Discovery ending with Season 5

[gvn2fly]

Why do people still say this? Agreed GVN. These are background characters, they normally get zero development at all on any Trek series. The fact they do even a little bit on Discovery shows how much they develop characters. None are the same from when they started.

It's a weird complain to me to fixate about certain bridge characters when the show aready has a large number of main and recurring characters. Why do we need a bottle episode about what Lt. Nillson does all day? How is knowing more about her relevant to the story?

TNG, VOY, and ENT also focused on main characters and people outside the main cast didn't really get any development. Some recurring faces popped up from time to time in VOY, but that's it. It's like complaining about who those people are in Engineering..why don't we know more about who Torres works with? Or like I mentioned..the recurring no name bridge officers on TNG. Jae was in over 60 TNG episodes and 3 movies..did she even speak besides helm type dialogue? Ensign Gates was in over 40 episodes as a helms officer..again nothing known about her.

If people are unhappy we don't see more about Nilson and Rhys, then I'm assuming they are also upset that TNG didn't develop Ensign Gates and Jae?

 

[fireproof78]

I'm still pissed about Lt. Giotto on TOS.

 

[eschaton]

It's a weird complain to me to fixate about certain bridge characters when the show aready has a large number of main and recurring characters. Why do we need a bottle episode about what Lt. Nillson does all day? How is knowing more about her relevant to the story?

TNG, VOY, and ENT also focused on main characters and people outside the main cast didn't really get any development. Some recurring faces popped up from time to time in VOY, but that's it. It's like complaining about who those people are in Engineering..why don't we know more about who Torres works with? Or like I mentioned..the recurring no name bridge officers on TNG. Jae was in over 60 TNG episodes and 3 movies..did she even speak besides helm type dialogue? Ensign Gates was in over 40 episodes as a helms officer..again nothing known about her.

If people are unhappy we don't see more about Nilson and Rhys, then I'm assuming they are also upset that TNG didn't develop Ensign Gates and Jae?

I don't need the supporting characters to really get heavy focus, but I do think it's notable that even the other supposed mains haven't gotten that much to do. Saru got a few episodes dedicated to him in Season 2, and Georgiou got the two-parter in the third season (after which she was put on a bus). Season 3's Forget Me Not was arguably an Adira episode, and Season 4 had a few episodes focusing on Book. But we never really got a solid episode to focus on characters like Stamets, Tilly, or Culber, despite being on the show right from the start. They're just always thrust over into the side plots. IMHO this has been an issue for DIS, because a great way to help make a long-run series more dynamic is to tell a story from the frame of one of the side characters.

 

[Tracer Bullet]

I really wish people would stop misusing the words 'cancelled' and 'cancellation'.

A show announcing the end of its run isn't a cancellation.

Paramount can spin it however they want, but DIS was canceled. The producers were told Paramount wasn't ordering another season after the fifth season wrapped production. This is the very definition of cancellation.

 

[Firebird]

I don't need the supporting characters to really get heavy focus, but I do think it's notable that even the other supposed mains haven't gotten that much to do. Saru got a few episodes dedicated to him in Season 2, and Georgiou got the two-parter in the third season (after which she was put on a bus). Season 3's Forget Me Not was arguably an Adira episode, and Season 4 had a few episodes focusing on Book. But we never really got a solid episode to focus on characters like Stamets, Tilly, or Culber, despite being on the show right from the start. They're just always thrust over into the side plots. IMHO this has been an issue for DIS, because a great way to help make a long-run series more dynamic is to tell a story from the frame of one of the side characters.

IMO, one of the shoddiest things DSC did was cram a bunch of backstory into Airiam’s final episode in order to justify why the characters react so strongly to her death… even though she’d had a couple lines (if even) in prior episodes. Sort of like how TNG suddenly gave Tasha more characterization right before killing her off. Too little, too late.

 

[Mudd]

Paramount can spin it however they want, but DIS was canceled. The producers were told Paramount wasn't ordering another season after the fifth season wrapped production. This is the very definition of cancellation.

TNG was cancelled. DS9 was cancelled. Voyager was cancelled.

Oh, yeah, TOS was cancelled.

Enterprise was cancelled, set on fire, dropped from thirty thousand feet, run over by bulldozers and buried in soft peat for six months.

 

[Quinton]

Here's where I'm seeing some disconnects regarding whether Discovery was canceled.

First, the fact - it has absolutely been canceled. Per DigificWriter's own rebuttals, the show has reached what is in all likelihood a more premature conclusion than folks like Michelle Paradise had hoped. Given the cast's warmth through the years, I dare say the same may well apply to the actors as well.

The wrinkle emerges in how the network is behaving about all this. It does not change the truth - that Discovery has been canceled rather than ending per the collective decision-making of all parties - but it does change the temperature, if you will.

Think back to the way Enterprise ended. Yes, as has been noted upthread, they got more advance notice than Discovery's crew did in some ways. And yet, the tone of it, the magnitude of what it clearly meant for the franchise, the clearly negative gaze from the higher-ups toward the production itself for years before the axe fell - Enterprise's cancelation felt like one, full stop, with all the corporate brutality and disregard that comes part-and-parcel.

Meanwhile, Paramount is practically treating their plug-pulling as some moment of triumph. Whether it's genuine or manufactured - and frankly, who cares either way - the higher-ups in this case have routinely expressed nothing but positivity toward Discovery. That they've elected to host special events about the show ties in with their clear choice to pretend this is less of a cancelation and more of a mutual deal. Why do that? Where's the money in masquerade? I think it boils down to the difference in overarching thought process between the Enterprise cancelation and Discovery's; for Enterprise, there was no need to smile and act like Star Trek, the franchise, was going business-as-usual. For Discovery, there is value in the IP still, in the here and now, and they want to tout that.

So, is it ultimately just a song-and-dance? This whole goodwill tour toward Discovery? I don't know. Maybe folks on-high really do adore the show, but the financials spoke louder after five seasons. Whatever the case may be, a few livestreams and whatever else is on the horizon have the bonus of softening the blow to fans so they'll presumably stick around and see what else is on the network. Les Moonves didn't have much reason to care about Star Trek in 2005. Paramount+ likely still sees a future with these productions, so the cancelation temperature is far more comfortable.

 

[eschaton]

IMO, one of the shoddiest things DSC did was cram a bunch of backstory into Airiam’s final episode in order to justify why the characters react so strongly to her death… even though she’d had a couple lines (if even) in prior episodes. Sort of like how TNG suddenly gave Tasha more characterization right before killing her off. Too little, too late.

Actually, that episode is a great example, since it was explicitly from the POV of Airiam - both the first and last scenes were from her first-person perspective.

I didn't like how the show dealt with it in the following episode at all, but I thought it was effective in that episode. The point of a narrative journey isn't to make the other characters care about the POV character, it's to make the viewer care. I cared about Airiam by the end. I felt bad for her. That was enough. The big teary funeral was completely unneeded.

 

[Tomalak]

I'm not really surprised it's ending, given the cutbacks that all the streamers are making. Five seasons is a good run, and it feels about right.

I think I probably enjoyed the first season the most. In a world of reassuring legacy characters on SNW and PIC, Disco absolutely did not play it safe. It was a compelling story that went against the usual Trek tropes, and I thought it really reinvigorated the franchise. I doubt a new Trek show will ever take those kind of risks again, and that's a shame.

Didn't Disco cost about $8m per episode?

Strikes me that if Paramount wants cheap content to fill in the gaps, maybe they could remaster DS9 and VGR for the cost of two or three episodes each.

Hey, I can dream?

 

[Quantum21]

I'm still pissed about Lt. Giotto on TOS.

You hold a grudge!

 

[Seven of Five]

Aww, I figured it would run a little longer, but numbers are numbers.

I'm surprised that it was announced as PIC is airing it's last season, though we know behind the scenes they have various spinoff ideas brewing.

 

[Quinton]

You hold a grudge!

I bought my roommate a shirt that says that - with Book holding his cat.

This information was irrelevant but I've provided it anyway.

Aww, I figured it would run a little longer, but numbers are numbers.

I'm surprised that it was announced as PIC is airing it's last season, though we know behind the scenes they have various spinoff ideas brewing.

Would you say Discovery has gone Five of Seven per your preferences?

 

[fireproof78]

You hold a grudge!

I mean, I have my favorites!

Also, I always liked R5-D4 more than R2-D2 in Star Wars and that droid is finally getting his due!

 

[Quantum21]

Aww, I figured it would run a little longer, but numbers are numbers.

I'm surprised that it was announced as PIC is airing it's last season, though we know behind the scenes they have various spinoff ideas brewing.

Always was set for 3.

Any Spinoff is going to have to be cheaper than Discovery. Discovery in 2022 probably cost $9-10 million. Something like an Academy show would cost a lot less.

Also expect fewer shows. After it's last big spending spree in 2023, Paramount + is probably going with fewer shows, maybe 2 or 3 instead of 5 in 2024.

Discovery was a victim of being too cinematic, too expensive. It's going out on top though which is a good position to be in.

 

[gvn2fly]

I don't need the supporting characters to really get heavy focus, but I do think it's notable that even the other supposed mains haven't gotten that much to do. Saru got a few episodes dedicated to him in Season 2, and Georgiou got the two-parter in the third season (after which she was put on a bus). Season 3's Forget Me Not was arguably an Adira episode, and Season 4 had a few episodes focusing on Book. But we never really got a solid episode to focus on characters like Stamets, Tilly, or Culber, despite being on the show right from the start. They're just always thrust over into the side plots. IMHO this has been an issue for DIS, because a great way to help make a long-run series more dynamic is to tell a story from the frame of one of the side characters.

Now *this* I definitely agree with and has been one of my problems with the show. It's because Burnham is the main lead and often the only one to come up with the solutions or go on every mission, so the other main characters don't get a focus. Saru did have a lot to do in some other episodes though, notably at then end of season 3 with the other Kelpian - but he wasn't the only focus of those episodes. Tilly did have that season 4 cadet episode, but yea episodes like that haven't ben the norm. Compare that to the older TNG era shows where the Captain may just appear briefly-Burnham is typically the focus of almost every episode.

 

[eschaton]

Now *this* I definitely agree with and has been one of my problems with the show. It's because Burnham is the main lead and often the only one to come up with the solutions or go on every mission, so the other main characters don't get a focus. Saru did have a lot to do in some other episodes though, notably at then end of season 3 with the other Kelpian - but he wasn't the only focus of those episodes. Tilly did have that season 4 cadet episode, but yea episodes like that haven't ben the norm. Compare that to the older TNG era shows where the Captain may just appear briefly-Burnham is typically the focus of almost every episode.

I honestly think that some of the complaints about Michael would have been lessened if the show moved focus away from her on occasion.

I mean, imagine if DS9 was only Sisko episodes. Sure, there's some amazing content in there between his status as Captain, as a father, and as the Emissary, but it would still be a bit much without a break.

 

[Amasov]

That's not how words work.

If we're defining a show coming to an end as being cancelled, every single thing that has ever aired on TV in the past and is not currently producing new content has been cancelled and should hereafter be referred to in that terminology, regardless of whether or not they were properly concluded.

And, yes, what I just typed is ridiculous, because, again, that's not how it works.

I don't even know what you're talking about.

 

[Quantum21]

I honestly think that some of the complaints about Michael would have been lessened if the show moved focus away from her on occasion.

I mean, imagine if DS9 was only Sisko episodes. Sure, there's some amazing content in there between his status as Captain, as a father, and as the Emissary, but it would still be a bit much without a break.

Discovery is very much an ensemble show, moreso than TNG ever was for example. While you'd have to convince me to do it (and ply with drink) I could probably also give 10 examples in just the last 2 seasons where Burnham didn't come up with a solution.

In TOS it was always Kirk or Spock who came up with solutions, again moreso than Burnham does. Burnham is a more complicated Kirk in many ways. God forbid you tell middle-aged white guys that, the terror of pasty male forearms will rain down upon thee.

I bought my roommate a shirt that says that - with Book holding his cat.

This information was irrelevant but I've provided it anyway.[

I bought my roommate a shirt that says that - with Book holding his cat.

This information was irrelevant but I've provided it anyway.

And yet so remarkable I will be floating with amusement and whimsy the rest of the day. Ty

 

[MakeshiftPython]

IMO, I don’t think there should be FIVE active Trek shows. That’s the kind of over-saturation I feared back in 2017. So with DISCO and PIC coming to an end, they should just stick to what they have. I would prefer a Trek series in the spirit of TNG that is set furthest in the future, but I’m guessing SNW is going to be their flagship Trek series for some time.

 

[DaddlerTheDalek]

Well. 5 seasons. It was a good if somewhat bumpy run.