Agreed. I've always said that ending was unbelievable. Just like "PARADISE".
How to resolve 6 Voyager Inconsistencies in 85 seconds
- Thread starter Oddish
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It's exactly why both episodes don't work for me.
Agreed. The episodes struggle because it assumes that no one would ever leave. It's the exact type of group think Eddington accuses the Federation of being, except here is an opportunity to show why that might be. But, no, all in lock step.
Possibly a core crew to keep the critical systems running, yes, but a full hundred as part of a permanent crew? I don't believe that.
In fact I would believe the Federation to be technically capable to build nearly or fully autonomous starships. That they don't seems more a matter of philosophy choice than technical necessity. And if they are capable of that and yet choose to send out crews, they should at least be capable of strongly reducing the number of people that are really needed if circumstances require so. Otherwise ships in hard conditions (e.g. battles) that loose a lot of people would become inoperable while it could have been prevented.
Besides, Chakotay doesn't talk about maintenance. He says: 'I doubt it. In fact I don't think we could operate the ship with fewer than one hundred'. To me that very much sounds like the day to day operations of it.
What's interesting is that none of the 37's choose to return to earth, while from their perspective, they haven't had any time to get used to the idea they are so far away from earth now (the Voyager crew at least did have around a year at this point). Granted, all they remember is their (1937) earth and not the Federation paradise earth ; still it seems strange that none of them and all of the Voyager crew choose to continue the journey.
Ironically, I thought them staying was the one believable thing in the episode. I can see all the 37's staying for one simple reason... they are celebrities and revered on that world. It's hard for people to not get sucked in by the limelight... even The Doctor fell prey to that in "VIRTUOSO".
Plus, the inhabitants of the planet were basically cloaked in the thick atmosphere because Voyager's sensors didn't detect any of the people. A pretty safe place.
Plus, the inhabitants of the planet were basically cloaked in the thick atmosphere because Voyager's sensors didn't detect any of the people. A pretty safe place.
True, I didn't think of that, but even then... Amelia Earhart would have been no stranger to that, and she was strongly attracted to exploring space. Her character gives a slightly different reason: At first I didn't know what to do. We talked about it for quite some time. Finally I realised the people here on this planet are part of us. We're their ancestors in a way. It made us feel close to them.
Especially when you consider...
1. Voyager's odds of even surviving the journey.
2. Voyager's odds of getting home in a timely fashion.
3. That a quarter of the crew didn't sign up to join Starfleet and have no allegiance to its doctrines.
4. That the Maquis had no way of knowing what would happen to them once they got home.
5. Resentment against Janeway for stranding them in the first place.
It only seemed strange to me at first because I didn't really consider all the factors... now it seems downright bizarre. Even my preferred scenario (Carey and a half dozen or so Maquis jump ship) is decidedly optimistic when you think about it.
Then again, they could see what we didn't get to see ... camera crews following some senior officers around all the time. That would have made it a pretty safe bet most of them would be home by the end of S7.
Joking aside, I agree that you'd have to want to get home pretty desperately to choose staying aboard, and that realistically, there's no way everyone would choose that option.
Admittedly, them blaming Janeway for stranding them was always strange...it's not like they had a real chance at using the Array to go home to begin with.
^ Depends on the exact situation. If they couldn't have held off the Kazon ships long enough to set up the Array to facilitate their return, I agree with you. If the argument is that they needed to destroy the array, so the Kazon could not use it, explosives timed to go off 0.1 seconds after the Array transporters logged a successful completion of Voyager being sent back would have done the job.
People will assign blame even if those they feel are responsible are not necessarily to blame. A decision was made to blow up the array and strand them decades from home, and since Janeway made it, she will bear the brunt of any harsh feelings from any crewmember.
I don't know if it was a good call to make or not, but one thing is certain... by the time season 6 started, the Ocampa were screwed because they only had enough energy reserves for 5 years.
Indeed. More often than not it is easier to blame someone for a problem, whether they were actually responsible or not. Ultimately, yes, the captain is responsible for the conduct of their crew.
I wonder what the Caretaker's thoughts were about that. Surely he must have realised that the Ocampa would have to take care of themselves after his death, sooner or later.
In "Night", Janeway seemed to think she had options other than destroying the array. If she thought that, so might others. It's not even a matter of "you stranded us and I want to kill you", but more like "you made the decision to stand us, and I don't want to serve under you". Especially for Maquis, many of whom never aspired to Starfleet anyway.
A pissed off crew revolting against Janeway with the Maquis would have been a far better first season
Tuvok said it would take hours to get the Array ready to be used for the return, and in those hours they'd be under nonstop attack from the Kazon.
Also, when the Array brought them there the transport effect damaged the ship and killed people. Meaning going back with it would also damage the ship and kill people.
I think the idea is that, just like Kes and the Ocampa with the Female Caretaker, the other Ocampa would start regaining their vast psychic and telekinetic powers without the Caretaker to pamper them. But this wasn't really followed up on.
Now really, what should have happened in Caretaker is that it wasn't the Array that brought them there but the Caretaker's own natural powers with the Array as a focusing device. He overestimated himself and didn't have enough power to send the crew back once he pulled them there, meaning there was never a chance to go home.
There, that fixes that.
Agreed. Maybe have Seska lead the faction of malcontents, despite Chakotay's calls for unity.
The ship is already damaged... it might go boom on the way home.
Ideally, a mutiny should happen at the same time the Kazon launch that attack during "Basics" and the mutineers were working with the Kazon towards this.
Once they've helped them, the Kazon execute nearly all the Mutineers because they figure "Once a traitor, always a traitor" and just dump the regular crew on that planet.
Thus, it's all neatly wrapped up that the Mutineers were all killed and those who survived saw what happened and decided it wasn't worth not working together anymore. Thus that plotline can be safely terminated.
That would have been a tidy and neat solution.
The only problem is I don't really see the Kazon doing that. If they wanted to get rid of both the Starfleet Crew and the mutineers, they'd probably just treat both groups the same. Either executing them all, or dropping them all on the same planet, with the sarcastic comment that the quarrel between both parties should provide them with some entertainment since they won't find much else of that on that planet.
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