Spoilers Star Trek: Strange New Worlds 2x10 - "Hegemony"

[fireproof78]

I guess I never made it clear, but I'm a strong proponent of Strong Towns and leftist urbanism and think that is the future of sustainable urban design, so to purposefully replicate something that goes against that movement does feel ideological to me. So I definitely have my biases. lol

I'm all for self-sufficiency and working on it myself for the most part. So I enjoy driving, commute regularly to work, ride my bike, and build things myself. Will eventually grow my own food.

I am 100% biased. Of course it's ideological-it's people saying "Hey, we want to try this thing!" And finding people of a similar mind, a community if you will, and creating their own. They are not anti-anything; just living out what they want.

 

[Mudd]

I guess I never made it clear, but I'm a strong proponent of Strong Towns and leftist urbanism and think that is the future of sustainable urban design, so to purposefully replicate something that goes against that movement does feel ideological to me. So I definitely have my biases. lol

It sounds like a movement with a ideological bias.

 

[Jedi Marso]

I guess I never made it clear, but I'm a strong proponent of Strong Towns and leftist urbanism and think that is the future of sustainable urban design, so to purposefully replicate something that goes against that movement does feel ideological to me. So I definitely have my biases. lol

The thing to remember is that they aren't literally replicating it as it existed then, just the style of if in a true post-scarcity society.

 

[UssGlenn]

personally I think you can't divorce the aesthetic from the context (otherwise no one would have an issue with the Confederate flag), but I get that some people can.

A flag isn't a good example, it's made to represent a specific thing. If the Confederate Flag aesthetic was bad we couldn't fly the American flag because they are both red, white and blue and have stars representing states. It's really hard to poison an aesthetic.

 

[Nerys Myk]

I mean, Pike rides them as a hobby. I don't know if he road a horse from his cottage to the space dock to get to the Enterprise in the first episode or if he did the normal thing and hop on April's shuttlecraft. But maybe he really likes his horses.


Something like Bridgerton created some discourse because the creators just assumed a Regency Period England where racism didn't exist/slavery was ended immediately and the King married a Black woman. I haven't watched the show so I've only read/seen what people thought about that representation, but I know that some people thought it was an oversimplification of race issues.

But I suppose in the way that some people can watch Bridgerton and not think it's problematic, you can probably find 5000 people who would be fine with ignoring any social issues in midwestern America in order to live the aesthetic.

Well they aren’t living in Midwestern America in the 1900s so there is no reason their attitudes on race, sex and gender should reflect the attitudes of that era. It’s not all or nothing.

 

[Guy Gardener]

I guess I never made it clear, but I'm a strong proponent of Strong Towns and leftist urbanism and think that is the future of sustainable urban design, so to purposefully replicate something that goes against that movement does feel ideological to me. So I definitely have my biases. lol

Imagine that there are 5000 colonists there right now, and if everything went right, which it already hasn't, then over the next 40 years, they were going to receive another 50 million colonists with expectations of living in the "first world" even as that definition of first world living changes, year after year.

The small town plan used in phase one, is either going to be demolished or turned into a museum.

 

[firehawk12]

A flag isn't a good example, it's made to represent a specific thing. If the Confederate Flag aesthetic was bad we couldn't fly the American flag because they are both red, white and blue and have stars representing states. It's really hard to poison an aesthetic.

I used that example because I just had this on my mind. lol

To some Japanese animator, it really is just an aesthetic.

Imagine that there are 5000 colonists there right now, and if everything went right, which it already hasn't, then over the next 40 years, they were going to receive another 50 million colonists with expectations of living in the "first world" even as that definition of first world living changes, year after year.

The small town plan used in phase one, is either going to be demolished or turned into a museum.

If they had planned to expand from a town to a fully populated city, there's a part of me that hopes they romanticized cars so much that they'd reproduce this:

I see the 401 outside my window if I'm ever downtown at work and I thank the great Space Koala that I don't drive. lol

I'm all for self-sufficiency and working on it myself for the most part. So I enjoy driving, commute regularly to work, ride my bike, and build things myself. Will eventually grow my own food.

I am 100% biased. Of course it's ideological-it's people saying "Hey, we want to try this thing!" And finding people of a similar mind, a community if you will, and creating their own. They are not anti-anything; just living out what they want.

I mean, I think this all started because I called the colonists Space Amish? I mean, it's a choice to want to design a colony that only allows single or dual story buildings and has grid like streets designed for vehicular transportation and not for pedestrians. That's all.

It sounds like a movement with a ideological bias.

Yes, of course. lol
I assume the people building a society after WW3 wiped out most of the people on the planet and learning from the Bell Riots that stratified urban design where poor people are stuck in one part of a city and rich people get to live in luxury are going to be ideological.

We’ll they aren’t living in Midwestern America in the 1900s so there is no reason their attitudes on race, sex and gender should reflect the attitudes of that era. It’s not all or nothing.

Sure, just like Cassidy Yates didn't find any issue reliving the 60ss through the Vic Fontaine simulation but why Sisko thought it was weird. (And just like I can see why people think Bridgerton is problematic despite the fact that it is also tremendously popular).

 

[fireproof78]

I mean, I think this all started because I called the colonists Space Amish?

Yes, because without context it doesn't make much sense. They use tech; they just selected an aesthetic.

Though, my first reaction should have been this:

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[Mr. Laser Beam]

Absolutely. I knew instantly that she was infected. Because of this.

Dammit! I hoped against hope they weren't going to kill off Batel, but I should have suspected they would.

 

[UssGlenn]

it's a choice to want to design a colony that only allows single or dual story buildings and has grid like streets designed for vehicular transportation and not for pedestrians. That's all.

Wait, do you have a problem with cars or wheeled vehicles in general because I'm sitting about 50 feet from a street grid that was designed in 1722.

 

[The_Baroness]

A good episode.

But...when Spock was placing the thrusters on the Cayuga..why did he place one INSIDE?

 

[Tuskin38]

Yes, because without context it doesn't make much sense. They use tech; they just selected an aesthetic.

Some Amish groups do use tech, but just for work or travel.
There's some that do use electricity at home, but it has to be self-generated by water or solar or wind, something natural.

 

[fireproof78]

Some Amish groups do use tech, but just for work or travel.

How did I know that was going to come up?

Should have anticipated it.

 

[Tallguy]

but it has to be self-generated by water or solar or wind, something natural.

As opposed to unnatural? Is that magic?

 

[Okmyx]

A good episode.

But...when Spock was placing the thrusters on the Cayuga..why did he place one INSIDE?

Don't ask. I questioned Spock's placement of the rockets many pages ago and was ridiculed for thinking I knew more about rockets than Spock

 

[Tallguy]

Don't ask. I questioned Spock's placement of the rockets many pages ago and was ridiculed for thinking I knew more about rockets than Spock

You don't know more about rockets than Spock. But you might know more than the writers. And hopefully more than the Gorn.

 

[Tuskin38]

As opposed to unnatural? Is that magic?

Haha. Fair. Just something provided by nature (therefor god) I think was the reasoning.

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According to Enterprise, Gorn can survive in the vacuum of space

 

[eschaton]

I suppose I should give my two cents...better late than never (I've been on vacation in Amsterdam, and though I watched the episode last night, finding time to collect my thoughts has been difficult.

While this episode was watchable in the moment, I ultimately found it empty calories; a contrived tangle of plot threads and attempts at open emotional manipulation which - for me personally - just didn't work (other than the inclusion of Scotty - the actor is too young, but otherwise so picture-perfect I cannot complain).

In a series that has notably been mostly character-focused, it's notable how little character really matters here. Yes, there are little nods to the relationships between Pike and Batel and Spock and Chapel respectively, but these threads seem undercooked. Spock at least has a bit of an edge with his regret over where things were left with Chapel, but she comes across as more object than character here. The choice to create false tension around her death, in particular, just seemed ill-thought-out, given we all know she will survive to the TOS era (same issue with M'Benga being part of the group captured by the Gorn). With Pike, all you can really tell is he cares about her, and the actors playing both have great chemistry. There's just not a lot of depth there.

Take this out, and it's just one plot contrivance after another, the most notable being Chapel's plot armor, surviving an attack that killed everyone else on the Cayuga. Or at least, I hope it killed everyone else, considering Spock and Chapel made absolutely no effort to see if anyone else was still alive onboard the fragment of the saucer section that still had atmosphere. That whole subplot was frankly offensive. I understand that Chapel matters to Spock but in the universe of Star Trek, nameless randos not played by lead actors also have lives with worth and meaning. The show treated them as set dressing in a way that was quite offensive, in that it presumed our intelligence was too low to actually think about the responsibilities that Spock and Chapel had as Starfleet officers.

The planet-side stuff was less objectionable - in part because even though it's fanservice, Scotty just works here. My main issue is just that what SNW did with the Gorn is something I'm completely unenthusiastic about (though of course, something better could come of this next season). I also think that since no new ground was really trodden regarding the Gorn as of yet, this is basically just pulling from the same well we've seen before, once you take the melodrama out.

Did that mean I hated it? No, it was a perfectly serviceable hour of Star Trek, and worked fine as a cliffhanger. It was just...kinda dumb, and unfortunately, not in the "dumb fun" kind of way.

 

[Sci]

Those magnificent bastards, giving us Star Trek's first season finale cliffhanger since "Unimatrix Zero, Part I" aired 23 years ago.

(No, I don't think "The Expanse," "Zero Hour," or "What Sweet Sorrows, Part II" count.)

And with the strikes, there's a possibility we'll be left hanging until 2025!

 

[Tuskin38]

Apparently Enterprise Season 4 mirror episodes said the Gorn could survive in vacuum.