Way back in Day of Honor, Tom tried to sleep with Seven to spite B'Elanna.
Seven was completely innocent.
B'Elanna will never forgive her.
Seven was completely innocent.
B'Elanna will never forgive her.
Seven / B'Elena's relationship
- Thread starter Ghislaine H. B. BRAEME
- Start date
Wait when did tom try to do that?
There was some seven/Tom interaction in season 4 to be sure, and I got the impression the writers may have been setting it up as a possibility if Tom/B'llanna didn't work out.
But I don't recall him ever trying to sleep with her.
There was some seven/Tom interaction in season 4 to be sure, and I got the impression the writers may have been setting it up as a possibility if Tom/B'llanna didn't work out.
But I don't recall him ever trying to sleep with her.
All he did was ask Seven on a date, but it was seconds after B'Elanna refused to admit that she had deep loving feelings for him. So Tom's proposal to Seven was %50 "Hey Lanny if you're not interested in my shorts, I'll find some who is!" and %50 "I'm going to stick it to someone prettier, taller, smarter and blonder than you are because I want you to hurt from being immediately replaced by someone prettier, taller, smarter and blonder, like I'm hurting from being rejected by someone plainer, shorter, dumber and bruenette".
Subtle like high school.
Subtle like high school.
I could always relate more to Banana than Seven, as the former is abrasive, but not arrogant and almost all-knowing. I don't think they could ever be friends based on that alone. Seven's smug superiority and super-powers don't jive with Banana's very relatable struggles.
P.S. I don't remember who came up with this silly yet loving nickname for the poor woman, but since I am a child, I shall continue using it.
P.S. I don't remember who came up with this silly yet loving nickname for the poor woman, but since I am a child, I shall continue using it.
M
marlboro
Guest
Banana - I think this may come from the novel The Nanotech War. Tom has amnesia at one point and refers to her as "Banana." It was stupid, but unexpected, and yeah I laughed.
Good book, by the way.
I probably got it from there. I don't quite recall, but it vaguely rings a bell. I have to read that book again. Thanks!
For thise who think that Seven was arrogant and all-knowing, I would just remind them that although 100% born human, she was raised by a race of cybernetic creatures, equipped with artificial intelligence.
-> Data, the Doctor (Star Trek) and/or lately Isaac (The Orville), always felt/behaved arrogant and all-knowing face to human beings, especially Humans, who acted too often in a illogical and inconsistent manner, led by their useless and incomprehensible or ill-suited emotions.
As for B'Elena, she is an impetuous and angry young woman (able to be violent sometimes) difficult to master for anyone. Even if her relationship with Tom then her pregnancy have calmed her down a bit,her behavior is still unexpected.
I relate more on people like Seven (and Tuvok) than B'Elena, who always act with calm and logical .
-> Data, the Doctor (Star Trek) and/or lately Isaac (The Orville), always felt/behaved arrogant and all-knowing face to human beings, especially Humans, who acted too often in a illogical and inconsistent manner, led by their useless and incomprehensible or ill-suited emotions.
As for B'Elena, she is an impetuous and angry young woman (able to be violent sometimes) difficult to master for anyone. Even if her relationship with Tom then her pregnancy have calmed her down a bit,her behavior is still unexpected.
I relate more on people like Seven (and Tuvok) than B'Elena, who always act with calm and logical .
That's totally legit, interpretation-wise. I just find Seven obnoxious, but that's just me. Doesn't mean I'm right. I actually prefer to like everyone in a show. I just can't warm up to her, despite the actress being terrific.
Good thing we don't know each other in reality. You'd likely find me obnoxious too since I am very similar to the character in reality (but without the Borg aspect).
Same, Ghislaine...
Seven was a proud space Nazi.
Nothing stunted that pride.
Nothing.
Nothing stunted that pride.
Nothing.
I've always loved this....interaction betwen the two.
Good thing we don't know each other in reality. You'd likely find me obnoxious too since I am very similar to the character in reality (but without the Borg aspect).
I doubt that very much. You don't bend reality around you and become the focus of a show with far more interesting characters, and yet, everyone either loves you or envies you or sees the light after getting proven wrong somehow. I dislike her arrogance, the fact that she knows almost everything by authorial fiat, that she's not just brilliant and strong and awesome at combat but also has the voice of an angel and is super gorgeous and...ugh. I dislike how abrasive she is without suffering much consequence (unlike Banana, who does get some realistic feedback, at least). I dislike that the show mostly portrays her as being right in at least some way, even when she's wrong. I dislike that reality warps around her. I dislike the ridiculous last-moment romance with Chakotay. She reminds me of T'Pol the way she was in early episodes: smug and rude and yet wearing thick plot-armour and never actually getting called out on it in any way that matters.
I doubt very much that you're anything like that.
I suppose the intention was to create someone socially awkward who struggles to get accepted and to find humanity, but what I see is a super-powered space barbie wearing stupid clothes who gets special treatment for no reason and who never actually gets punished for being a right bitch to everyone. Maybe that's just me. Not saying I own copyrights for character interpretation. I wish she'd either got some actual, real flaws (nothing like FOR I AM TOO PERFECT AND ANALYTICAL FOR THIS FLAWED UNIVERSE!!! * thunderclap * ) or that they'd given her less screentime. But to each their own. Go forth and love her! I'm the first to defend basically everything about Enterprise, so there.
I do too actually since I have met peeps off online message boards in the past and we got along fine
; I was kidding a bit, but still a ring of truth is in there since I am an INTJ, which I suspect the semi-human form of Seven would match almost exactly (based on how the character functions/ her persona, and how she reacts/acts towards outside events). Plus I was abandoned by my birth mother as a baby, so no Borg, but maybe a similar early life experience with no known family background, etc.I disagree with part of your assessment here, but again , it's because my own introversion, aloofness, objectivity, and resistance to engage in what I deem "useless human interactions and societal norms" frequently (usually) gets misinterpreted by others as me being "arrogant", "a snob", and "egotistical". That is the farthest from the truth as I am highly pragmatic, objective and typically act on what I deem "best for all" rather than picking sides or favorites. And I am blunt. I once told my boss (in front of his boss) that I thought he was doing a terrible job in this one area at work and I proceeded to outline the specific details and my reasoning and give examples of where there had been a departmental breakdown in light of his lack of a strong performance. I was professional and (imho) respectful in this, but again... it was in front of his boss. I don't know any other female who would do that in front of two "superior" older men. And I'm sure I got labeled for it, but I also got two bonuses and a raise in years that followed that conversation, so who knows.
I think it is just you, but you are in good company. I am in the minority on this one (as per usual) , but I didn't see Seven at all as a super-powered know-it-all (space barbie maybe since the catsuit was ...ugh! although I did have the body for that when I was younger), but more how you describe as the intent. Or maybe the person(s) who wrote Seven also share some of those attributes or have my same personality type. Being a female INTJ is a real bore on some days let me tell you... I wish I knew more people like me; it would make life a lot easier to endure sometimes.
Can't argue the ridiculous romance with Chak point, though I do find him sexy as hell... would have rather seen Seven get it on with Janeway, but I'm likely in the minority there too.
I actually would have liked Seven/Janeway better, too. 
I think the major difference here perception-wise is that I cannot identify with a character like that one iota. To me, her bluntness is not that; it's arrogance. But that's, like you implied, subjective. I actually appreciate that there's someone who empathises with Seven in a personal way. I'll think of what you said the next time I'm ready to start bitching about her whilst watching VOY (or here). Maybe I'll manage to like her better, as I already think the actress is really good in this role.
Thanks for taking the time to share!
I think the major difference here perception-wise is that I cannot identify with a character like that one iota. To me, her bluntness is not that; it's arrogance. But that's, like you implied, subjective. I actually appreciate that there's someone who empathises with Seven in a personal way. I'll think of what you said the next time I'm ready to start bitching about her whilst watching VOY (or here).
Maybe I'll manage to like her better, as I already think the actress is really good in this role.Thanks for taking the time to share!
No sweat on your perception being different than mine... I'm the one who's "abnormal" or in the minority here. The next time I look at another human and think "why the heck did they just do that?!" (which happens about 50 times a day) I'll think of you. And I mean that in the absolute nicest way possible (i.e. no offense or "obnoxiousness" intended!!)
I flail a lot. You've probably noticed.
What I like about this place is that usually, we can all have interesting and friendly conversations even when we disagree.
For thise who think that Seven was arrogant and all-knowing, I would just remind them that although 100% born human, she was raised by a race of cybernetic creatures, equipped with artificial intelligence.
-> Data, the Doctor (Star Trek) and/or lately Isaac (The Orville), always felt/behaved arrogant and all-knowing face to human beings, especially Humans, who acted too often in a illogical and inconsistent manner, led by their useless and incomprehensible or ill-suited emotions.
As for B'Elena, she is an impetuous and angry young woman (able to be violent sometimes) difficult to master for anyone. Even if her relationship with Tom then her pregnancy have calmed her down a bit,her behavior is still unexpected.
I relate more on people like Seven (and Tuvok) than B'Elena, who always act with calm and logical .
I admire people like Tuvok (and Vulcans in general) and Seven because I am more like B"Elanna. Over time I've gotten better at watching the things I say and do which deepens my appreciation for Vulcan self control. Then I'll fall off the wagon and do something silly and wish I hadn't. Suppose it's better for my reach to exceed my grasp. Or as Spock said "Sometimes wanting a thing is more pleasing than having it." (named one of the cats B'Elanna- poor thing was pretty dumb but very loveable.)
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I do too actually since I have met peeps off online message boards in the past and we got along fine
I disagree with part of your assessment here, but again , it's because my own introversion, aloofness, objectivity, and resistance to engage in what I deem "useless human interactions and societal norms" frequently (usually) gets misinterpreted by others as me being "arrogant", "a snob", and "egotistical". That is the farthest from the truth as I am highly pragmatic, objective and typically act on what I deem "best for all" rather than picking sides or favorites. And I am blunt. I once told my boss (in front of his boss) that I thought he was doing a terrible job in this one area at work and I proceeded to outline the specific details and my reasoning and give examples of where there had been a departmental breakdown in light of his lack of a strong performance. I was professional and (imho) respectful in this, but again... it was in front of his boss. I don't know any other female who would do that in front of two "superior" older men. And I'm sure I got labeled for it, but I also got two bonuses and a raise in years that followed that conversation, so who knows.
I think it is just you, but you are in good company. I am in the minority on this one (as per usual) , but I didn't see Seven at all as a super-powered know-it-all (space barbie maybe since the catsuit was ...ugh! although I did have the body for that when I was younger), but more how you describe as the intent. Or maybe the person(s) who wrote Seven also share some of those attributes or have my same personality type. Being a female INTJ is a real bore on some days let me tell you... I wish I knew more people like me; it would make life a lot easier to endure sometimes.
Can't argue the ridiculous romance with Chak point, though I do find him sexy as hell... would have rather seen Seven get it on with Janeway, but I'm likely in the minority there too.
A female INTJ- o lordt- do you have a magic horn we can rub for luck? You are rare as Unicorns and never seen in the wild.
(sorry for the double post all)
So do I, but she started it earlier in S7.
In Human Error, she and holdeck Chakotay had a holdeck romance where, I think, she did sleep with him.
So, it’s not last minute out of nowhere. The writers had a basis established. Which I hated, and hoped never to see again.
TPTB gave themselves that fantasy gift at the end, for that Audience of Three.
So. Three people liked it.
I don't remember that happening earlier in the season at all, but I haven't watched Voyager in a good long while, so you're probably right.
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