Science is fucking cool!
Spoilers Star Trek: Discovery 5x09 - "Lagrange Point"
- Thread starter Commander Richard
- Start date
It was about season 3 I realised that Disco's problems were features, not bugs.
The show evolved into what it did, for better or worse (well, worse). One could argue some of the course corrections played out in other shows, rather than Discovery itself.
It will be interesting to see what juicy behind-the-scenes tidbits come out in the ensuing years once parties involved have a bit more latitude to speak freely.
The show evolved into what it did, for better or worse (well, worse). One could argue some of the course corrections played out in other shows, rather than Discovery itself.
It will be interesting to see what juicy behind-the-scenes tidbits come out in the ensuing years once parties involved have a bit more latitude to speak freely.
That's not how it works.
Wasn’t Michael Chabon the showrunner for S1? Akiva Goldsman was on the writing staff, and unless I’m wrong he was the only carryover from S1 to S2. Also, S2 and S3 had the exact same writing staff, aside from Goldsman leaving S3 in favor of working on SNW.
But yeah, when it comes to Kurtzman’s influence, the only show he truly involved himself in was DISCO. It’s the only show he’s been active as a showrunner with multiple writing credits and the only Trek he participated in as a director.
While he does have a writing credit for both first episodes of PIC and SNW*, he’s pretty much served more of a managerial role that hires people he trusts that can run those shows (same with LDS and PRO). It’s extremely important to remember that Terry Matalas got the gig because Alex Kurtzman trusted him with it. Matalas isn’t some white knight that snuck past Kurtzman and bravely gave the fans something Kurtzman was determined to deny fans.
*= I’d bet Kurtzman only participated in those initial episodes as that would grant him the title of co-creator. This was exactly what Rick Berman did to ensure creator credit on the shows under his watch as well as story credit on all TNG films.
While he does have a writing credit for both first episodes of PIC and SNW*, he’s pretty much served more of a managerial role that hires people he trusts that can run those shows (same with LDS and PRO). It’s extremely important to remember that Terry Matalas got the gig because Alex Kurtzman trusted him with it. Matalas isn’t some white knight that snuck past Kurtzman and bravely gave the fans something Kurtzman was determined to deny fans.
*= I’d bet Kurtzman only participated in those initial episodes as that would grant him the title of co-creator. This was exactly what Rick Berman did to ensure creator credit on the shows under his watch as well as story credit on all TNG films.
I really think people who hate Kurtzmann don't really know what he does. The people who hate him for the direction Discovery took are really talking about Paradise and that where their creative differences (not hate) should be directed.
The Picard season 1 showrunner was Michael Chabon
Also that ‘hack’ as you called him is the reason we have Strange New Worlds. Probably my favourite series since DS9.
He isn’t the showrunner, but he did help create it and is a big part creatively.
So its not his vision of what star trek was to be?
I get a kick out of people who understand how Ira Steven Behr was the DS9 showrunner while Berman was the franchise EP, but yet at the same time think Kurtzman is personally responsible for writing and producing every show under his aegis.
No, he only co-wrote the first episode.
Multiple people contribute to shows.
He has story credit on one episode, IIRC.
What would this "vision" be?
DISCO with its cinematic high octane, arc based mix of action and emotion?
PIC with its cynical, dark and yet increasingly nostalgic serial storytelling?
LDS an animated sitcom heavily laced with in jokes?
SNW with its episodic, genre fluid approach?
PRO an animated serialized kids show?
Seems like he hires people with a vision and lets them implement it.
It's all just Ira Steven Behr and Ron Moore being left largely to their own devices in DS9, only across the entire current streaming franchise and with far more mixed results. This isn't the first time an overseeing producer let showrunners more or less do their own thing.
Alex Kurtzman is a weird beast. I think he doesn't "get" Star Trek, nor does he give a shit, and he's one of the worst (but most successful) writers in Hollywood.
Why? Because he finishes what he starts. He won't get bogged down by perfectionism
If shit doesn't work, he'll put it out anyway (see "Legend of Zorro" or Transformers).
He WILL absolutely get shit done though!
And, much like JJ Abrams, he has absolute magic fingers when casting. Seriously - they pull up some absolute no-names, and get actors that are reliable, can act and are charismatic as fuck. Consistently. One of the hardest things in showbiz!
Also, while not loving Trek, he seems to love his work. I've never heard anyone ever saying anything bad about him. Everyone seems happy to work with him, he creates a positive environment, he's always friendly and professional, he gives people chances & he let's them do and experiment on their vision and styles. That's a quality in itself.
So yeah. While I would call his output "mixed" to negative - he's giving us a shitload of output! And some of it turns out to be actually really, really good. And it's at least very diverse. Something we wouldn't get if there were no output at all.
So, in conclusion, I wouldn't call him a "visionary" it even a "creative". I would call him a "content creator". But one of the most consistent and best at that.
Why? Because he finishes what he starts. He won't get bogged down by perfectionism
If shit doesn't work, he'll put it out anyway (see "Legend of Zorro" or Transformers).
He WILL absolutely get shit done though!
And, much like JJ Abrams, he has absolute magic fingers when casting. Seriously - they pull up some absolute no-names, and get actors that are reliable, can act and are charismatic as fuck. Consistently. One of the hardest things in showbiz!
Also, while not loving Trek, he seems to love his work. I've never heard anyone ever saying anything bad about him. Everyone seems happy to work with him, he creates a positive environment, he's always friendly and professional, he gives people chances & he let's them do and experiment on their vision and styles. That's a quality in itself.
So yeah. While I would call his output "mixed" to negative - he's giving us a shitload of output! And some of it turns out to be actually really, really good. And it's at least very diverse. Something we wouldn't get if there were no output at all.
So, in conclusion, I wouldn't call him a "visionary" it even a "creative". I would call him a "content creator". But one of the most consistent and best at that.
The only things I think Kurtzman is creatively involved with is PIC Season 1, Discovery and the upcoming Starfleet Academy. I don't think he's involved creatively with the Section 31 movie.
Every other Trek show I think he's just listed as an Executive Producer because he's the head of Trek, and for the live action shows, the head of Secret Hideout.
Just like how Rod Roddenberry is listed as an Executive on everything (except Prodigy) because he's the head of Roddenberry Entertainment.
Edit: I just remembered he's listed as a co-writer on the SNW Season 1 premier. So he had some influence there, but based off interviews and PR, SNW seems to be more Akiva Goldsman's baby.
Every other Trek show I think he's just listed as an Executive Producer because he's the head of Trek, and for the live action shows, the head of Secret Hideout.
Just like how Rod Roddenberry is listed as an Executive on everything (except Prodigy) because he's the head of Roddenberry Entertainment.
Edit: I just remembered he's listed as a co-writer on the SNW Season 1 premier. So he had some influence there, but based off interviews and PR, SNW seems to be more Akiva Goldsman's baby.
Last edited:
This is what Chabon himself said about his involvement.
"So I’m still an executive producer on ‘Picard.’ I’m writing two episodes. I was there breaking the second season, all the way through. I was engaged, I think, in exactly the same degree as I was on Season 1 up to the point where it’s time to start production — and at that point, I will not be doing the same thing at all. I’ll just be continuing to give notes and, and be involved as an EP.”"
https://blog.trekcore.com/2020/03/star-trek-picard-michael-chabon-finale-interview-roundup/
Things changed after that, IIRC.
Chabon is a thousand times the writer that fanboy Matalas is.
Similar threads
- Poll
- Poll
- Poll
