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Spoilers Canon, Continuity, and Pike's Accident

Of course that minty freshness last all of 5 minutes before I drown it away, over the course of a day,* with liters of....

Coffee
Coke
More Coffee
More Coke
And finally a glass of Scotch.

In that order...... usually.

*Otherwise know as: Roddy's recipe for getting through the day.
 
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Of course that minty freshness last all of 5 minutes before I drown it away with liters of....

Coffee
Coke
More Coffee
More Coke
And finally a glass of Scotch.

In that order...... usually.
Wow, it's not even 10am yet. I don't know whether to be impressed or horrified.
 
Well, it's coming up on 11am in my time zone and I've already had...some...of those beverages.

Hint: I don't drink coffee.
 
Doylist vs Watsonian perspectives in fandom are, again, nothing new. Especially Star Trek with it's chronologies, encyclopedias, technical manuals, wikis...
Which is fine. None of that is mandatory for enjoyment .
I've come to the realization that the "real" toxic fans are the ones that enjoy that other fans are upset about changes to long-standing Star Trek canon.
Enjoy? Hardly. I find it confusing and distressing that enjoyment takes a back seat to canon.
 
The real question for me is how does this change impact the stories. Is there really any difference between the Eugenics Wars happening in 1992 or 2042 in the terms of story? Are the plots of Space Seed or TWOK altered by that change? Is Khan different. Is his fate somehow altered? Are the events as we know them changed? How about the actions of Kirk and crew? Is here any impact on future stories? I say no. The dates are irrelevant to the story. Chosen because they are/were in out future. Now those dates are are past. So yes, lets move these fictional events up the time. When other dates cross from future into past do the same. Story over "data points".

Of course it's impacted. How can it not be?? If people are still interested in more Trek in a few years, I have a feeling they eventually will re-tell TOS. It probably would have been a whole lot easier and less messier just doing a complete reboot of Trek from the start. Which is what I had always hoped for before Discovery. But alas it was not to be.....

Maybe one day .....I will probably be dead. Lol But maybe one day they will just restart Trek without any ties at all from previous series. They would not have to even use old characters.
 
Of course it's impacted. How can it not be?? If people are still interested in more Trek in a few years, I have a feeling they eventually will re-tell TOS. It probably would have been a whole lot easier and less messier just doing a complete reboot of Trek from the start. Which is what I had always hoped for before Discovery. But alas it was not to be.....
I would think the Kelvin movies not having any idea what they're doing shows that to be a dramatically dead end.
 
I would think the Kelvin movies not having any idea what they're doing shows that to be a dramatically dead end.

Well the Kelvin movies were a created universe by the destruction of the Nerada and Spocks Red matter. A branched off universe from TOS timeline. So still some ties to everything else. But I see what you mean.
But I kinda wish they had just done a complete from scratch reboot. With just the basic premise of the Federation/Enterprise and various aliens as a spring board and than just create new situations/characters etc
 
Of course it's impacted. How can it not be?? If people are still interested in more Trek in a few years, I have a feeling they eventually will re-tell TOS. It probably would have been a whole lot easier and less messier just doing a complete reboot of Trek from the start. Which is what I had always hoped for before Discovery. But alas it was not to be.....

Maybe one day .....I will probably be dead. Lol But maybe one day they will just restart Trek without any ties at all from previous series. They would not have to even use old characters.
My question is how does it impact the stories? The ones already told? Is there any thing in the episodes that follow Space Seed or TWOK that are impacted in any serious way by shifting the Eugenics Wars up the time line? @JonnyQuest037 already mentioned it makes Kirk’s line about the 200 years passing since Khan went into cryo make sense. So a positive impact for that line. Are there any negatives? My other question was does the date change alter the actual stories told in Space Seed or TWOK? I don’t see anything that wouldn’t still work.
 
My question is how does it impact the stories? The ones already told? Is there any thing in the episodes that follow Space Seed or TWOK that are impacted in any serious way by shifting the Eugenics Wars up the time line? @JonnyQuest037 already mentioned it makes Kirk’s line about the 200 years passing since Khan went into cryo make sense. So a positive impact for that line. Are they any negatives? My other question was does the date change alter the actual stories told in Space Seed or TWOK? I don’t see anything that wouldn’t still work.

Not sure. I mean maybe if TOS is the altered version of events. Maybe no changes. But if it's not I would think things would be significantly different. Was the year ever mentioned in the other shows?? I don't remember. There was a lot of other major events during the 2040's. Wasn't there????
 
I would think the Kelvin movies not having any idea what they're doing shows that to be a dramatically dead end.
It's a beautiful arc about Kirk and how he needed guidance to become a leader.

The next step is Kirk teaching new leaders.

Dramatically dead? Yeah, no.

My question is how does it impact the stories? The ones already told? Is there any thing in the episodes that follow Space Seed or TWOK that are impacted in any serious way by shifting the Eugenics Wars up the time line? @JonnyQuest037 already mentioned it makes Kirk’s line about the 200 years passing since Khan went into cryo make sense. So a positive impact for that line. Are there any negatives? My other question was does the date change alter the actual stories told in Space Seed or TWOK? I don’t see anything that wouldn’t still work.
Same. It's looking at the details and saying "Well, technically things would shift because obviously we know from time travel that if you alter one thing you alter everything." Which, ok, but makes for a dramatically unsatisfying idea that isn't consistent with what Trek does with time travel. Remove one person from the timeline? Yawn. Move events around so they happen slightly differently with different actors? Boring. Travel back and time and adjust an event due to temporal wars? Well, obviously everything must be different now!

It's fatiguing at best, and ridiculous at worst because instead of focusing on the drama of the scene it's "Well, technically..." and surgically breaking the scene down to it's bare essence.
 
Not sure. I mean maybe if TOS is the altered version of events. Maybe no changes. But if it's not I would think things would be significantly different. Was the year ever mentioned in the other shows?? I don't remember. There was a lot of other major events during the 2040's. Wasn't there????
The only thing altered is some dates. Everything else unfolds as it did before.
The main event is WWIII and the Eugenics Wars are part of that. Even described as such by Spock.
Also TV ends
The last World Series is played.
Charbydis reaches Thea 116
Earthquake destroys part of Los Angeles
 
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