Spoilers Star Trek: Discovery 2x10 - "The Red Angel"

Discussion in 'Star Trek: Discovery' started by Commander Richard, Mar 21, 2019.

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Hit it!

  1. 10 - Leaps and bounds ahead of anything Trek has done before.

    10.6%
  2. 9

    24.2%
  3. 8

    28.0%
  4. 7

    14.8%
  5. 6

    8.5%
  6. 5

    3.8%
  7. 4

    3.4%
  8. 3

    2.5%
  9. 2

    0.8%
  10. 1 - Oh boy, what a mess.

    3.4%
  1. Timelord Victorious

    Timelord Victorious Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Equipped with time travel technology he then then started to jump through time to right what once went wrong, never to return?
     
  2. jespah

    jespah Taller than a Hobbit Moderator

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  3. The Leewit

    The Leewit Ensign Newbie

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    What an extraordinary episode! The drama and the feels are all there: a heartfelt funeral send-off for Ariam; Saru's elegant singing courtesy of Doug Jones' actual vocal gift; introducing Lt. Nilssom, the original actress who has played Airiam; the awkward confrontation between Georgiou, Stamets, Culber, and Tilly; the pep talk that therapist Admiral Cornwell gives Culber; Michael righteously punching Leland for her parent's demise; the satisfying sibling bonding between Michael and Spock; the emotional reconnection between Georgiou and her "surrogate daughter" Michael; the troubling witnessing of Michael's tortured dying; Leland's gruesome eyeful reward; finally Mom with wings...yes that mom.
     
  4. Agony_Boothb

    Agony_Boothb Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    So what is your issue, exactly?
     
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  5. XCV330

    XCV330 Premium Member

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  6. Photoman15

    Photoman15 Commodore Commodore

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    Everyone seems to forget the lowly Starfleet Commander who "happened" to be stationed at an outpost by Bajor whose mother "happened" to be one of Bajor's Prophets who live in a wormhole with no temporal boundaries.
     
  7. Gingerbread Demon

    Gingerbread Demon I love Star Trek Discovery Premium Member

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    I wonder if you get CBS in a wormhole :) don't mind me I'm just being silly.
     
  8. Agony_Boothb

    Agony_Boothb Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    No, I mentioned him. No one can forget the Sisko.

     
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  9. The Leewit

    The Leewit Ensign Newbie

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    The showrunners have said that Discovery is all about Michael...the unfolding story is told from her perspective, much like Picard and Georgiou will have their respective show told from their perspective.
     
  10. Michael

    Michael Good Bad Influence Moderator

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    Well, that didn't click with me for some reason. It wasn't all bad – as usual I loved the Spock/Burnham scenes, the little moment with Nhan and Burnham in the corridor was nice, and I like that the reveal of who the Red Angel is was actually surprising to me – but the logic of what they were trying to do didn't work for me at all. Why would Burnham-Angel appear if Culber was standing by to resuscitate her? And I didn't follow the logic at all that it had to be Burnham who was the angel, since not all of the Red Angel appearances were linked to her.

    Having said all that, I'm still interested to see where the story goes from here. And to be honest I'm still not convinced the Preservers don't somehow figure into all of it, because the obelisk design just can't be a coincidence. Well, we'll see.

    No one? There sure weren't many, but there were some here who guessed exactly that. The way they kept mentioning Burnham's parents in a couple of the latest episodes laid the groundwork for this reveal, I think.

    Yup, I thought so, too. Will be interesting to see if they'll ignore her character as well or only let us learn more about here once they decide to kill her off. :lol:

    Ah, that's where I know that face from, thank you! I remember liking her on The Wire and think she got the chops to pull off a great performance.

    Really, what shot made you think that? That one?

    [​IMG]

    Looks to me as they are about the same length as they were in season one:

    [​IMG]

    Yup, would have been nice to actually see them destroy the station. That was a story thread that was kinda left hanging from last week. Sometimes it's weird what they decide to show and what not to show. The gazillionth CGI camera pan through the ship windows, for example. Although I must admit that I liked this one, because it's so seldom that we see shots from inside the saucer gap:

    [​IMG]

    Although, is it my imagination or are we seeing a naked person through one of the windows? :lol:

    [​IMG]

    I thought it to be a weird choice to have the full crew (!) attend the funeral with the ship on auto-pilot.

    That they don't like that plot contrivance in either instance? :shrug:
     
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  11. Lord Garth

    Lord Garth Admiral Admiral

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    When Spock insists that everyone stick to the plan that Burnham die for the Red Angel appear, even when everyone doubts it, it made me think back to "Spectre of the Gun". At the end of that episode, everyone else was also not 100% sure but Spock didn't waver and said they couldn't have the smallest doubt.
     
    Last edited: Mar 25, 2019
  12. Lord Garth

    Lord Garth Admiral Admiral

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    Two others, in fact. eschaton and IMC Headquarters. But I posted that before I checked any other thread. I don't remember everything everyone says offhand. I figured there was no point in editing what I said earlier because now it's there for other people to call me out on. Like now. :p
     
  13. The Leewit

    The Leewit Ensign Newbie

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    He truly did have her back...brother dearest. Another great moment from this episode.
     
  14. Takeru

    Takeru Space Police Commodore

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    They are obviously starting to turn Georgiou a bit more soft in preparation for her own series and/or her continued role on Discovery which I don't mind, I expected that but it still surprised me that she was the first one jumping to Michael's rescue.
     
  15. Amaris

    Amaris Guest

    She must still love Michael, at least her Michael, which she has transferred those feelings to our Michael. I rather liked that scene where they were talking before the experiment.
     
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  16. Michael

    Michael Good Bad Influence Moderator

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    At least three people. ;)

    And you didn't have to check any other thread. People in this very thread here were congratulating those who guessed correctly before your post. :p
     
  17. Michael

    Michael Good Bad Influence Moderator

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  18. eschaton

    eschaton Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I had the same issue. That was the point I was like "man, this episode is a bunch of melodramatic crap." Though it did right itself later on.

    I mean, in a broad sense I suppose you could say Leland was "responsible" for their deaths. But it was clearly a mistake, and everyone involved worked for Section 31. It's like if your parents are in the military, are killed in combat, and you eventually meet their commanding officer who planned the mission 20 years later. Yes, if it wasn't for that call, they would be alive. But to err is human. And it happened when she was a small child. And Leland was obviously wracked by guilt about it for decades. I can understand being confused, saddened - but filled with rage as if he was the murderer?

    I wonder if we as viewers were supposed to identify with Michael here, or see her in the wrong. Georgiou earlier in the season telegraphed something like this would happen. On the other hand, there's a symmetry between Leland's "responsibility" for Burnham's parents and Burnham indirectly causing the death of Georgiou is painfully obvious - meaning Burnham should have been able to identify with Leland.

    We know Section 31 has access to tech that Starfleet thinks is "futuristic" in general. Also, it's entirely possible that Mama Burnham upgraded the suit in the future.

    As I said, the bionural match thing may be accurate. Just because it was Mama Burnham in the suit this time doesn't mean it's always been her. Some of the earlier intervention into the timeline may have been future Michael. For example, Burnham would have a reason to save Saru and the Kepiens, but her mother wouldn't give a crap.
     
    Last edited: Mar 22, 2019
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  19. Mr Awe

    Mr Awe Vice Admiral Admiral

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    I thought about that angle too. While she would be forced to save herself, she could alter the approach to avoid the trap. She knows how they're trying to catch her and would be able to change her plan. Some tech to avoid the trap or alter the timing of her rescue--it is a time suit after all. In other words, rescue her before the trap is set.

    So, I'm glad it wasn't her because that would cause many complications and defies logic. Based on the information they had, including Michael in their plans to catch Michael didn't make sense. Ultimately it worked because it wasn't Michael.
     
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  20. Amaris

    Amaris Guest

    I have no problem with Michael's reaction to Leland's admission. It was her parents. Considering everything connected with Burnham started with the deaths of her parents, her reaction is completely understandable. Was it right? No. Yet it was very human.