The lack of national diversity in the Discovery cast...

Discussion in 'Star Trek: Discovery' started by eschaton, Nov 9, 2017.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. Brainsucker

    Brainsucker Captain Captain

    Joined:
    Dec 3, 2007
    Location:
    South East Asia
    And they need A Chinese descent Singaporean with their Singlish accent. It will be spectacular :D But then some people will protest because of the broken English. But if they deny broken English why care about accent from the first place?

    Singlish :


    That's why as a non native English speaker I choose American Accent. Because it's easier to hear than the other English accent.
     
    Last edited: Dec 5, 2017
    starsuperion likes this.
  2. Albinator

    Albinator Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

    Joined:
    Jan 17, 2016
    I was simply quoting somebody else. It's not really something I've focused on.
     
  3. eschaton

    eschaton Commodore Commodore

    Joined:
    Oct 2, 2017
    Culber might be played by a Puerto Rican actor, but there is no reason to presume he is a Latino character. He was given a very "anglo" first name, and a Scotish last name.

    Honestly, I find this refreshing. One thing that Trek has really lacked is biracial and racially ambiguous characters. Even though Trek shows a future where interracial human relationships (and of course inter-species relationships) are common, we see very few humans who don't fit typical white/black/Asian racial archetypes (which I recognize was due to the limits of casting at the time, but still). Up until now, there have been far more hybrid human/alien characters shown on Trek than characters with two human parents of different races. The one main cast member who did have biracial ancestry (Alexander Siddig) was originally intended to be "no race in particular" but they ended up giving him two brown, Middle Eastern looking parents.

    Thus, I think it's a great thing that Culber (and Tyler for that matter) are given generic "anglo" names but are clearly of mixed background. Realistically, most people by the 23rd century in Trek should be at least somewhat mixed, unless they happened to grow up in the middle of China, Central Africa, or another area that didn't get too many migrants from the rest of the world.
     
    Vger23 likes this.
  4. Crazy Eddie

    Crazy Eddie Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Apr 12, 2006
    Location:
    Your Mom
    To the extent that "race" is even meaningful as a descriptor of people -- let alone in the context of this discussion -- this is not even universally true. Race is almost purely a social construct, and the definition of "race" depends entirely on the context of the culture we're talking about. This is why Americans have racial categories of "black, white, hispanic/latino" and for some odd reason consider "hispanic/latino" and "black" to be mutually exclusive. Latin American countries have completely different categories that include black, white, mestizo/mixed, indio, gringo, etc, and the definition of those categories is sometimes drastically different. It's telling, for example, that by any conventional AMERICAN definition I would be considered black while in most Latin American countries I wouldn't even pass for mestizo and in Africa they would consider me to be white.

    They probably have the same blood type too, and I think Jason Isaacs and Michelle Yeoh were wearing the same color underpants.

    What difference does this make, again?

    No, regional differences are a product of generation upon generation of cultural and social evolution. That there are few "racial differences" between black people on opposite sides of the planet or in different countries doesn't change the fact that, genetically, ethnically, linguistically, culturally, religiously and even socially they are ENTIRELY different groups that have very little in common. It has nothing to do with the actual characteristics of the people in question and everything to do with racial categories being specifically constructed to combine otherwise completely unrelated ethnic groups into larger categories for some reason or another. Different cultures do this for different reasons, the most obvious of which is a way to delineate social/economic status, real or perceived.
     
    Hound of UIster, Vger23 and Satron like this.
  5. Crazy Eddie

    Crazy Eddie Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Apr 12, 2006
    Location:
    Your Mom
    Not entirely sure who that is... but is it not possible to be all three at once? In which case, it depends on what he identifies as most strongly.
     
  6. DEWLine

    DEWLine Commodore Commodore

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2003
    Location:
    Ottawa, Canada
    If you're interested in Molina:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alfred_Molina

    And it strikes me that one could certainly consider themselves as part of all three ethnic categories at once. Other members of each will accept or reject such logic as it suits them, of course, but the rejection doesn't override the fact itself.
     
  7. Nerys Myk

    Nerys Myk Rocky Racoon Premium Member

    Joined:
    Nov 4, 2001
    Location:
    Somewhere in the black mountain hills of Dakota
    He's also a naturalized American citizen. Crazy!!!
     
  8. Ovation

    Ovation Vice Admiral Admiral

    It is a wonder that anyone can hold multiple layers of identity simultaneously. ;)

    (Of course, citizenship can be voluntarily acquired, while ethnicity cannot--it's why organizing society around a membership principle that allows for an active choice is superior to one based on the whims of chance--but that's a debate probably best kept for a different forum)
     
    Nerys Myk likes this.
  9. Nyotarules

    Nyotarules Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

    Joined:
    Jan 20, 2016
    Location:
    London
    One can argue if Earth is the racial paradise of Trek from the 22nd century onwards, either migration between nations states will decline to almost zero, after all why move to the 'West' or the North of the globe when the standard of living is the same wherever you are? (Burkhina Faso will be just as good as Canada, even better with no snow!)
    Or due to ease of migration, there will be more pale folks in Africa and more brown folks in China (China's 21st century colonial past with Africa caught up with it just as 19th century Europe's colonial past did).
    The Lunar colony and Mars should be even more diverse than Earth.
     
    Last edited: Dec 7, 2017
  10. eschaton

    eschaton Commodore Commodore

    Joined:
    Oct 2, 2017
    I can buy that there would be large groups of monoracial people even in Trek's 23rd/24th century in the Old World, because most people would stay close to home. Not so for the former USA. I was fine with how they did it with the Sisko family, but realistically speaking, there shouldn't be black and white Americans any longer if racism has been truly defeated. The way America has worked historically has been that once a group has been assimilated, it intermarries into the majority, and loses its distinct identity. It's rapidly happening right now with Jewish people, East Asians, and Hispanics. It hasn't happened with African Americans because of cultural inertia on both sides. But if we didn't have the same legacy of racism, most black people would vanish (this is happening now in the UK, which had a big migration of blacks from the Caribbean in the mid 20th century - they outmarried to such an extent there are now more biracial people with Caribbean ancestry than "pure" black people.

    The absolute worst, however, was when isolated human colonies were found - like the The Masterpiece Society, The Ensigns of Command, and Children of Time. Despite being descended from very small founding groups, and isolated from generations, the locals were always white with a couple of black folks mixed in. :brickwall: I mean, I know how casting works in Hollywood, but they really should have given it a bit more thought.
     
  11. Jackson_Roykirk

    Jackson_Roykirk Commodore Commodore

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2007
    Location:
    Pennsylvania, USA
    Yes...We had the Chinese descent Malaysian actress playing someone with a Greek last name and a (possibly) Anglo first name who spoke English with a difficult-to-place accent.

    But, dammit Jim, they killed her off!
     
    Last edited: Dec 7, 2017
  12. Brainsucker

    Brainsucker Captain Captain

    Joined:
    Dec 3, 2007
    Location:
    South East Asia
    And you know what, someone complain about her English some time ago. Not all English Accent are good English. If you really want National Diversity, don't expect good English in your show. Their English become weird because of their own natural language dialect take part on their way of speaking.
     
  13. Captain of the USS Averof

    Captain of the USS Averof Commodore Commodore

    Joined:
    Jul 26, 2016
    Location:
    Greece
    I’m Greek but my England is very best and bye the weather it is getting bester and bester. :ouch:
     
  14. XCV330

    XCV330 Commodore Commodore

    Joined:
    Sep 24, 2017
    Location:
    L5
    More left handed officers or we riot.
     
    Feron, Vger23 and Nerys Myk like this.
  15. Nerys Myk

    Nerys Myk Rocky Racoon Premium Member

    Joined:
    Nov 4, 2001
    Location:
    Somewhere in the black mountain hills of Dakota
    Sinistrphobia is rampant.
     
    Feron and XCV330 like this.
  16. Crazy Eddie

    Crazy Eddie Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Apr 12, 2006
    Location:
    Your Mom
    A left handed riot would be the most awkward thing in the world. People would be flipping cars the wrong way, smashing the passenger side windows of cars, stealing TVs from Best Buy but having to stop and use the OTHER door on the way out...
     
    AlanC9, Feron and GeekUSACarl like this.
  17. ralfy

    ralfy Commander Red Shirt

    Joined:
    Jun 2, 2013
    Related:

    Why Michelle Yeoh, Daniel Wu, and other Asian film actors are hitting small screens

    Some points raised in the article:

    1. For movies, increasing box office revenues from foreign markets. For TV, trying something new, audiences showing greater interest in such, especially cultures and philosophical views from other countries.

    2. Streaming platforms are very influential, especially given a market involving most countries worldwide, tens of millions of subscribers, more than 400 TV shows, and billions of dollars in investments.

    3. There are still restrictions in some areas, but various Chinese companies are not only buying rights to see shows but now planning to make their own.
     
  18. Megapolis

    Megapolis Lieutenant Junior Grade Red Shirt

    Joined:
    Oct 22, 2017
    No, "we" are not joking. :cool:

    The primary authority of Starfleet, which is Starfleet Command, is located in San Francisco, USA. This proves that it isn't just what the series are focused on because it's an American show, but that it is the very structure of humanity's main representative in the Star Trek universe.

    Furthermore, take ENT: "Breaking the Ice" with the following image:

    [​IMG]

    Why would a fourth grade student from Ireland send this drawing to the USS Enterprise? LOL!
     
    Last edited: Dec 19, 2017
  19. middleagednerdgirl

    middleagednerdgirl Lieutenant Junior Grade Red Shirt

    Joined:
    Jun 21, 2017
    The tie-in novel Desperate Hours establishes that Georgiou is a married name. I don't recall if it revealed what her maiden name was or where she was from, but I think it might have. Michelle Yeoh's accent on the show is her own, it's Malaysian and I for one enjoyed hearing it.

    Jason Isaacs has said he explicitly chose not to use an English accent to avoid comparisons to Patrick Stewart, which I find understandable. He is very good at accents, could have chosen virtually any variant, and I suspect went with something relatively subtle that's also appropriate for a military guy.

    Given that he was going with an American accent, I do wonder why Shazad Latif did the same. Surely one English accent would have been fine and lent a little variety. Someone in the hierarchy must have decided Ash Tyler needed to be American for reasons not apparent to me.

    Marina Sirtis definitely has a London accent, but it's not nearly strong enough to be described as "Cockney." That is the London equivalent of a really thick Brooklyn accent.
     
  20. starsuperion

    starsuperion Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

    Joined:
    Mar 28, 2010
    Location:
    Virginia, USA
    This is what you get when SJWism is introduced into various fandoms. Like a plague, it's never enough for those people. Welcome to progressive wonderland that is 2017-2018. Simple diversity is not enough, your genre must go the extra mile, or its bigoted.
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.