Spoilers Star Trek: Discovery 2x05 - "Saints of Imperfection"

[Crazyewok]

I agree with Picard's decision not to infect Hugh.

Remember, the BORG is entirely made up of beings who have not chosen to be such, but were forcibly assimilated (injected with the Nanites), against their will.
And it was shown several times that beings could be removed from the Collective and still survive, without the need to continue assimilating others.

The only being in the Collective who truly deserved to be nullified was the Queen, as she was the only one who retained her Free Will after being assimilated.

Wiping out the entire Collective without at least trying to save as many as possible, is also Genocide.

Yeah tell that to the countless trillions in the delta quadrant that would likely get assimilated.

Bet all those are all thankful Picard held by his morals when a cube turns up in their system..........

 

[IMC Headquarters]

Is anyone else salivating over what delicious morsels of mirth Reno is going to deliver when she learns the how of Culber's return?

"Black Alert? Great! Let's bring back Prince. And Tom Petty. And hold the paprika."

 

[kirk55555]

Another very good episode. This season is on fire (in a good way). I'm even mildly interested in Section 31, which even Ds9, for as awesome as it is, didn't really accomplish that after maybe the first Section 31 appearance. That said, pretty much everyone of every rank knowing section 31 means that it makes no sense that the organization isn't common knowledge in DS9's time (if even people on a random ship like Discovery know about 31, then its pretty widely circulated info that couldn't just be erased). That isn't an issue for me, but its a bit odd. I expected everyone but Pike and Burnham to just be told they were Starfleet Intelligence agents, not have everyone just casually talk about section 31 and apparently know all about them and how they're a fairly shady organization.

Still its an interesting development, and the show overall is very good.

 

[Alan Roi]

There are good people on both sides?

If you need to be told good from bad, maybe a grown up Star Trek isn't for you.

 

[Longinus]

If you need to be told good from bad, maybe a grown up Star Trek isn't for you.

Considering how many people here are defending S31 approach on things, people obviously need to be told good from bad.

 

[Amaris]

If you need to be told good from bad, maybe a grown up Star Trek isn't for you.

I am not certain you’ve nailed the riposte on this one.

 

[Tuskin38]

lol

S31 (which inexplicably is now the official Federation Gestapo)

What a nonsense comparison. They're nothing alike.

 

[DaveyNY]

lol

What a nonsense comparison. They're nothing alike.

IF one has to delve that deeply into "Actual Science" to be able to enjoy a Science Fiction type of show, then perhaps one should be spending more time watching NOVA or the Science Channel.


I love to go to his site for all the Starship stuff he creates, but I don't bother reading his extremely bias opinion pieces.
He's just waaay to over the top most times.

 

[Amaris]

What a nonsense comparison. They're nothing alike.

Seriously! Section 31 is a morally lacking organization that dresses in black, acts above the law, working covertly to secure the interests of the Federation from threats foreign and domestic. They use methods and technologies not available to the average citizen, or peacekeeping force, and are willing to engage in genocide or murder to accomplish those goals.

The gestapo only did that for Germany. It’s totally different!

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

I am liking the idea that something terrible happens - either to, or caused by, Section 31 - that makes them go underground and become what we later see of them in DS9. And I also suspect that Georgiou will be responsible. She can't help being an emperor, after all.

 

[Alan Roi]

Seriously! Section 31 is a morally lacking organization that dresses in black, acts above the law, working covertly to secure the interests of the Federation from threats foreign and domestic. They use methods and technologies not available to the average citizen, or peacekeeping force, and are willing to engage in genocide or murder to accomplish those goals.

The gestapo only did that for Germany. It’s totally different!

So, in light of how you view Section 31, does the Federation deserve to survive if only the actions of a Section 31 can save it from annihilation?

 

[Amaris]

So, in light of how you view Section 31, does the Federation deserve to survive if only the actions of a Section 31 can save it from annihilation?

I think your question is too simplistic and framed in such a way as to invite only one way of thinking. Nothing occurs in a vacuum, and the choices we have rarely culminate in dualities where only one choice is the right one to make. That being said, genocide is not a viable answer, and an organization willing to engage in it is not one to be lauded, let alone trusted.

 

[rhllot]

It wasn't a great episode but it was entertaining enough. Burnham being the focus of every episode and appearing in almost every scene means it's never going to be a favourite show of mine but I enjoy Pike and the bridge crew. Tilly and the evil blob storyline ended finally. It lasted about 4 episodes longer than it should have. Not bothered about Culber. Just like everyone else who isn't Burnham, he's an underdeveloped supporting character. Alive or dead that's not going to change since it's unequivocally The Michael Burnham Show and always will be. Nice to see the Emperor again but Section 31 being out in the open so blatantly goes against their DS9 appearances when they were the biggest secret in the Federation. Even if they're disavowed it seems unlikely such an organisation could ever be totally erased from public consciousness.

The special effects on this show are amazing. Movie worthy.

Section 31 is now officially part of fleet intelligence.

Maybe the general public thinks that those people who dress in black suits and work for the government for 200 years are simply intelligence agents (they are), but only high-ranking officials know section 31 really.

When Sisko asked to know about them, the high command gave him an answer. Admiral Ross worked with Section 31

 

[matthunter]

I enjoyed this, bus found it the weakest episode of the season so far. Basically they were having difficulty in connecting the dots from last season. May and the Spore People could not manifest themselves in the "regular" universe (however they apparently have no problems in building an entire Bio-transporter), and this was the reason May initially gave for not being able to recreate Culber. It is then pointed out that Culber might be an exception because they have his DNA. What? They only thing transferred to the network was essentially his "Katra," his body and therefore his DNA stayed where it is.

You missed a step - the idea was that the crew could inject the bio-transporter with a sample of Culber's DNA once they were back out of the network. May was against the idea because it meant shutting down use of the bio-transporter for her to visit Tilly.

Using standard transporters, this is like the bit in TNG's Lonely Among Us where the crew have a transporter trace of Picard that can be used to recreate the matter component, but need the energy component that he's been transformed into.

 

[Alan Roi]

I think your question is too simplistic and framed in such a way as to invite only one way of thinking. Nothing occurs in a vacuum, and the choices we have rarely culminate in dualities where only one choice is the right one to make. That being said, genocide is not a viable answer, and an organization willing to engage in it is not one to be lauded, let alone trusted.

Ah, the famed non-answer dodge. You simplistically call S31 the Gestapo, and then accuse me of a simplistic response. What I added here was not appropriate in a civilized discussion so I have taken it out and apologize to all..

 

[Turtletrekker]

I think your question is too simplistic and framed in such a way as to invite only one way of thinking. Nothing occurs in a vacuum, and the choices we have rarely culminate in dualities where only one choice is the right one to make. That being said, genocide is not a viable answer, and an organization willing to engage in it is not one to be lauded, let alone trusted.

Exactly. Remember that Section 31s plan to win the Dominion War was to commit genocide against the Founders, which was poised to backfire spectacularly. It was only after the Federation and Odo delivered a cure for the illness that the war was ended.

 

[JoeZhang]

Ah, the famed non-answer dodge. Himmler would be proud.

Himmler ?

What a disgusting post.

 

[Alan Roi]

Is anyone else salivating over what delicious morsels of mirth Reno is going to deliver when she learns the how of Culber's return?

"Black Alert? Great! Let's bring back Prince. And Tom Petty. And hold the paprika."

Thank you, but I prefer my Tom Petty *with* paprika.

 

[Alan Roi]

Himmler ?

What a disgusting post.

Then perhaps peopls shouldn't simplistically use Nazi's as their goto and things like that wouldn't happen.

 

[cultcross]

Himmler would be proud.

Let's leave comparing fellow posters to Nazis out of the discussion, please.