The writers would then have to invent other horrifying things. What level of horrifying disaster do you need to make it so they are reduced to the level we see?
Spoilers Star Trek: Starfleet Academy 1x07 – “Ko‘Zeine”
- Thread starter Commander Richard
- Start date
The writers would then have to invent other horrifying things. What level of horrifying disaster do you need to make it so they are reduced to the level we see?
I get the impression it's less a disguise and they're more like werefish. One human form, one fishy.
Someone else raised this complaint earlier in the thread and I'm afraid I just don't understand it. Why does Caleb need to mention it? This episode takes place a month later, and everyone he spoke to would already know what happened.
He mentioned a memorial in that deleted message at the start did he not?
The mop was literally off a supermarket hook.
And forget Star Trek, the PADD looked less advanced than a tablet today. And sending a voice note on my phone? Hold one button down, release to send. Or alternately, slide, release and then tap to send. Yet the same thing takes many more button presses in 1000 years' time
Didn't you watch the scene where Jay-Den asked that question?
He then said the main ceremony would be on the homeworld the following day, but then it wasn't?
Yeah, when his boo talked about his new haircut, I was confused as hell, as I thought his true form had a blue bald scalp.
Sadly, this episode was a little flat for me - I gave it a 6. I do think character-driven episodes like these are needed, especially when TV these days is so fast-paced and lacking in time to breathe, but I just didn't like how it was implemented.
I was very disappointed about just how mundane Genesis' motivation was to risk so much. I don't even think that it would have affected her application if she'd just left the original quotes in there - it's not like the new Academy is expecting perfection from its new cadets when, as Ake said in a previous episode, some of them spent portions of their lives in cargo crates. Everything else about her record was great, but she just didn't have confidence in her own abilities... but that's the sort of thing the Academy would be expected to build into her as a cadet. Fear and irrationality makes people do silly things, but I wish we'd have seen more of that fear and desperation leading up to the point where she decided to risk both her position and Caleb's. Worse, she didn't feel like she could take Caleb into her confidence beforehand, which does make me think less of her - you shouldn't risk your friend's position with them completely in the dark as to your true motivations. I'm glad she got some consequences for her actions; while I'm sure she'll earn her way back to that pre-command track, I hope that this actually humbles her and reinforces that she does deserve to be at the Academy, but not if she keeps letting her fears get in the way.
As for Darem and Jay-Den, I thought their plot was perfectly okay. What was refreshing is that his partner, when telling him to go and embrace his dreams, also told him off for disrespecting her by lying about where he truly wanted to be. She gave him the out and time to think, and he should have taken it. I think they squandered an opportunity for Darem to talk to his parents, who certainly would have something to say about his inner conflict and added to the pressure to conform and adhere to his duty. As it is, they don't say a word, nor do they acknowledge their lack of response to Darem's messages in previous episodes. Their quiet disapproval of Darem's Starfleet ambitions should have come to a head here, and they should have given him that ultimatum to actively make a decision: his duty or his dreams.
That said, it also reinforced what Darem was like pre-Academy. He became a passive character the moment he arrived on the moon, and it took active characters like Jay-Den and his partner to force him to accept what he truly wanted to do. Every decision was made for him, much as it was before he joined the Academy, and even the decision to return to San Francisco was forced on him. On screen, however, that doesn't come across as well, and it just seems like a waste of time and a lost opportunity to delve into Darem's family dynamics.
I was very disappointed about just how mundane Genesis' motivation was to risk so much. I don't even think that it would have affected her application if she'd just left the original quotes in there - it's not like the new Academy is expecting perfection from its new cadets when, as Ake said in a previous episode, some of them spent portions of their lives in cargo crates. Everything else about her record was great, but she just didn't have confidence in her own abilities... but that's the sort of thing the Academy would be expected to build into her as a cadet. Fear and irrationality makes people do silly things, but I wish we'd have seen more of that fear and desperation leading up to the point where she decided to risk both her position and Caleb's. Worse, she didn't feel like she could take Caleb into her confidence beforehand, which does make me think less of her - you shouldn't risk your friend's position with them completely in the dark as to your true motivations. I'm glad she got some consequences for her actions; while I'm sure she'll earn her way back to that pre-command track, I hope that this actually humbles her and reinforces that she does deserve to be at the Academy, but not if she keeps letting her fears get in the way.
As for Darem and Jay-Den, I thought their plot was perfectly okay. What was refreshing is that his partner, when telling him to go and embrace his dreams, also told him off for disrespecting her by lying about where he truly wanted to be. She gave him the out and time to think, and he should have taken it. I think they squandered an opportunity for Darem to talk to his parents, who certainly would have something to say about his inner conflict and added to the pressure to conform and adhere to his duty. As it is, they don't say a word, nor do they acknowledge their lack of response to Darem's messages in previous episodes. Their quiet disapproval of Darem's Starfleet ambitions should have come to a head here, and they should have given him that ultimatum to actively make a decision: his duty or his dreams.
That said, it also reinforced what Darem was like pre-Academy. He became a passive character the moment he arrived on the moon, and it took active characters like Jay-Den and his partner to force him to accept what he truly wanted to do. Every decision was made for him, much as it was before he joined the Academy, and even the decision to return to San Francisco was forced on him. On screen, however, that doesn't come across as well, and it just seems like a waste of time and a lost opportunity to delve into Darem's family dynamics.
I don't know if it was deliberate or not but every time Darem told royal spouse lady whose name I don't remember it was so unbelievable, like the words were so flat with no emotion behind them and there was zero chemistry. I didn't even see them as childhood friends they were like perfect strangers.
Hell there was more friction with his kidnappers which could have gone down a Where Pleasant Fountains Lie route. Do we think Khionian royal guards are trained from birth to skip foreplay?
Hell there was more friction with his kidnappers which could have gone down a Where Pleasant Fountains Lie route. Do we think Khionian royal guards are trained from birth to skip foreplay?
Mid Episode.. Very Mid. not bad, not good either. Meh.
Just.. It could be great episodes if they like.. tried 10% harder?
The marriage one, was ok, but as been said, emotional range of a turtle, didn't feel the love and joy of the event, and they just done a quick montage of the wedding.
Instead of the girl, should have had Darem meet his parents. Them being so "Happy" that he's doing the wedding, and Jay Den being his strength to tell his parents to F off. Its my life, and I no longer care about your approval. Still have the girl wait for him or love him though. Bit more emotional punch.
Same for Genesis and Mir. Didn't need the Genesis .,. whatever it was. Could have just been Mir staying and as said, Genesis's Dadmiral having other plans and she sneaks back, and they have some fun at school. A good "comedic" B story to the more Emotional weighty A story.
Also.. There not respecting the Captains chair.. ugh.
Its okay, but just need a Better writer to come along and polish the scripts.
And stop with the swearing.. its not working.
Just.. It could be great episodes if they like.. tried 10% harder?
The marriage one, was ok, but as been said, emotional range of a turtle, didn't feel the love and joy of the event, and they just done a quick montage of the wedding.
Instead of the girl, should have had Darem meet his parents. Them being so "Happy" that he's doing the wedding, and Jay Den being his strength to tell his parents to F off. Its my life, and I no longer care about your approval. Still have the girl wait for him or love him though. Bit more emotional punch.
Same for Genesis and Mir. Didn't need the Genesis .,. whatever it was. Could have just been Mir staying and as said, Genesis's Dadmiral having other plans and she sneaks back, and they have some fun at school. A good "comedic" B story to the more Emotional weighty A story.
Also.. There not respecting the Captains chair.. ugh.
Its okay, but just need a Better writer to come along and polish the scripts.
And stop with the swearing.. its not working.
Jumping straight in with my thoughts, then will go back and read through the thread.
I gave this one a 6. Which I admit, it probably deserves a higher score, it is a very charming episode and very good at exploring the characters it is choosing to explore. It's comedic without being too silly and very touching in parts. I liked it a lot! (And 6, to be clear, is still a positive score for me.)
But! I spent the whole episode distracted by the fact that B'Avi was killed last week and we did not get Dzolo's reaction in that episode and we still have not followed up with her in this one. Was she in it? Was she that first student in the queue to teleport away for All Worlds' Day, or just someone who kinda looks like her from behind?
I understand this is my own fault for letting my brain get caught on the angry Romulan girl who was not meant to be anything more than a supporting character in a mildly antagonistic role, but here we are. Her seemingly best friend is dead and I need them to follow up with her! I don't expect her to get an episode, not even a whole scene, but the nothing we got really bugged me.
I gave this one a 6. Which I admit, it probably deserves a higher score, it is a very charming episode and very good at exploring the characters it is choosing to explore. It's comedic without being too silly and very touching in parts. I liked it a lot! (And 6, to be clear, is still a positive score for me.)
But! I spent the whole episode distracted by the fact that B'Avi was killed last week and we did not get Dzolo's reaction in that episode and we still have not followed up with her in this one. Was she in it? Was she that first student in the queue to teleport away for All Worlds' Day, or just someone who kinda looks like her from behind?
I understand this is my own fault for letting my brain get caught on the angry Romulan girl who was not meant to be anything more than a supporting character in a mildly antagonistic role, but here we are. Her seemingly best friend is dead and I need them to follow up with her! I don't expect her to get an episode, not even a whole scene, but the nothing we got really bugged me.
I’m a bit unsure how I should ultimately rate this one. What I like is the idea of a slower episode focussing on the characters, and even acknowledging some of the traumatic experiences of the Miyazaki incident (although I would agree with @Ceridwen that it would have been nice to see how Dzolo was doing after what happened with B’Avi). The concept of Caleb and Genesis staying on the otherwise empty Athena is neat, but I feel they could have done more with it. Caleb sunbathing in the atrium (damn, that guy is swole!) and the warp slug encounter were fun (and the most the show ever felt like a live action version of Lower Decks so far), but there could have been more stuff like that. It also all reminded me a bit of “Enterprise bingo” from Strange New Worlds.
What I liked is the revelation that Genesis isn’t quite as perfect as she seemed at first. I’m not super clear on what those letters she tried to erase actually said, though. Something vague about her “not trusting that she belongs where she is”. So didn’t they basically say “she’s more able than even she herself realizes”? What is so terrible about this that she would need to erase it? However, I really liked the moment where Caleb holds her hand in support and I appreciated when Ake says: “Here is the lesson: We are all wildly flawed. And we have to learn to carry that.”
As for the storyline about Jay-Den and Darem: I love watching those two and seeing how close they got in this episode (although I think the teasing went a bit too far this time and they should have just have them kiss already, damnit), but ultimately that story was waaay too thin and by-the-numbers. I’m not sure how believable I find it that before the Academy Darem was supposed to be this restrained yes-man. And while I liked the creativity of the sets, ultimately the whole production and staging felt very unconvincing. Wouldn’t we expect Darem’s parents to be at his wedding? And aren’t his eagerness to please what they expect of him ultimately what drove him to even wanting to go through with the wedding and the whole being a royal ruler thing? Seemed the conflict is ultimately with them and not with his would-be-spouse, so it’s weird that they’re not there. Also, am I the only one that thought the episode would end with the bride marrying her enby Ko’Zeine? The way the character was introduced totally let me think there was more to them, but then nothing happened. What rubbed me the wrong way a bit was how they portrayed Kyle noticeably more goofy/dorky compared to previous episodes. It’s as if they wanted to underscore how milquetoast he is compared to the more exciting “asshole” Darem.
So yeah, I was definitely entertained, and I love me a lower stakes character episode, but ultimately I found it lacking in some of the details.
By the way, I just realized while watching this episode, that Starfleet Academy never does recaps of previous episodes before the episode starts. I‘ve grown so accustomed to this that I’m surprised I’m only noticing now. Probably speaks to the episodic nature of the show; you’re almost always able to follow and there’s almost no super important infos from earlier episodes you need. And if it is important they usually have a character utter a few sentences of recap within the episode.
What I liked is the revelation that Genesis isn’t quite as perfect as she seemed at first. I’m not super clear on what those letters she tried to erase actually said, though. Something vague about her “not trusting that she belongs where she is”. So didn’t they basically say “she’s more able than even she herself realizes”? What is so terrible about this that she would need to erase it? However, I really liked the moment where Caleb holds her hand in support and I appreciated when Ake says: “Here is the lesson: We are all wildly flawed. And we have to learn to carry that.”
As for the storyline about Jay-Den and Darem: I love watching those two and seeing how close they got in this episode (although I think the teasing went a bit too far this time and they should have just have them kiss already, damnit), but ultimately that story was waaay too thin and by-the-numbers. I’m not sure how believable I find it that before the Academy Darem was supposed to be this restrained yes-man. And while I liked the creativity of the sets, ultimately the whole production and staging felt very unconvincing. Wouldn’t we expect Darem’s parents to be at his wedding? And aren’t his eagerness to please what they expect of him ultimately what drove him to even wanting to go through with the wedding and the whole being a royal ruler thing? Seemed the conflict is ultimately with them and not with his would-be-spouse, so it’s weird that they’re not there. Also, am I the only one that thought the episode would end with the bride marrying her enby Ko’Zeine? The way the character was introduced totally let me think there was more to them, but then nothing happened. What rubbed me the wrong way a bit was how they portrayed Kyle noticeably more goofy/dorky compared to previous episodes. It’s as if they wanted to underscore how milquetoast he is compared to the more exciting “asshole” Darem.
So yeah, I was definitely entertained, and I love me a lower stakes character episode, but ultimately I found it lacking in some of the details.
By the way, I just realized while watching this episode, that Starfleet Academy never does recaps of previous episodes before the episode starts. I‘ve grown so accustomed to this that I’m surprised I’m only noticing now. Probably speaks to the episodic nature of the show; you’re almost always able to follow and there’s almost no super important infos from earlier episodes you need. And if it is important they usually have a character utter a few sentences of recap within the episode.
I wondered if maybe they should have done something like a mysterious intruder, taking advantage of most of the students being gone, infiltrates the Athena for some nefarious purpose and it is up to Caleb and Genesis to stop the intruder on their own. It might have added some "action" and suspense to make things more interesting.
And they in turn go all Home Alone with various things weve seen before, the mucus from 1x02 etc
Yeah but have you ever considered that maybe I am no father, and you're no son, and this fight is all we have left?
I think it was a real missed opportunity not to have a scene between Genesis and her dad where she confronts him on her desire to be her own person. It could have followed up on the scene where she sits in the captain's chair and explains how she wants to know that she is not just following in his first steps but paving her own path.
And then they fight with giant Q-tips in the ultimate evolution of the martial arts?
Now in middle age I quite like that episode. It's little things like Pulaski hinting that Riker and his father may be more alike than Will likes. That Gladiator fight has real meat to it too.
Also it foreshadows Rikers own parenting where his daughter becomes time-filling backstory that leaves no footprints and is forgotten the next season.
Similar threads
- Poll
- Poll
- Poll
- Poll
