Latecomer To This: JANEWAY DIED?!?
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I was responding to this because really the only purpose it serves was to make this discussion go in never ending circles.
As to your later comment about VAMB. We are Janeway fans, and regardless of what board we frequent we have a right to have our voices heard. I thought this was an open board, or was I wrong?
Yes it is an open board, but to say you have the right to do anything is stretching it a bit. You can shout and stomp your feet as much as you want, so can the opposites in this debate, but to say you have the right too, nope, more like you're allowed to.
Absolutely.
Likewise, those who disagree have every right to have their voices heard.
My point was that such statements as "I'm here to undo it," and the generalizations that keep being made about what women want in Trek fic are actually turning some off to your POV.
I started reading this discussion having absolutely no interest in the Voyager relaunch. I'd given up on it because I didn't like Golden's writing. And I'd pretty much stopped reading Trek lit in general.
I have changed my mind--thanks to the overreaction of the Janeway "militants." I figure anything that gets people this riled up has to be checked out.
I'll be buying *more* Trek books, including "Full Circle," thanks to you guys.
No shouting going on here-that would look like this-SHOUTING- and my feet are planted firmly on the couch!
oh and btw thanks for "allowing me" to participate
Ooh scary-I don't recall telling you not to
Absolutely.
Likewise, those who disagree have every right to have their voices heard.
My point was that such statements as "I'm here to undo it," and the generalizations that keep being made about what women want in Trek fic are actually turning some off to your POV.
I started reading this discussion having absolutely no interest in the Voyager relaunch. I'd given up on it because I didn't like Golden's writing. And I'd pretty much stopped reading Trek lit in general.
I have changed my mind--thanks to the overreaction of the Janeway "militants." I figure anything that gets people this riled up has to be checked out.
I'll be buying *more* Trek books, including "Full Circle," thanks to you guys.
Funny, my reaction and involvement here is the complete opposite. I was looking forward to "Full Circle" and was very much interested in the Relaunch until I heard Janeway's death might be permanent. Now I will just wait and see. I didn't read the relaunch books until years after they were released, so there's no need for me to rush to buy Breyer's books either.I started reading this discussion having absolutely no interest in the Voyager relaunch. I'd given up on it because I didn't like Golden's writing. And I'd pretty much stopped reading Trek lit in general.
I have changed my mind--thanks to the overreaction of the Janeway "militants." I figure anything that gets people this riled up has to be checked out.
I'll be buying *more* Trek books, including "Full Circle," thanks to you guys.
I just wonder what your reaction would have been if they killed off Seven instead.
I wonder this.....
If her death had been well-written (by whatever standards you hold)... would you have liked it then?
Kirk fans (like me) were irritated because his death was poorly written. However, Spock's was beautifully written and I liked it tremendously.
If her death had been well-written (by whatever standards you hold)... would you have liked it then?
Kirk fans (like me) were irritated because his death was poorly written. However, Spock's was beautifully written and I liked it tremendously.
Funny, my reaction and involvement here is the complete opposite. I was looking forward to "Full Circle" and was very much interested in the Relaunch until I heard Janeway's death might be permanent. Now I will just wait and see. I didn't read the relaunch books until years after they were released, so there's no need for me to rush to buy Breyer's books either.I started reading this discussion having absolutely no interest in the Voyager relaunch. I'd given up on it because I didn't like Golden's writing. And I'd pretty much stopped reading Trek lit in general.
I have changed my mind--thanks to the overreaction of the Janeway "militants." I figure anything that gets people this riled up has to be checked out.
I'll be buying *more* Trek books, including "Full Circle," thanks to you guys.
I just wonder what your reaction would have been if they killed off Seven instead.
I'd read it.
As I have said before, death fic does not bother me. If anything, I like to see how realistically authors deal with grief and loss.
Besides, there's always fanfic for stories set during a character's lifetime. And other novels.
No shouting going on here-that would look like this-SHOUTING- and my feet are planted firmly on the couch!
oh and btw thanks for "allowing me" to participate
Yes I can roll my eyes as well at how predictable that response was.
I'm guessing you know full well what I mean, but I'll explain anyway.
No one on here or useing similar message boards have rights, we really do not. There are rules and regulations that dictate what can and can not be discussed and in which manner. This site was created by some one (I'm not sure who) so that like minded Star Trek fans could discuss the many different aspects of the programme and it's off shoots in the mass media.
So yes, you've been allowed to say what you have been, same as I've been allowed to say what I have been saying, but I do not think it is a right, it's more a privilege.
so, so far, at least 2 people have been incited to buy Full Circle where previously they might not have. whereas perhaps 8 people are saying they won't. so much for all these 'lost sales'.
I've stayed out of this for weeks, but ...
Teya, if you want to cause trouble. Don't. We are not leaving no matter how much you try to force us out and put us in our place, we have a place right here as equal Trek fans and we will use it.
Kirk 1980,
Thank you for discussing this with us.
Yes I think in beginning a better death for Janeway might have helped. She was vilified in her death, making it unlike any other captain's death in movies or books. And that is disgusting to me. I would still have wanted her back if her death had been more respectful, but I had an even bigger problem because there was no honor in her death.
Now that I've seen a lot of the people on this board however, I want her back to make the Trek fandom a more inclusive place again, to keep alive the equality and tolerance of the sexes that seems to be a thing of the past. For me, she's now a symbol of being allowed to exist as a Trek fan today
Teya, if you want to cause trouble. Don't. We are not leaving no matter how much you try to force us out and put us in our place, we have a place right here as equal Trek fans and we will use it.
Kirk 1980,
Thank you for discussing this with us.
Yes I think in beginning a better death for Janeway might have helped. She was vilified in her death, making it unlike any other captain's death in movies or books. And that is disgusting to me. I would still have wanted her back if her death had been more respectful, but I had an even bigger problem because there was no honor in her death.
Now that I've seen a lot of the people on this board however, I want her back to make the Trek fandom a more inclusive place again, to keep alive the equality and tolerance of the sexes that seems to be a thing of the past. For me, she's now a symbol of being allowed to exist as a Trek fan today
Dimesdan- And we do and for most part at least on my end I have not been shouting or stomping as you put it. It irritated me though, that you would just make that assumption because we are here talking about something that is important to us.
A symbol that all future ST licensed tie-ins are "safe" to read. "This book contains only happy endings and no permanent deaths."
I'm sure you've got close to 100 percent agreement on VAMB that Janeway should live.
Well in all fairness it IS a J/C board and without Janeway we'll be one letter short.
A symbol that all future ST licensed tie-ins are "safe" to read. "This book contains only happy endings and no permanent deaths."
Why did you respond with snark? I will never understand why people do that here, it's not making your point any stronger.
I admit, I used a bad turn of phrase, but I really do not understand why the death of a fictional character has lead to a few thousand pretty heated posts. As I have said before, it just seems like a massive non argument to me.
Why is it a "snark"? It's how I really feel. What you would like to see would, in effect, render all future books toothless for me.
I added the devil symbol to indicate I was being a little devilish in saying so. It's a fun symbol. If we aren't allowed to have a little fun on this board, and must always be deadly serious, why do we have all those emoticons? Every post would have to end with
.the FUCK?!
you need a woman captain series lead to justify being a fan?!
you think you're not allowed to be a fan because Janeway's DEAD?!
WHA?!
never mind all those other human AND ALIEN, female characters, like, y'know B'Elanna, Leader Wol, Nan Bacco, Esperanza Pienerio, Rana Desai, Choudury, Danni Elfiki, Ezri Dax, Elizabeth Shelby, Carol Abramowitz, Elizabeth Lense, Robin Lefler, P8 Blue, Sonya Gomez, T'Prynn, Prynn Tenmei, Aillia Laevena, Melora Pazlar, Kat Mueller, Erika Hernandez and so forth that exist, the fact that Janeway's dead makes you feel excluded?
what the hell are you on?
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