Is it time to put Star Trek to rest?

[Nyotarules]

It appears that they sort of forgot about it in Picard. WW3 and the "post-atomic horror" seemed to have slipped their minds when they left poor Rios back in the 21st century.

Rios chose to stay for love reasons, and his family started a medical service, Mariposas that lasted until the 24th century. He felt it was worth the risk.

 

[BillJ]

If people liked DSC and PIC, I see it as evidence for the bad taste in the 2010's and 2020's.

Of course, it is something wrong with everyone else. I’m not enamored with CBS Trek, but to try to make it out as a failure is intellectually dishonest.

 

[bdub76]

TNG was different from TOS. But it was of high class and had likeable characters and good stories, something which can't vbe said or written about DSC and PIC.

I enjoyed PIC on initial watch. It was all nostalgia. I recently tried to rewatch season 2, and I didn't care for it. I have also enjoyed most of the PIC novels based on the show as well.

I never made it past the first season of DSC. The main was too perfect. I like my protagonists to have some flaws. I heard it gets kind of a reset in season 3, but I never made it that far. I've been meaning to give it another try.

 

[FredH]

I enjoyed PIC on initial watch. It was all nostalgia. I recently tried to rewatch season 2, and I didn't care for it. I have also enjoyed most of the PIC novels based on the show as well.

I never made it past the first season of DSC. The main was too perfect. I like my protagonists to have some flaws. I heard it gets kind of a reset in season 3, but I never made it that far. I've been meaning to give it another try.

Too perfect? You mean when she mutinies and gets a war started? (Which would have happened anyway, but she doesn’t know that.)

EDIT: To be fair, later on in the series we do start getting the “Sydney Bristow syndrome” where people keep telling her how amazing she is.

 

[1001001]

Too perfect? You mean when she mutinies and gets a war started? (Which would have happened anyway, but she doesn’t know that.)

Michael didn’t start the war.

Georgiou did by not listening to her.

 

[bdub76]

Too perfect? You mean when she mutinies and gets a war started? (Which would have happened anyway, but she doesn’t know that.)

EDIT: To be fair, later on in the series we do start getting the “Sydney Bristow syndrome” where people keep telling her how amazing she is.

My wife's number one complaint about J.J. Abrams is his inability to have fulfilling endings for his series.

For two series with good endings that we enjoyed: 4400 (original) and White Collar.

 

[FredH]

My wife's number one complaint about J.J. Abrams is his inability to have fulfilling endings for his series.

For two series with good endings that we enjoyed: 4400 (original) and White Collar.

Not to get off topic (he said, getting briefly off-topic), but I actually thought the ending of Alias was okay, and Fringe’s actually good. But it’s true that his mystery boxes tend to at least partially disappoint; I’m annoyed to this day that we never met Milo Rambaldi, nor got some sense of how the hell he actually did all that stuff.

 

[bdub76]

Not to get off topic (he said, getting briefly off-topic), but I actually thought the ending of Alias was okay, and Fringe’s actually good. But it’s true that his mystery boxes tend to at least partially disappoint; I’m annoyed to this day that we never met Milo Rambaldi, nor got some sense of how the hell he actually did all that stuff.

I agree with you about Fringe.

 

[Turtletrekker]

Michael didn’t start the war.

Georgiou did by not listening to her.

The Klingons were going to start a war whether the Shenzou had been present at the Binary Stars or not.

 

[The Wormhole]

I never made it past the first season of DSC. The main was too perfect.

I seem to recall many complaining Disco's cast was "unlikeable" back when the first season was originally airing.

 

[Lynx]

That's hilarious. It must be something wrong with them for liking things someone else doesn't like.

Take that, diversity!


I watch Kelvin films as often as TOS. The two stand as my preferred rewatching Trek.

I just get the impression that the taste had become worse in recent years, most likely because we do live in a dystopian era and people seem to have accepted that and the taste has changed because of that.

Personally I can't stand most of the series and movies from recent years. When it comes to Star Trek, I have tried but it doesnt work for me.

As for the Kelvin movies, I just don't like them. The stories are bad and I find the "rebooted" characters awful.

The only positive thing I have got out from it is that i created a new character.
Thomas J Kirk, the grand-grandson of James T Kirk, now a captain in the 24th century.
I had a buddy in school whose name was Thomas and he looked exactly like the "rebooted" Kirk

So being a 'loyal fan' has nothing to do with what TPTB produce then.



That doesn't change the point that someone new came along after Trek was dead in the water and reinvigorated it both for previous fans and for new ones. Which, you know, has happened before, and will happen again, to borrow a phrase from another sci-fi franchise.

Not if what TPTB produce what some of the loyal fans don't like.
Even loyalty has its limits.

I don't think that Star Trek became "reinvigorated". It became just a bad copy of something which once was good.

Of course, it is something wrong with everyone else. I’m not enamored with CBS Trek, but to try to make it out as a failure is intellectually dishonest.

I just don't like those new series and movies.
I really tried to like Picard but it didn't work for me.
SNW was a good concept but I started to lose interest when the started to bring in new actors as TOS characters.

I enjoyed PIC on initial watch. It was all nostalgia. I recently tried to rewatch season 2, and I didn't care for it. I have also enjoyed most of the PIC novels based on the show as well.

I never made it past the first season of DSC. The main was too perfect. I like my protagonists to have some flaws. I heard it gets kind of a reset in season 3, but I never made it that far. I've been meaning to give it another try.

I tried to like Picard.
I mean, for many, many years I've been waiting for a new series set in the 24th century. And then it came, with Picard and some other TNG characters as well.

But it was just a boring, gloomy mess.
Sort of "TNG from hell" or a funeral.

As for DSC, I found it totally unlikeable.
I couldn't stand the characters. The hysterical Captain reminded me of a crazy teacher I had in 5th class. Everytime there was some "unrest" in the classroom, she became hysterical and stared to scream that we behaved like we did because we hated her!

And the rest of the characters were plain boring.

Not to mention The Mutant Ninja Turtles Klingons! They were awful!

I mean, here we have this problem with how the Klingons looked in TOS and then the change in the TOS movies and TNG. There have been different atte,mpts to come up with some sort of explanation for the "changes", like that the old Klingons were "Northern Klingons" or some other Kilngon race and all that.

And then some ego-maniac producer just had to make it even worse by coming up with the Turtle Klingons, just to set his mark on Trek history.

I seem to recall many complaining Disco's cast was "unlikeable" back when the first season was originally airing.

They weren't just unlikeable, they were awful!
I gave up watching that series after five episodes.

 

[BillJ]

Rios chose to stay for love reasons, and his family started a medical service, Mariposas that lasted until the 24th century. He felt it was worth the risk.

Rios never made it to the post-atomic horror. One night at Taco Bell and it was all over for his 24th century innards.

 

[Dar70]

It appears that they sort of forgot about it in Picard. WW3 and the "post-atomic horror" seemed to have slipped their minds when they left poor Rios back in the 21st century.

They did reference the sanctuary districts that were in the bell riot episodes of DS9.

 

[fireproof78]

I just get the impression that the taste had become worse in recent years, most likely because we do live in a dystopian era and people seem to have accepted that and the taste has changed because of that.

Tastes are cyclical as is art. Our time is no more dystopian than previous eras of history

Personally I can't stand most of the series and movies from recent years. When it comes to Star Trek, I have tried but it doesnt work for me.

Which is why tastes can vary. It doesn't make them bad. Just not for a particular person, anymore than TNG or VOY is not for me.

 

[BillJ]

Personally I can't stand most of the series and movies from recent years. When it comes to Star Trek, I have tried but it doesnt work for me.

It is a good thing that other entertainment properties, music, video games, books and works of art exist outside the world of Star Trek and can be enjoyed instead of it, in the case that it no longer works for you.

I've just put about 90 hours into Starfield, and had more fun with it than pretty much any CBS Trek outside of Lower Decks.

 

[Lynx]

Tastes are cyclical as is art. Our time is no more dystopian than previous eras of history
Which is why tastes can vary. It doesn't make them bad. Just not for a particular person, anymore than TNG or VOY is not for me.

Unfortunately, there is a cloud of doom and gloom hanging over the world which also affects the entertainment area.

In the 80's or 90's, a new series could be about the brave crew on a spaceship which headed out in space to find new planets and alien races in universe.

If the same series is made today, it's about humanity leaving a devastated Earth to search for new planets which they can destroy and continue their wars on.

It is a good thing that other entertainment properties, music, video games, books and works of art exist outside the world of Star Trek and can be enjoyed instead of it, in the case that it no longer works for you.

I've just put about 90 hours into Starfield, and had more fun with it than pretty much any CBS Trek outside of Lower Decks.

Yes, but those other entertainment properties have been decimated in recent years because of the "doom factor", at least for me.

What is Starfield?

 

[Dukhat]

Not if what TPTB produce what some of the loyal fans don't like. Even loyalty has its limits.

But that's not what you said earlier. You said "Just wait and see what happens if Star Trek loses those loyal fans." As if that 'loyal fanbase' is the only thing keeping Star Trek afloat. Which is not sustainable. What will keep Star Trek afloat are new fans, not the minuscule percentage of 'loyal fans' who want ENT to come back after 30 years, or who want a Romulan War movie, as if that will suddenly fix all of Star Trek's viewership problems.

I don't think that Star Trek became "reinvigorated". It became just a bad copy of something which once was good.

That's just a subjective opinion which wasn't shared by CBS. You do realize that the whole reason why they deemed Star Trek to still be profitable was because of the tons of money JJ Abrams brought them? Whether you love or hate CBSTrek, the fact remains that Star Trek fans got six new shows because of that. I myself don't have tons of love for CBSTrek, but I'm not going to delude myself into thinking that it wasn't reinvigorated after ENT and Nemesis almost put the nail in the Trek coffin for good.

 

[Lynx]

But that's not what you said earlier. You said "Just wait and see what happens if Star Trek loses those loyal fans." As if that 'loyal fanbase' is the only thing keeping Star Trek afloat. Which is not sustainable. What will keep Star Trek afloat are new fans, not the minuscule percentage of 'loyal fans' who want ENT to come back after 30 years, or who want a Romulan War movie, as if that will suddenly fix all of Star Trek's viewership problems.

Don't forget that it was "loyal fans" who did keep Star Trek alive between 1967 and 1980.

And Star Trek needs a core of such fans. That doesn't have to mean bringing ENT back after 30 years or a Romulan war movie. It means producing good series and movies in the same style as TOS, TNG, DS9 and maybe VOY.

Personally I don't want to see TNG, DS9 or Voyager back because it would be impossible since not all of the actors who made those series so great are available now for different reasons and I definitely don't want new actors playing those characters. But I would like to see new characters in the same style as the one we had in those series.

And if we want new Star Trek fans, then we have to give them shows with the same quality as TOS, TNG, DS9 and maybe VOY.

Unfortunately we will never see a series like DS9 again.

That's just a subjective opinion which wasn't shared by CBS. You do realize that the whole reason why they deemed Star Trek to still be profitable was because of the tons of money JJ Abrams brought them? Whether you love or hate CBSTrek, the fact remains that Star Trek fans got six new shows because of that. I myself don't have tons of love for CBSTrek, but I'm not going to delude myself into thinking that it wasn't reinvigorated after ENT and Nemesis almost put the nail in the Trek coffin for good.

The reason why those NuTrek movies become such a success was because Trek fans were basically starving after a couple of years of nothing.

Nemesis was bad but they should have tried to come up with something better after that, not just give up as they actually did.

During VOYs end seasons, there were a lot of interesting suggestions for new series, like a Starfleet Academy series, a Lower Decks series, a Section 32 series, a NCIS or CSI Star Trek and such. They should have continued with that instead of making ENT and giving up after Nemesis.

 

[BillJ]

It means producing good series and movies in the same style as TOS, TNG, DS9 and maybe VOY.

TV and audience expectations have changed. Sometimes it is simply better to move on. I feel you, I miss the old days. I wish Trek was something that was more interesting to me in its current form, but it isn't.

The past is awesome, it is also the past. Don't miss the future yearning for something that simply can't be replicated.

To view this content we will need your consent to set third party cookies.
For more detailed information, see our cookies page.

Accept third party cookies

 

[fireproof78]

Unfortunately, there is a cloud of doom and gloom hanging over the world which also affects the entertainment area.

In the 80's or 90's, a new series could be about the brave crew on a spaceship which headed out in space to find new planets and alien races in universe.

If the same series is made today, it's about humanity leaving a devastated Earth to search for new planets which they can destroy and continue their wars on.

Dude, TOS and BSG did that. Doom and gloom is not new to this century or decade. Here's a letter from 1973 from an author discussing these same issues. It's not new: