Spoilers Star Trek: Picard 3x10 - "The Last Generation"

[Sci]

I miss explorations from a ship and doesn't drown itself with LEFTIST politics, like the Anson Mount show, but tell a neutral story where I can understand both sides of the issues and not feel attacked because on my conservative views.

You mean like TNG?

From "Encounter at Farpoint, Part I:"

(A flash of light and [Q] is wearing a 20th century US military uniform, with a cigarette in his hand)
Q: Actually, the issue at stake is patriotism. You must return to your world and put an end to the commies. All it takes is a few good men.
PICARD: What? That nonsense is centuries behind us.
Q: But you can't deny that you're still a dangerous, savage child race.
PICARD: Most certainly I deny it. I agree we still were when humans wore costumes like that, four hundred years ago.​

From "The Neutral Zone:"

RALPH: Believe me, I'm fully cognisant of where I am, and when. It is simply that I have more to protect than a man in your position could possibly imagine. No offence, but a military career has never been considered to be upwardly mobile. I must contact my lawyer.
PICARD: Your lawyer has been dead for centuries.
RALPH: Yes, of course I know that, but he was a full partner in a very important firm. Rest assured, that firm is still operating.
PICARD: That's what this is all about. A lot has changed in the past three hundred years. People are no longer obsessed with the accumulation of things. We've eliminated hunger, want, the need for possessions. We have grown out of our infancy.
RALPH: You've got it all wrong. It's never been about possessions. It's about power.
PICARD: Power to do what?
RALPH: To control your life, your destiny.
PICARD: That kind of control is an illusion.​

From Star Trek: First Contact:

LILY: It took me six months to scrounge up enough titanium just to build a four-metre cockpit. How much did this thing cost?
PICARD: The economics of the future are somewhat different. You see, money doesn't exist in the twenty-fourth century.
LILY: No money! That means you don't get paid.
PICARD: The acquisition of wealth is no longer the driving force in our lives. We work to better ourselves ...and the rest of humanity.​

Or maybe Star Trek: Deep Space Nine.

From "Past Tense, Part I:"

BASHIR: What is this place?
SISKO: A Sanctuary District.
BASHIR: Twenty first century history is not one of my strong points. Too depressing.
SISKO: It's been a hobby of mine. They made some ugly mistakes, but they also paved the way for a lot of the things we take now for granted.
BASHIR: I assume this is one of those mistakes.
SISKO: A bad one. By the early twenty twenties there was a place like this in every major city in the United States.
BASHIR: Why are these people in here? Are they criminals?
SISKO: No. People with criminal records weren't allowed in the Sanctuary Districts.
BASHIR: Then what did they do to deserve this?
SISKO: Nothing. They're just people without jobs or places to live.
BASHIR: So they get put in here?
SISKO: Welcome to the twenty first century, Doctor.​

And:

WEBB: I thought you didn't want to get involved.
SISKO: We've changed our minds.
WEBB: Glad to hear it. We can use all the help we can get. This place is about to explode. Most of us agreed to live here because they promised us jobs. I don't know about you, but I haven't been on any job interviews lately, and neither has anyone else. They've forgotten about us.
SISKO: So what do we do?
WEBB: We make them remember. The day after tomorrow, we're going to hold a rally outside the Processing Centre. I want everyone to be there. Gimmies, ghosts, even the dims. I want to remind the people outside that we haven't done anything wrong, that we're not criminals, and that we don't deserve to live like this.​

And:

BASHIR: Every building we go to, it's the same story. They can't all be full.
SISKO: Don't be so sure. One of the main complaints against the Sanctuary Districts was overcrowding. It got to the point where they didn't care how many people were in here. They just wanted to keep them out of sight.
BASHIR: And once they were out of sight, what then? I mean, look at this man. There's no need for that man to live like that. With the right medication, he could lead a full and normal life.
SISKO: Maybe in our time.
BASHIR: Not just in our time. There are any number of effective treatments for schizophrenia, even in this day and age. They could cure that man now, today, if they gave a damn.
SISKO: It's not that they don't give a damn, Doctor. It's that they've given up. The social problems they face seem too enormous to deal with.
BASHIR: That only makes things worse. Causing people to suffer because you hate them is terrible, but causing people to suffer because you have forgotten how to care? That's really hard to understand.​

And that's to say nothing of the anti-creationist perspective of episodes like "In the Hands of the Prophets" (DS9).

Star Trek has always espoused certain leftist beliefs.

Deeply, deeply unhappy that the Titan has become the new Enterprise. The Enterprise should be the grandest ship in the fleet, not that little bucket.

I dunno, I think there's something to be said for the idea of we the audience rooting for an Enterprise who is a bit of an underdog for once.

Wait, so Deanna took the helm and she didn't crash the ship?

Realistically, Deanna must be an extremely talented pilot. She may not be on par with Data 3, but she was able to correctly orient the Enterprise-D saucer section relative to the surface of the planet and arrest enough of its velocity during a violent atmospheric entry that not only did she prevent the saucer from breaking up in the atmosphere but landed almost completely intact with extremely few casualties. That is an act of piloting that would in the world of Star Trek be the equivalent to the Miracle on the Hudson.

But Raffi was more in need of closure to her own arc than Soji was. Soji was at least shown to be exploring, and pretty much done with at the beginning of season 2. Data and Soji could have done with their moment, but they at least both had separate, sort of, closures.

I have no idea how you could say that. Soji's story has only barely begun. Her arc is far from closed. Seriously, she still needs to figure out what kind of person she's going to be and what kind of life she's going to lead. She's the equivalent of a 23-year-old. She needs to figure herself out, and she needs relationships with family to do that. It would have been wonderful to see Picard guide her as an ersatz grandfather in S2 and to see her finally meet her father in S3, if the money had allowed. (I still contend that Soji could have served most of the narrative purposes Tallinn served in S2 and that therefore there was no reason to have Isa play Kore that season.)

theres also the potential political and criminal fall out over torturing changelings for years. But then almost all the witnesses to that are dead.

All but one...

*hard cut to Section 31*

Gotta add Vadic to the list of Section 31 operations that have come back to bite the Federation in the ass.

Question: if Data is so adept as piloting the ship, why was he not the helmsman from Day 1?

I mean, the guy was always gonna be better at almost any of these kinds of jobs. So either you rotate him across a lot of different disciplines, or you make him jack-of-all-trades at Ops.

Also...how messed up was it for Beverly to be the one who fires the weapons that they believe will kill her son and Picard? You could have at least done it for her, Geordi.

I think that was an intentional choice. Like, if all else fails, she will rescue her son from the living death that is assimilation this way, because that's the most loving thing she can do for him at that point.

This is why I think it's being canceled a bit early, TBH.

Star Trek: Discovery is not being cancelled "early." Five seasons is a very long time in modern streaming television. This isn't the 1990s anymore; streaming shows almost never get more than three seasons.

 

[Citiprime]

For sure if Picard S3 does well, it will be the formula that Paramount Plus will want to use going forward.

But how much nostalgia is there left to strip mine?

Honestly I'm surprised they don't just re-do The Original Series. Complete the 5 year mission.

How exactly is a “Legacy” Picard-based series strip mining nostalgia, but “Strange New Worlds,” a series that literally redid a variation of TOS “Balance of Terror,” different?

 

[fireproof78]

but will those people (the majority it seems) be happy if Matalas were try something new with new characters?

My magic Trek ball says "No."

 

[eschaton]

Same here but it's nice to be talked down to from time to time for the things I like. Makes me feel special

I wasn't so much saying that DIS didn't have fans, only that it's not easy to describe who they are in terms of demographics/interests, and networks love niche marketing.

 

[fireproof78]

I wasn't so much saying that DIS didn't have fans, only that it's not easy to describe who they are in terms of demographics/interests, and networks love niche marketing.

"Twas a joke, my friend. Nothing more.

 

[eschaton]

Star Trek: Discovery is not being cancelled "early." Five seasons is a very long time in modern streaming television. This isn't the 1990s anymore; streaming shows almost never get more than three seasons.

I said "canceled early" insofar as the show isn't ending on its own terms. That they had to reassemble for reshoots for a series finale shows that.

The sting for DIS fans must be harder now though. When it was announced people thought there was a pull back on Trek as part of the industry-wide belt tightening, but now we have Starfleet Academy, Section 31, and later TV movies on the horizon, so it does feel singled out.

 

[SpocksOddSocks]

I have no idea how you could say that. Soji's story has only barely begun. Her arc is far from closed. Seriously, she still needs to figure out what kind of person she's going to be and what kind of life she's going to lead. She's the equivalent of a 23-year-old. She needs to figure herself out, and she needs relationships with family to do that. It would have been wonderful to see Picard guide her as an ersatz grandfather in S2 and to see her finally meet her father in S3, if the money had allowed. (I still contend that Soji could have served most of the narrative purposes Tallinn served in S2 and that therefore there was no reason to have Isa play Kore that season.)

Well, she had an arc of finding out she was a synth, then hunted, then not hunted, and off being an explorer/ambassador for that synth homeworld. It might not be perfect, but it's much more of a complete arc that Raffi had, which was my initial argument.

 

[Noname Given]

It seems the budget was pretty tight, I wonder if it was because S2/S3 were filmed back to back? Or did the TNG actors just cost that much?

I don't think the budget was that tight. It was spent on getting the other 6 to reprise their roles, including the cameos like Michelle Forbes; and from what I've read, the Ent-D Bridge set rebuild was VERY EXPENSIVE. (As was continuing to film in LA.)

Those are probably the main reasons that PICARD S3 for the most part was a 10 episode 'botte show' with little 'on location' shooting.

 

[STEPhon IT]

She might use Janeway's "Do it!"

Or maybe just a simple "Go!"

Wait a minute??? I thought the GOAT said "Engage!" before helm launched Warp drive? And I think she also said "Proceed" for other orders?

 

[eschaton]

Well, she had an arc of finding out she was a synth, then hunted, then not hunted, and off being an explorer/ambassador for that synth homeworld. It might not be perfect, but it's much more of a complete arc that Raffi had, which was my initial argument.

Soji didn't really have character growth though, because she had this weird personality transplant in the penultimate episode of Season 1, when she somehow got all her memories back and became A-OK with genocide for like 5 seconds.

Raffi at least showed a pretty consistent direction with her character.

 

[fireproof78]

How exactly is a “Legacy” Picard-based series strip mining nostalgia, but “Strange New Worlds,” a series that literally redid a variation of TOS “Balance of Terror,” different?

You didn't ask me but I'll wade in because my disinterest in Kirk and the Balance of Terror episode redux in SNW is my biggest black mark on that series, right after the Gorn.

Nostalgia is like a sword, and it can be used with finesse or it can be used for grand sweeping actions that look cool and amount to nothing but spectacle. It be used to hack (not in the hack writing sense but just rough cuts in to the memories) or it can be used to build upon the past. It's an extremely fine line that works in some instances and fails in others (TNG has examples of both, Spock in Unifcation as a positive, McCoy and Scotty as lesser). It works far better if everyone is on the same page as to what is being celebrated in the nostalgia. The callback to Balance of Terror was lesser simply because it felt so on the nose and an excuse to bring Kirk in. Same with Scotty and McCoy, neither of whom added much there.

This season has fascilated back and forth between the finnesse and the roughness of these approaches. And it shows because many like it because it gives the warm fuzziness of nostalgia, but that's not the only thing I want in a story. And so, for me, nostalgia cannot supersede a story interest. Were the Balance of Terror nostalgia had Pike to guide me through, Season 3 was sporadic in characters to guide me and connect with.

Mileage will vary as to the effectiveness of this.

The sting for DIS fans must be harder now though.

Does it end well? That will ease the sting for me.

 

[trek.]

The sting for DIS fans must be harder now though. When it was announced people thought there was a pull back on Trek as part of the industry-wide belt tightening, but now we have Starfleet Academy, Section 31, and later TV movies on the horizon, so it does feel singled out.

But the STA show as well as S31 are both directly descended from DSC. Even so far as tilly is (unfortunately) probably going to be in the STA show...

 

[TimeIsAPredator]

Well, she had an arc of finding out she was a synth, then hunted, then not hunted, and off being an explorer/ambassador for that synth homeworld. It might not be perfect, but it's much more of a complete arc that Raffi had, which was my initial argument.

Somewhere between blaa blaa recovering addict and being a Blade Runner character she got to have sex with 7 of 9.
One of the greatest arcs in Trek if you ask me

 

[Sci]

How exactly is a “Legacy” Picard-based series strip mining nostalgia, but “Strange New Worlds,” a series that literally redid a variation of TOS “Balance of Terror,” different?

I think the difference is that PIC S3, by bringing back literally the same actors playing the same characters, is orienting its storytelling in this sort of "get the band back together" mindset, whereas by having new actors play a combination of legacy and newly-created characters, SNW is balancing nostalgia with the idea of trying to hit fresh new notes. PIC S3 is the the old band playing its greatest hits one last time plus one or two new songs; SNW is a new band with a fresh lineup playing a combination of covers of old classics and new hits.

 

[Racefuel]

How exactly is a “Legacy” Picard-based series strip mining nostalgia, but “Strange New Worlds,” a series that literally redid a variation of TOS “Balance of Terror,” different?

Because they made it clear that the different command styles and moments lead to different outcomes. They didn't rip off Balance of Terror for a new series with different characters, they're literally showing us how badly things would go if it wasn't Kirk in the chair at that time.

Its a variation of the road less travelled idea, not a ripoff.

Not everything is binary, yes and no, black and white, original or ripoff.

You can have nuance and variation. Star Trek fans used to be able to appreciate that.

 

[fireproof78]

I think the difference is that PIC S3, by bringing back literally the same actors playing the same characters, is orienting its storytelling in this sort of "get the band back together" mindset, whereas by having new actors play a combination of legacy and newly-created characters, SNW is balancing nostalgia with the idea of trying to hit fresh new notes. PIC S3 is the the old band playing its greatest hits one last time plus one or two new songs; SNW is a new band with a fresh lineup playing a combination of covers of old classics and new hits.

Well put and better than I did.

Because they made it clear that the different command styles and moments lead to different outcomes. They didn't rip off Balance of Terror for a new series with different characters, they're literally showing us how badly things would go if it wasn't Kirk in the chair at that time.

Its a variation of the road less travelled idea, not a ripoff.

Not everything is binary, yes and no, black and white, original or ripoff.

You can have nuance and variation. Star Trek fans used to be able to appreciate that.

Nah, we like our sledgehammers.

 

[STEPhon IT]

Yup. The 32nd century is boring. Too bad we have to go through a academy series set I'm that time frame. It will be like watching WB star trek. I'm sure there will be lots of tears. Lol

There's always hope that it isn't, at least the showrunners are trying to take fans away from PICARD. Maybe the writing will get better.

 

[Tuskin38]

At least the showrunners are trying to take fans away from PICARD.

That's not what they're doing.

Picard is over.

 

[TimeIsAPredator]

But the STA show as well as S31 are both directly descended from DSC. Even so far as tilly is (unfortunately) probably going to be in the STA show...

The character and her plots were terrible but I grew to appreciate Wiseman especially after you realize the absolutely massive void of charisma after she left.

She could do absolutely fine in STA with a soft reboot and better dialogue.

 

[TRON JA307020]

We don't "have to." We can not watch. Just like how I chose to not sit through Enterprise, which I found boring and a copy of much better plots

I need to review it for others so ill have to watch.