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Spoilers Star Trek: Discovery 5x04 - "Face the Strange"

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Yeah, I can see that. I just wish it were real. Instead, he got altered by Tardigrade DNA, and while sometimes we see flashes of Old Stamets, it's mostly the altered one, and I have a hard time viewing that as real character growth.
I mean, I don't know how you define "real growth." Here is a man going through, well, the unknowable, and we expect it to look real?

I feel like he is trying to make up for lost time that he felt was missed due to the way his work went. We see that emphasis on relationship become more pressing, which, again, makes perfect sense.
 
I mean, I don't know how you define "real growth." Here is a man going through, well, the unknowable, and we expect it to look real?

I feel like he is trying to make up for lost time that he felt was missed due to the way his work went. We see that emphasis on relationship become more pressing, which, again, makes perfect sense.

If he is trying to make up for lost time, I'd like it if they would indicate that in some way. Until you brought it up, that never even occurred to me. I'm not saying I wanted a monologue about how much he regrets never having kids or something, but we had no indication of any desire for more family outside of Culber until he latched onto Adira.

Having him refer to his past self as "pre-tardigrade" was a bit grating too.
 
If he is trying to make up for lost time, I'd like it if they would indicate that in some way. Until you brought it up, that never even occurred to me. I'm not saying I wanted a monologue about how much he regrets never having kids or something, but we had no indication of any desire for more family outside of Culber until he latched onto Adira.

Having him refer to his past self as "pre-tardigrade" was a bit grating too.
I mean, to me it's telling in his language and body language. His shift from work focus to relationship focus. It's classic in the psychological presentation, at least to me. Mileage will vary.

Similarly, I find "Family Man" movie moving because of that shift in perspective for Cage's character. He doesn't want it; until he does.
 
I mean, to me it's telling in his language and body language. His shift from work focus to relationship focus. It's classic in the psychological presentation, at least to me. Mileage will vary.

Similarly, I find "Family Man" movie moving because of that shift in perspective for Cage's character. He doesn't want it; until he does.

Ah. I too am a big fan of Family Man.
 
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Adira and Gray: Adira, yes absolutely, decent actor, lots of potential unexplored in their "teen crush" on Detmer, and leaving and being away from Earth at a young age. A bit odd coming up with the "Symbiont in a human" angle but the alternative would have been either an initiate (done before), and emergency Trill non-initiate host (done before) OR an emergency Trill rejected unsuitable initiate host (could have been interesting and explored a lot of the same angles. However, the "hitching up with your symbion't previous host who was also your boyfriend"'s soul and is now in a synth body thing. No.

Also Ian Alexander irritiates the hell out of me, his over-smiling face, his ACAB Twitter handle, and his restricted ability to act.
 
Blatant because from the start, that was the big emphasis in the media. I'd be more forgiving if they'd done more with the characters, but with Gray it's especially egregious. He got a body, and then traipsed off to Trill. It felt like, once they got their magazine covers and such, they weren't really interested in doing much with either of them as characters. Like I said in another post, you contrast that with Captain Angel on SNW, who didn't get nearly the media attention but was treated more like a vital, interesting character, and it's jarring.

Yeah that's a radical interpretation of the text. It was in the news because it was a big deal. The negative reaction from a lot of the fanbase to queer characters being introduced, shows why it was vital to put the charcters front and centre. Gray was around for 2 seasons and had a large role in the fourth season when it came to Zora obtaining sentience, but ultimately Ian Alexander was a guest and sending Gray to trill to be a guardian was set up from the beginning.

Also what's not interesting about Adira joining Starfleet? They've been front and centre this season sciencing the science and helping the crew on multiple occasions get out of crises. They're going in confidence and being more assertive. I find Adira way more interesting to watch than Harry Kim. I tell you that. Angel was a fun character and Jesse James Keitel and Ethan Peck had phenomenal chemistry. I think we can celebrate both characters for their differences without using one to tear down the other.
 
Or...maybe...by having them come in already being called by their correct pronouns,we highlight how much of a non-issue it ought to be? No one on TOS ever talked about Uhura being Black, which arguably did more for inclusivity than pointing it out nonsensically in character.
You might call me biased becaue I'm trans myself, but the way I see it, instead of a huge dramatic scene with Adira's feelings being hurt and them giving an impassioned lecture to an embarrassed Stamets about how respecting the identities of others is important, it was treated as a matter of a simple misunderstanding, rectified as quickly and matter-of-factly as possible. My reading is that it was treated as much as a non-issue as it could've been. Adira being a teenager, it is perfectly in character for them to take a while to figure out their identity and on what terms they want to go public about it, if they want to.

And if we want to compare Adira specifying their preferred pronouns to Uhura feeling the need to disclose she's black, we need to keep the term visible minority in mind. Adira's gender is not visibly apparent to the uninitiated unless they directly disclose it themselves, which makes it a very different case from Uhura and the color of her skin or a Muslim Starfleet officer wearing a hijab as part of her normal uniform.

They can, but in this specific case the writers decided to sync up the experiences of the actor and the character, for greater verisimilitude. So Adira decided to use They/Them pronouns, and then tell the crew shortly after Blu did the same publicly.
It would require some connecting the dots, but I find it very telling that Adira came clean about their gender identity after unlocking the memories of the Tal symbiont. I'm not arguing that being joined made them nonbinary, rather that they obviously had so much going on that was repressed, that I find nothing surprising in them only coming out as nonbinary after the dust had (largely) settled, Gray stowing away in their mind aside.

I'm not sure why that would make a difference. Can a person not play NB if they aren't NB themselves? Jessie Keitel isn't NB, but she played one on SNW.
Jesse Keitel is a fringe case as she still identified as non-binary transfem when she was cast for the role (and possibly during filming as well), only coming out as a trans woman during SNW Season 1 being aired. But transgender is an umbrella term with gender being a spectrum, so a nonbinary actor playing a binary trans person or vice versa is still okay as both fall within the trans umbrella (case in point, Ian Alexander is nonbinary but plays a binary trans man). The point it becomes controversial is when a cisgender actor plays a transgender role, especially in an economy where trans actors are already struggling to find roles.
 
Jesse Keitel is a fringe case as she still identified as non-binary transfem when she was cast for the role (and possibly during filming as well), only coming out as a trans woman during SNW Season 1 being aired. But transgender is an umbrella term with gender being a spectrum, so a nonbinary actor playing a binary trans person or vice versa is still okay as both fall within the trans umbrella

I feel the need to point out we don't actually know what Captain Angel would describe themselves as in 21st century terms, or how much the character and actor have in common. All we know is that they use they pronouns.
 
"Get better helmets!" :lol: Had to give this one a nine for the well executed time jumping aspect. Finally Stamets gets something substantial to do, and there's good character development for Rayner. That Burnham v Burnham fight was well staged and logically concluded by the more seasoned version... I sure miss the Airiam character, having seen her again. Finally, the Krenim callback was well-received as well... Have to give it a 9, since I'm a sucker for halfway well-executed "high concept" timey whimey episodes...
 
Apparently the Discovery bridge crew couldn't believe Airiam would sacrifice her own life for theirs! Of course, they came around but it's a bit insulting that their first, unanimous reaction was "oh no she wouldn't!"

I'm pretty sure the crew was incredulous at the idea of Airiam "giving up" instead of "being strong" and finding another way to save herself. They were upset to learn she would die and thought Airiam would have fought the infection. And they thought that they would not have let Airiam sacrifice herself.

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Separate from that, I just want to say that Adira and Gray are deeply meaningful to me. Just a reminder that not everything is for everyone. Sometimes parts of the story speak to other people's experiences and sensibilities. I'm seeing a lot of dogwhistles being thrown around here and it's a little disturbing.
 
We all have a favorites and tend to make them a bigger deal than they actually were. Sulu, Uhura and Chekov come to mind. There are even people wishing for more from a two timer like Riley. Who in only two appearances had more background and personality than Sulu and Uhura combined.

Yup, us TOSers love Riley, DeSalle, Kyle and Leslie. Riley* should have been a regular from the jump.

*edit i was typing too fast and typed the wrong name here.
 
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And Stiles.

And Giotto.

from how early Balance of Terror is, it would have been quite reasonable to expect Stiles to be a regular at the post. The conflict might have carried more weight if it was between regulars in an ensemble cast.
 
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