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Spoilers Agents of SHIELD- The Final Season Discussion

One thing I was kind if disappointed with was how the time travelling ended in the 80's. I was kind of hoping we would have seen the 90's again. Plus the budget was still a concern. Lots an d Lots of use of the base and plane sets even towards the end. In fact did they even go outdoors at all in the final two episodes except for some of the closing shots to our main characters? Still the characters were fun as always so the show never really got boring and frankly I would have been game for a few more seasons.:)


Jason
 
One thing I was kind if disappointed with was how the time travelling ended in the 80's. I was kind of hoping we would have seen the 90's again. Plus the budget was still a concern. Lots an d Lots of use of the base and plane sets even towards the end. In fact did they even go outdoors at all in the final two episodes except for some of the closing shots to our main characters? Still the characters were fun as always so the show never really got boring and frankly I would have been game for a few more seasons.:)


Jason

I was hoping it'd come to a head intersecting with some of the movie timelines and come full circle to Coulson's original death. But I guess the timeline was already too divergent by the 1980s for that.
 
What was the other thing in Caulsons case?
His remote off switch. Here's what I wrote on The Avocado about it:
"I just realised what the epilogue was really about. Mack gives Coulson something he wanted plus an extra "surprise" (Lola). The thing in the briefcase next to Lola's keys was Coulson's remote off switch. The team asked Coulson to give it a year to decide if he wanted to deactivate himself.

The epilogue's reunion was everyone coming together to be with Coulson as he decided whether or not to go through with it like he intended to earlier in the season. This way if he decided he wanted to "die" he didn't have to do it alone. He could die with his family by his side. Much like how Enoch died with Daisy and Coulson by his side.

Happily, Coulson decides to keep going. To keep "reassessing" his deactivation. To keep living. Someday his family will be gone. But he now has his remote off switch so that, for the first time in his many lives, he can truly go out on his own terms."
 
Ward killed Hand to get Garrett in prime, Hand kills Garrett in alt universe.

She unknowingly avenged herself.
I knew that was Hand, but I didn't pick on the whole Garrett thing.
I think I might too, which is a bit of a surprise to me. I've found it a generally underwhelming watch, but it's grown on me.

To be honest, theres zero good reasons we shouldn't see all of them again though.

I'm assuming from Fury's current activities and the wording on the back of Fury's Captain Marvel Pager (as seen on Ebay) he's doing something with/for S.W.O.R.D. No reason whatsoever we couldn't see Mack as Director of S.H.I.E.L.D. in the movies.

LMD Coulson could easily be introduced with no other explanation than "We have lifelike LMD's now".

Quake and Yo-Yo are both agents, Inhumans and superheroes. That's got to create opportunities all over the place.

May is still in S.H.I.E.L.D. and probably hangs out with Phil. We could see her as a Maria Hill / Victoria Hand type senior agent.

Fitz & Simmons are entitled to a happy retirement. Nothing to say they might not be seen as backroom staff at Avengers HQ doing a little consulting though.

There's a shedload of new shows coming - AoS is pretty much the end of the non Feige Marvel output (not sure about Helstrom) so there might be an intention to draw a line under the shows like AoS.

I truly hope not - it would be a shame to create new characters when these are vailable and bring a bit more to the table than "Generic agents 1 & 2'


I remember Lola in the early episodes. What happened ?
There is absolutely no way this is going to happen. At this point we've gotten 12 movies since Age of Ultron, with no connections to the series, and everybody involved with the show is not involved with Marvel any more, so now there is even less of a motivation to go back to AoS.
Is it starting to look like S.W.O.R.D are going to feature in the movies soon ?
Maybe, a picture of Fury's Capt. Marvel pager showed up online, and it turned out that there is a S.W.O.R.D. logo on the back. So it looks like there has been at least some thought given to bring them into the MCU.
His remote off switch. Here's what I wrote on The Avocado about it:
"I just realised what the epilogue was really about. Mack gives Coulson something he wanted plus an extra "surprise" (Lola). The thing in the briefcase next to Lola's keys was Coulson's remote off switch. The team asked Coulson to give it a year to decide if he wanted to deactivate himself.

The epilogue's reunion was everyone coming together to be with Coulson as he decided whether or not to go through with it like he intended to earlier in the season. This way if he decided he wanted to "die" he didn't have to do it alone. He could die with his family by his side. Much like how Enoch died with Daisy and Coulson by his side.

Happily, Coulson decides to keep going. To keep "reassessing" his deactivation. To keep living. Someday his family will be gone. But he now has his remote off switch so that, for the first time in his many lives, he can truly go out on his own terms."
I didn't put any of that together, that actually makes the scene even better.
The first half of the finale was pretty good, the stuff with the Chronicoms being taped to the missile was hilarious.
Ending the Chronicom threat by using Kora and May's powers to teach them empathy wasn't quite the big epic ending I was expecting, but it was a nice way to tie the resolution to the rest of the season.
The Daisy/Malick fight was pretty cool, having her big finale fight be against someone with her own powers was pretty cool.
I had already been suspecting that FitzSimmons had a kid, so that revealed wasn't to much of a surprise, but it was still a nice moment.
I loved the one year later epilogue, the characters were all given the perfect endings.

It did end up making one of my biggest problems with the last few seasons even worse, though. It's felt really weird that for a while now we've had S.H.I.E.L.D. back as a big public organization, but yet we've seen no signs of them in the movies. I just find it really hard to believe that they have never gotten involved in any of the stuff going on in the movies. It was easy to write it off when they were underground, or when they were just starting back out, but with this, now we've seen a huge Helicarrier, a training academy, a rebuilt Triskelion, and groups of agents off in space. It's really going to make it even harder to buy that they are not somehow involved in the kinds of stuff that happens in the movies.
My only other problem is that I was really hoping they'd find someway to work Ward into the finale. He was such a big part of the show, that I really think he deserved at least some kind of cameo in the finale.
 
To be honest, theres zero good reasons we shouldn't see all of them again though.

...it would be a shame to create new characters when these are vailable and bring a bit more to the table than "Generic agents 1 & 2'

I remember Lola in the early episodes. What happened ?
There is absolutely no way this is going to happen. At this point we've gotten 12 movies since Age of Ultron, with no connections to the series, and everybody involved with the show is not involved with Marvel any more, so now there is even less of a motivation to go back to AoS.

It's felt really weird that for a while now we've had S.H.I.E.L.D. back as a big public organization, but yet we've seen no signs of them in the movies. I just find it really hard to believe that they have never gotten involved in any of the stuff going on in the movies. It was easy to write it off when they were underground, or when they were just starting back out, but with this, now we've seen a huge Helicarrier, a training academy, a rebuilt Triskelion, and groups of agents off in space. It's really going to make it even harder to buy that they are not somehow involved in the kinds of stuff that happens in the movies.
No, I get that it's unlikely for internal politics reasons if nothing else, but my point remains that there's no real reason some couldn't be used instead instead of inventing agents Barnes and Noble or whatever. And Coulson was well featured in Capt. Marvel. Reintroducing him as a LMD would be simple and well received.

And if Nick's off with Sword doing spacey stuff, just who is rebuilding Shield back into the major presence it was ? This rebuilding does need to be referenced in the post-snap MCU.

And...what had happened to Lola ?
 
As far as the movies are concerned there has never been any signs of S.H.I.E.L.D. being rebuilt, or anyone even showing an interest in rebuilding it, so it's not really something that needs to be addressed. The two most prominent S.H.I.E.L.D. personnel in the movies, other than Coulson, Fury and Hill, have been operating independently since the fall of S.H.I.E.L.D. and as far as I can remember neither of them has even mentioned since then.
 
Is there a way to put (recon) the end of season 7 to be just prior to Civil War (cram the last four or five seasons of AOS into one or two years)? Mack is on the same Hellicarrier last seen in Age of Ultron? Everything pre-snap?
 
Is there a way to put (recon) the end of season 7 to be just prior to Civil War (cram the last four or five seasons of AOS into one or two years)? Mack is on the same Hellicarrier last seen in Age of Ultron? Everything pre-snap?
Several events of Civil War are directly mentioned on the show. Most notably stuff concerning the Sokovia Accords and the death of Peggy Carter.
 
Is there a way to put (recon) the end of season 7 to be just prior to Civil War (cram the last four or five seasons of AOS into one or two years)? Mack is on the same Hellicarrier last seen in Age of Ultron? Everything pre-snap?

Season 3, Episode 20 (Emancipation) explicitly takes place right after Civil War, which the Marvel Cinematic Universe wiki places in May 2016. That season finale leaves us with a "Six Months Later" flashforward. The Season 4 premiere can easily be perceived to be immediately after that. This places us in November 2016. Season 4 is a fucking whirlwind, so I could easily see it spanning just one or two months. Let's place the finale in January 2017. Wacky shenanigans wisk most of the gang away to 2091, but Fitz remains on contemporary Earth for another six months. That gets us to July 2017. I don't recall here being mention of a gap between when Fitz and Enoch head to space and when the team returns from their Krazy Kree Summer Vacation, so let's put their return down as July 2017 still just for shits and giggles.

The back half of Season 5 is also a whirlwind, so let's say that it ends in LateJuly 2017.Season 6 opens "One Year Later". So July 2018. The MCU wiki places The Snap in Late May 2018. Even ignoring the lines about Thanos in the Season 5 finale, Season 6 would still need to take place post-Snap.
 
Season 3, Episode 20 (Emancipation) explicitly takes place right after Civil War, which the Marvel Cinematic Universe wiki places in May 2016. That season finale leaves us with a "Six Months Later" flashforward. The Season 4 premiere can easily be perceived to be immediately after that. This places us in November 2016. Season 4 is a fucking whirlwind, so I could easily see it spanning just one or two months. Let's place the finale in January 2017. Wacky shenanigans wisk most of the gang away to 2091, but Fitz remains on contemporary Earth for another six months. That gets us to July 2017. I don't recall here being mention of a gap between when Fitz and Enoch head to space and when the team returns from their Krazy Kree Summer Vacation, so let's put their return down as July 2017 still just for shits and giggles.

The back half of Season 5 is also a whirlwind, so let's say that it ends in LateJuly 2017.Season 6 opens "One Year Later". So July 2018. The MCU wiki places The Snap in Late May 2018. Even ignoring the lines about Thanos in the Season 5 finale, Season 6 would still need to take place post-Snap.
Right. I mentioned this possibility before the season started, though not quite as much detail, earlier in the thread. The show can be condensed to a point to where it all fits into the timeline if you make the mentions of Thanos in season 5 apocryphal. They have to have gone back in time before the snap, but they may have returned afterwards, therefore avoiding the effects altogether. Perhaps the efforts we see in that epilogue arr attempts at restoring order to the world in chaos due to the snap.

To be honest, I really haven't decided which direction my head canon is going to take. Condense the timeline or consider season 6 and 7 apocryphal? Either one works for me. Both seasons have high points, but neither one of them really struck home for me. And while I found the finale satisfying in multiple ways, I still think I prefer the season 5 finale "The End" as a capstone for our Heroes adventures.
 
Honestly, I'm just going with the theory that Seasons 1-4 take place in the mainline MCU. Then their return from 2091 put them in another universe. One where Doctor Strange is dead and The Snap never took place. They remained there until the events of the Season 6 finale saw them go on their Time War Cruise into yet another universe. Fitz remained behind to tether the gang to the Seasons 5.5-6 timeline, which they then returned to in the series finale.

Back in the mainline MCU, SHIELD collapsed following the death of Director Mace, the attempt on Talbot's life and the disappearance of most of the surviving agents. Talbot survived, but is still in Hale's custody. However, he never becomes Graviton since it was the team's actions that ironically put him on that path in the first place. Therefore MCU Robin's visions weren't about saving the MCU's Earth. They were about the Earth the team eventually found themselves on (Well, after God knows how many time loops resulting in God knows how many additional timelines).

As for The Confederacy? Maybe they're still out there. Or maybe Captain Marvel stopped them. Who knows?

Original Recipe Agents of SHIELD characters still in the mainline MCU timeline: OG Fitz & Enoch...IN SPACE!!!, Bobbi & Hunter, Robbie Reyes, Talbot. Which means that regardless of The Snap, the cancelled Bobbi & Hunter spin-off Marvel's Most Wanted and the cancelled Ghost Rider spin-off for Hulu would have still taken place in the mainline MCU. Now if you'll excuse me, I'm off to use the Quantum Realm to find the universe where both those shows happened.
 
Honestly, I'm just going with the theory that Seasons 1-4 take place in the mainline MCU. Then their return from 2091 put them in another universe. One where Doctor Strange is dead and The Snap never took place. They remained there until the events of the Season 6 finale saw them go on their Time War Cruise into yet another universe. Fitz remained behind to tether the gang to the Seasons 5.5-6 timeline, which they then returned to in the series finale.

Back in the mainline MCU, SHIELD collapsed following the death of Director Mace, the attempt on Talbot's life and the disappearance of most of the surviving agents. Talbot survived, but is still in Hale's custody. However, he never becomes Graviton since it was the team's actions that ironically put him on that path in the first place. Therefore MCU Robin's visions weren't about saving the MCU's Earth. They were about the Earth the team eventually found themselves on (Well, after God knows how many time loops resulting in God knows how many additional timelines).

As for The Confederacy? Maybe they're still out there. Or maybe Captain Marvel stopped them. Who knows?

Original Recipe Agents of SHIELD characters still in the mainline MCU timeline: OG Fitz & Enoch...IN SPACE!!!, Bobbi & Hunter, Robbie Reyes, Talbot. Which means that regardless of The Snap, the cancelled Bobbi & Hunter spin-off Marvel's Most Wanted and the cancelled Ghost Rider spin-off for Hulu would have still taken place in the mainline MCU. Now if you'll excuse me, I'm off to use the Quantum Realm to find the universe where both those shows happened.
All of that works best for me.

Now take me with you on your search for those two shows!
 
Honestly, I'm just going with the theory that Seasons 1-4 take place in the mainline MCU. Then their return from 2091 put them in another universe. One where Doctor Strange is dead and The Snap never took place. They remained there until the events of the Season 6 finale saw them go on their Time War Cruise into yet another universe. Fitz remained behind to tether the gang to the Seasons 5.5-6 timeline, which they then returned to in the series finale.

Back in the mainline MCU, SHIELD collapsed following the death of Director Mace, the attempt on Talbot's life and the disappearance of most of the surviving agents. Talbot survived, but is still in Hale's custody. However, he never becomes Graviton since it was the team's actions that ironically put him on that path in the first place. Therefore MCU Robin's visions weren't about saving the MCU's Earth. They were about the Earth the team eventually found themselves on (Well, after God knows how many time loops resulting in God knows how many additional timelines).

As for The Confederacy? Maybe they're still out there. Or maybe Captain Marvel stopped them. Who knows?

Original Recipe Agents of SHIELD characters still in the mainline MCU timeline: OG Fitz & Enoch...IN SPACE!!!, Bobbi & Hunter, Robbie Reyes, Talbot. Which means that regardless of The Snap, the cancelled Bobbi & Hunter spin-off Marvel's Most Wanted and the cancelled Ghost Rider spin-off for Hulu would have still taken place in the mainline MCU. Now if you'll excuse me, I'm off to use the Quantum Realm to find the universe where both those shows happened.

Makes you wonder why Thanos didn't attack this new world the Agents are now in or if he did how was he beaten. Maybe the Thor in this new world did go for the head at first.


Jason
 
I think INFINITY WAR and ENDGAME work just fine with AGENTS OF SHIELD. Season 5's finale has Thanos mounting his attack on Earth. I think the Snap happens after the Zephyr lands in Tahiti but before Coulson and May disembark.

Just as the plane landed, the Snap erased the entire cast from existence. Five years later, ENDGAME restores the Agents aboard the plane. They have no recollection of disappearing. Coulson and May leave, the Zephyr takes off, and only when the Agents are airborne do they realize they lost five years of time. It's not even one of the top ten strangest things to happen to them and they shrug it off, resuming the search for Fitz (whose spaceship is attacked after the restoration).

FAR FROM HOME shows planet Earth pretty much back to normal, so Season 6 shows Earth in the same state and the cast came to terms with it during the one year between the unSnap and the Season 6 premiere.
 
A couple of days old but this is a great cast interview:

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Ming Na says she was the one who came up with May saying "The Calvary!" as a means of showing she has embraced the moniker and everything that came with it.
 
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