Spoilers Strange New Worlds General Discussion Thread

[Alan Roi]

Imagine being a showrunner trying to come up with a unique concept for Star Trek (A coming of age story! A civilian drama!) only to have to settle for… the Pike show, with a template more or less established by DSC S2.

Why aren‘t fans clamoring for offbeat ideas as a matter of course? Is it because it‘s easier to build common expectations around the obvious thing (like a Captain Sulu series seemed like the show to make in the 1990s)? There are resources that can be spent one way or another, so why do that on this principle of “Hold it… there, now that was good, don’t touch it and gimme three seasons.”

Fans aren't clamoring for offbeat ideas because many of them view Star Trek as pure nostalgia and literally nothing else. I mean, do you see these fans clamoring for Picard to break new ground? No, you see them wingeing at anything that distinguishes Picard from TNG and clamoring for cameos from TNG, DS9 and VOY characters. These are the people who want Start Trek to be what it was when they were 13 and TNG, as an example, was there to provide reassurance and reinforcement of that reassurance week in week out. It's a very common phenomenon these days, and not just with Star Trek.

 

[Rao Van Tickle]

Fans aren't clamoring for offbeat ideas because many of them view Star Trek as pure nostalgia and literally nothing else. I mean, do you see these fans clamoring for Picard to break new ground? No, you see them wingeing at anything that distinguishes Picard from TNG and clamoring for cameos from TNG, DS9 and VOY characters. These are the people who want Start Trek to be what it was when they were 13 and TNG, as an example, was there to provide reassurance and reinforcement of that reassurance week in week out. It's a very common phenomenon these days, and not just with Star Trek.

On the one hand, wishing for comfort TV is perfectly understandable and human, especially combined with familiarity. So for that alone I can't be angry with each and every single one of those fans. On the other hand... the raging, whining, entitled, endlessly complaining and shitting on other people's enjoyment, etc. section of fandom - It's more than just annoying. Yet...

For many years I struggled to "find my way" and experienced a raging clinging to familiar behaviour and environment (and rejecting change) as a coping mechanism, which made my situation only worse. That all left scars, and still open wounds, to this day. So, I may be projecting my displeasure over my still unresolved relationship with that past (and present, tbh) on some of those fans, because, in some ways, they remind me of myself. And make me be angry even with those who don't deserve it, perhaps. Ah, life IS a... challenge.

Also, "Star Trek: Good Old Times"? So... GOD? When I see how many are caught by Mount's charm (myself being not completely unaffected...), i find it disturbingly fitting, lol!

 

[Rao Van Tickle]

Also, "Star Trek: Good Old Times"? So... GOD? When I see how many are caught by Mount's charm (myself being not completely unaffected...), i find it disturbingly fitting, lol!

Alright, I'm dumb,tired AND got the flu atm, I didn't realize it's actually GOT, which has it's own problems...

 

[Alan Roi]

Alright, I'm dumb,tired AND got the flu atm, I didn't realize it's actually GOT, which has it's own problems...

Well, my suggestion was "Good Old Days..."

But of course that leaves us again with the old chestnut, "Why does God need a spaceship?"

 

[Rao Van Tickle]

Well, my suggestion was "Good Old Days..."

I'm even worse off than I thought... Well, fool myself once, shame on me, fool myself twice, double-dumbass on me, I guess!

 

[Lord Garth]

Well, my suggestion was "Good Old Days..."

"The Good Old Days"

1. Aliens with large heads abduct The Captain and give him a choice of three mates.
2. The Captain has to kill his best friend before he kills everyone else in cold blood.
3. The Enterprise gets trolled by a little kid who pretended to be a big monster.
4. A space pimp gives drugs to the women he's prostituting.
5. The Captain is split in two and the evil half commits attempted rape.
6. A salt vampire goes on a killing rampage.

All things people who want the "good old days" back would be furious about if Alex Kurtzman did anything like these.

 

[Alan Roi]

"The Good Old Days"

1. Aliens with large heads abduct The Captain and give him a choice of three mates.
2. The Captain has to kill his best friend before he kills everyone else in cold blood.
3. The Enterprise gets trolled by a little kid who pretended to be a big monster.
4. A space pimp gives drugs to the women he's prostituting.
5. The Captain is split in two and the evil half commits attempted rape.
6. A salt vampire goes on a killing rampage.

All things people who want the "good old days" back would be furious about if Alex Kurtzman did anything like these.

And you haven't even gotten to the "Good Old 'Berman Era' Days yet."

 

[Lord Garth]

And you haven't even gotten to the "Good Old 'Berman Era' Days yet."

I'll keep it simple.

The Captain calls a Senior Staff Meeting. Then he arrives at a decision he should've been able to arrive at without a long, boring meeting. Meanwhile, insert day-in-the-life story. And cap it all off with a Technobabble Solution at the end. The Captain gives a long self-congratulatory speech. Then says, "Warp nine, Engage!" Roll Credits.

 

[Boris Skrbic]

Wait, would Pike show enthusiasts accept one which opens with his injury, then goes on a metaphorical star trek examining Pike’s adjustment from his point of view, eventually continuing past his return to Talos IV to give us his life with Vina? What’s prolonged life in an illusion really like? Is it an illusion if one can direct it?

 

[F. King Daniel]

"The Good Old Days"

1. Aliens with large heads abduct The Captain and give him a choice of three mates.
2. The Captain has to kill his best friend before he kills everyone else in cold blood.
3. The Enterprise gets trolled by a little kid who pretended to be a big monster.
4. A space pimp gives drugs to the women he's prostituting.
5. The Captain is split in two and the evil half commits attempted rape.
6. A salt vampire goes on a killing rampage.

All things people who want the "good old days" back would be furious about if Alex Kurtzman did anything like these.

*sound of Seth MacFarlane taking notes*

 

[Alan Roi]

*sound of Seth MacFarlane taking notes*

That sound is of him drawing dicks in the margines.

 

[Noname Given]

Call it: Star Trek: Pike (no way it'll be confused with anything else...oh, wait... ).

Seriously, I HOPE it's one of the two new unannouced live action Star Trek series - no matter what they call it.

 

[Rao Van Tickle]

I'll keep it simple.

The Captain calls a Senior Staff Meeting. Then he arrives at a decision he should've been able to arrive at without a long, boring meeting. Meanwhile, insert day-in-the-life story. And cap it all off with a Technobabble Solution at the end. The Captain gives a long self-congratulatory speech. Then says, "Warp nine, Engage!" Roll Credits.

It does hurt a little to recognize quite a couple of TNG episodes I really like in there, but it's still funny. Anyway, it doesn't diminish my love to TNG. Which means, I absolutely wouldn't mind if that formula took a backseat to more variety in storytelling in future Trek series. Well, it would be even nicer to see this formula now and then pop up unexpectedly, on rare occasions.

 

[mattman8907]

I’m hoping if the series is made they bring in Robert April. He could be what Forrest was for Archer, a mentor but also a friend and giving Pike assignments.

 

[plynch]

An episodic format that explores what-if concepts and issues of the day in allegoric terms (i.e. science fiction) is an inherently valid format. People who would like that format need not be denigrated as reactionaries against the purportedly "better" new mode of serialization and melodrama.

 

[Boris Skrbic]

An episodic format that explores what-if concepts and issues of the day in allegoric terms (i.e. science fiction) is an inherently valid format. People who would like that format need not be denigrated as reactionaries against the purportedly "better" new mode of serialization and melodrama.

Of course not, since Star Trek can support many different formats at the same time. You can have a season examining Pike’s life after the Enterprise (having teased Kirk and his initial crew only to send them away and see if that’ll start a Kirk show movement). We can even see Pike trying to avoid the accident despite the stated inevitability. And then it happens: now it’s about the months of adjustment before the return to Talos IV. After that you can basically have anything, “illusion of the week” with the subtext of Pike, Vina and the Talosians as the driving force, probably also including the other aliens there. For all we know Pike’s adventures on DSC are an illusion (including a vision of himself as an older man) and the TOS-style flashback to “The Cage” was the only part that’s real.

I’m not saying it needs to be this exactly, but I’m not seeing other ideas either. It’s as if nobody needs to say anything because the common consensus for “Pike show” is that obvious: a) the remainder of Pike’s Enterprise missions b) the ship and the crew we’ve seen with minor changes c) plug in aliens of the week.

 

[dinzy]

Star Trek:1701. Season 1 will follow the format of recent Doctor Who seasons. Stand alone episodes with hints at something that teases the finale. They can now 'risk' doing an episodic show with 3 other highly serialized Trek shows, assuming s31 fits the mold. Season 2 will learn from Season 1 and either continue in the same format or make changes.

 

[Mudd]

Imagine being a showrunner trying to come up with a unique concept for Star Trek (A coming of age story! A civilian drama!) only to have to settle for… the Pike show, with a template more or less established by DSC S2.

Why aren‘t fans clamoring for offbeat ideas as a matter of course? Is it because it‘s easier to build common expectations around the obvious thing (like a Captain Sulu series seemed like the show to make in the 1990s)? There are resources that can be spent one way or another, so why do that on this principle of “Hold it… there, now that was good, don’t touch it and gimme three seasons.”

To be blunt, It's because the franchise has a pretty unimpressive track record where innovation is concerned.

The constant insistence that there are "as many stories to be told as there are planets" is belied by Trek's own history.

 

[Mudd]

Also also, while I'm at it, I'd prefer if they recast Number One. Am I weird?

Yeah, pretty much.

 

[Boris Skrbic]

To be blunt, It's because the franchise has a pretty unimpressive track record where innovation is concerned.

The constant insistence that there are "as many stories to be told as there are planets" is belied by Trek's own history.

Yes, but since fans are under no contractual obligation to CBS, they could be asking the company to give free rein to an experienced, highly successful writer who would be motivated enough to make Star Trek into prestige television. It’s not like fans have that kind of influence either way, so what does it matter if CBS does one thing and fans clamor for an entirely different approach, innovative but without any detail since you can’t develop a show by polling?

It’s almost like it would be too funny to publicize that kind of a disconnect with franchise leadership and make it clear to everyone that fan demands don’t work. This way, if the request is low-hanging enough, maybe CBS will go ahead with a Pike show and thereby “confirm” that fan campaigns do help.