
     
    Last edited: Aug 4, 2019