Spoilers STAR TREK BEYOND - Grading & Discussion

Discussion in 'Star Trek Movies: Kelvin Universe' started by Commander Richard, Jun 29, 2016.

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Grade the movie...

  1. A+

    15.3%
  2. A

    27.8%
  3. A-

    21.5%
  4. B+

    14.6%
  5. B

    7.1%
  6. B-

    4.6%
  7. C+

    3.4%
  8. C

    1.6%
  9. C-

    1.6%
  10. D+

    0.4%
  11. D

    0.2%
  12. D-

    0.4%
  13. F

    1.6%
  1. fireproof78

    fireproof78 Vice Admiral Admiral

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    I just don't know if it would have been as balanced as the Doctor Who special. DW told his own story that crossed time and space. I think the plot line is appropriate that Orcci described, but it could have easily gone over to self-referential that would lack some broad appeal.

    I'm not the biggest DW fan, but I could certainly appreciate all the different nods in the 50th, while absolutely loving the story. It's a fine balancing act, that I'm not certain that concept was quite there.

    I'm not disagreeing with nostalgia just that it needs to be balanced with an original story.
     
  2. Timewalker

    Timewalker Cat-lovin', Star Trekkin' Time Lady Premium Member

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    What Doctor Who did right was a series of retrospectives of each era of the series (ie. each actor's Doctor and Companions), the webisode "Night of the Doctor" so we could see Paul McGann again (he wuz robbed of a TV series!), and participation in Peter Davison's "The Five(ish) Doctors Reboot" - not part of the official 50th anniversary stuff, but a really nice (and hilarious) way for the older surviving Doctors to participate in a non-official but still-approved way.

    The Star Trek 50th anniversary consisted of one movie that could have been shown any time. Basically CBS just ignored it.

    Sorry, but the new TV series doesn't count. It's not coming out in the right year and it's restricted to viewers who can access the website it's going to be shown on. Doctor Who was worldwide. Star Trek is for "Americans only."
     
  3. fireproof78

    fireproof78 Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Yes, it was well handled.
    Ok, I can't agree with the argument that it is "Americans only." Netflix is carrying it internationally, and Canada is getting in on the Space channel. It may not be the huge 50th that was expected, but the claim "Americans Only" does not bear up under evidence.
     
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  4. Smellmet

    Smellmet Commodore Commodore

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    I'm going to re subscribe to netflix when discovery comes out. I assume I'll be able to watch it in Britain?
     
  5. King Daniel Beyond

    King Daniel Beyond Admiral Admiral

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    Yep, Netflix in the UK is carrying Star Trek: Discovery
     
  6. Timewalker

    Timewalker Cat-lovin', Star Trekkin' Time Lady Premium Member

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    For me the Space Channel is part of a bundle of channels that costs $$ extra. I don't want most of what's included in that bundle, so I don't subscribe to the Space Channel. I didn't bother last year for Doctor Who (there's a website where each episode is available free for 7 days after it's broadcast).

    Maybe it will turn up on Canadian Netflix some day. Eventually. By that time I will probably not even notice. I've still got plenty of novels to read and there are nearly 10,000 Voyager stories on fanfiction.net, and many other fanfiction sites - as well as the print 'zines in my own collection.
     
  7. fireproof78

    fireproof78 Vice Admiral Admiral

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    It's still a fluid situation, and its uncertain how it will be released after the fact. Again, not indicative of "American Only" situation but rather one that will likely be adapting to the new market.
     
  8. Timewalker

    Timewalker Cat-lovin', Star Trekkin' Time Lady Premium Member

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    When this series was first announced, the information I got was that it would be shown on an American CBS website. Canadians are geoblocked from CBS' websites. The new information came out later.

    It's the same for me, no matter what. The Space Channel is not in my budget. I do have a Netflix subscription, but the number of shows and movies available here is extremely limited compared to the U.S. site.
     
  9. grendelsbayne

    grendelsbayne Commodore Commodore

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    Right, but that doesn't put you in any different situation than people in America. You would have to pay for the Space Channel. They would have to pay for CBS All Access. People everywhere else have to pay for Netflix. It's the pay to watch situation that's new to Star Trek and obviously plenty of people don't like that, but it is basically the same situation for everyone around the world (except those unfortunate countries that aren't getting any distribution at all). It has absolutely nothing to do with 'Americans only.'
     
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  10. fireproof78

    fireproof78 Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Yes, regardless of platform, there is still a need to pay for the new Trek. That is against the grain and not good news for everyone, but the news is still the same for everyone.

    And hey, the first episode is being broadcast on regular TV so at least that's available to be hated upon for free ;)
     
  11. Korusan

    Korusan Lieutenant Junior Grade Red Shirt

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    Beyond's only faults were having another 'bad guy wants revenge' story with no redemption at the end. I mean christ, you have Stringer Bell in your movie - he's a real bad boy - it would have been AWESOME to see him come around at the end. They actually fake it out a bit when he says "I have to say captain, I've missed being me"
     
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  12. Smellmet

    Smellmet Commodore Commodore

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    They teased it even more when they showed his refection in the shard of glass. I loved that bit, it made the ending less predictable when I first saw it, despite it being ultimately a predictable ending.
     
  13. Korusan

    Korusan Lieutenant Junior Grade Red Shirt

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    Yeah, that was a "good" fake out. I'm really pleased with all the little bits in the script here and there, like when Uhura notices the way Edison says 'federation' in the one video she keeps rewatching. It's because she remembered Krall saying it as they were walking up to that main base earlier in the film. Nice foreshadowing.
     
  14. M-Red

    M-Red Commander Red Shirt

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    After rewatching BEY numerous times on b/r, I just keep loving it more and more.

    Every time I watch it, I find new little bits and pieces at different points in the film. There was a lot of love and care put into its creation. It has a lot of heart, and I appreciate that a lot.
     
  15. Tuskin38

    Tuskin38 Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Most cable companies have individual channel options now because of the CRTC ruling last year.
     
  16. Timewalker

    Timewalker Cat-lovin', Star Trekkin' Time Lady Premium Member

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    That's nice, if you live in a region where you have access to such a cable company that has overall good service. Unfortunately, I don't. I have a choice between "usually adequate if you get a customer service agent who doesn't have cornflakes for brains" and "godawful."

    So no - Space is not offered as an individual channel for me. But Bravo is, so at least I can watch The Handmaid's Tale without breaking my budget or having to take half a dozen other channels I will never watch.
     
  17. RAMA

    RAMA Admiral Admiral

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    Since I'm tired maybe I might give it a rewatch.
     
  18. Cutie McWhiskers

    Cutie McWhiskers Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    ...SPOILERS FOLLOW, but am hoping enough time has passed since it came out on home video...



    What I liked:
    * feels like ST2TWOK style plot condensed into a standalone but done right
    * Scotty
    * Bones vs Spock
    * Destroying the ship early on
    * exploring the crashed, dead Enterprise
    * hiding the plot maguffin inside the crewmember's head
    * the bad guy and his history
    * the f/x
    * Beastie Boys and Public Enemy music felt germane to the plot as opposed to being nonsense
    * Bonus for the alien referring to how "ancient" the music was - loved this stuff and how it was set up!!
    * ditto for the motorbikes, it really was a good chase scene
    * Leonard Nimoy tribute to the Prime universe, which still exists
    * the philosophical exploration was really nicely done
    * the whole crew taking turns saying the Trek mission statement
    * Reminder that, in this universe, Kirk enlisted as a dare
    * once the alien lady says she needs a ship to get into the nebula, the story really ramps up and keeps a viewer's attention (IMHO)
    * the other Federation starship discovered, I forgot its name, that was crucial to the plot. Aagin, this stuff was pretty nicely written.

    What I disliked:
    * right off the bat, Kirk is shown to fail a big mission with the alien species
    * which not entirely related to the destruction of the Enterprise, which may have happened too early in the film and with little emotional attachment to the proceedings (a second viewing makes the scene far stronger)
    * more plot regurgitation from all the other Treks
    * more countless pointless, utterly stupid nods to past Treks to try to ironically appease fanboys despite fanboys loathing JJ's era since 2009 while not understanding why fanboys aren't liking it
    * Scotty felt too much like a 1st grade English teacher to the hot alien chick (who looks like the species in "Into Darkness" so I do like that there may be a tie-in)
    * incidental music with chorus singing "aaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhhh" and "uuuuuuuuuummmm" was trite years ago yet the industry feels as if more of it is necessary? I'll pass
    * How was Bones' line about "full head of hair" not a dig at William Shatner's history of wearing hairpieces, if not Gene Roddenberry's abhorrence to any captain of any era being bald since he didn't want Patrick Stewart unless he wore a wig...?
    * turbolift deck lights didn't flash in proper sync

    What I'm apathetic over:
    * Sulu's love life is shown, briefly. The writers meant well, George Takei wasn't keen on it (though he's referring to the Prime Universe version, so I wonder how much of the Kelvin timeline/alternate timeline changes he's even liked FWIW), but it wasn't overly done or treated as a soapbox issue taking up 100 minutes of screen time while putting the rest of the story to the side in the way some sci-fi feels is somehow necessary. The issue wasn't the sort of overt politicized fantasy that people were making it out to be that I was expecting. Interesting side note: as Gene himself told around 1979 ("The Motion Picture" soundtrack has bonus materials with a convention Q&A session) that he wanted to treat both genders as (sex) objects (which got the audience in thunderous applause). Obviously the media industry wouldn't allow much of that regardless of form and I wonder how he himself would have added to JJ-Trek and, indeed, modern TV shows like "Lost Girl" had he lived to see these all made.

    As brunt as Simon Pegg was at the time, he certainly and very rightly had a very valid point about criticizing the movie BEFORE actually seeing it. I didn't damn the movie prior to seeing it, but also wasn't giving the movie much of a thought thanks to how bad ST2009 was and how mediocre STID was (especially for the typical JJ'isms that remind me of "The Brady Bunch Movie"'s theatrical format from 1995). The promos for Beyond did somewhat intrigue me... A good friend told me that I would like the movie for its philosophical bent. He was right. I wish I had seen it sooner. Pegg and company did the franchise justice and even took the same trope of Trek 6 (and First Contact) and made it their own with introducing a new baddie we could love to hate as the movie progressed, leading to a great climax and denouement.

    The movie is closest in feel to Prime universe Trek, where it needs to the most. While adapting to modern day audiences. People who slagged it off in hating it outright probably should see it and see if the hate still exists. I was merely apathetic, but it really is a worthy Trek script, well acted and well made.

    I'll give it an 8/10 with ease.
     
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  19. Cutie McWhiskers

    Cutie McWhiskers Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Wouldn't that be a form of typecasting, expecting the same actor to do the same shtick in every movie all the time?

    IMHO, I thought they did it well. There seemed to be a moment of offering for redemption, but Krall did not take it. Unlike ST2009, which felt like the dispatch was casually written out, they had some decent suspense. But Krall rejected and Kirk and Starfleet were clearly good guys, so then what?

    Now I want to watch this movie again, to make sure I remembered the ending correctly. :)
     
  20. BillJ

    BillJ Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    After seven hundred-plus hours, it is tough to find a plot that hasn't been used at some point. :techman:
     
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