No. Not even close. Not even a question. Chapel is 1000 times better than in TOS.
Is Chapel been written worse than TOS? (episode 5 spoilers)
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No. Not even close. Not even a question. Chapel is 1000 times better than in TOS.
You cannot commit adultry if you aren't married.
What happens on a break stays on a break.
LD exists as it's own thing for the most part.
It's basically Deadpool (although nowhere as funny). An exaggerated version of characters and events, looking at the Star Trek franchise from the outside-in. A story told from goofy, unreliable narrators.
It fits into SNW, even tonally.
Am I the only one who finds the seemingly near constant "alternate timeline" angle extemely exhausting? The cannonistas as well.
I think this franchise tries to treat cannon with respect and has people on staff whose main job is to try and keep things straight. However, the fact is, that the show has always had contradictory stuff in it, back to TOS. Every utterance of a character is not proof of anything. A character could be wrong, misinformed, misremembering, or not wanting to admit to something. And beyond that, it is a TV show with 886 episodes (and counting), 13 movies, and a bunch of fan fic, spanning 55+ years. Sometimes they just goof something.
By the time S2 of SNW ends, and DISCO5/LD4 airs, we will be over 900.
I think this franchise tries to treat cannon with respect and has people on staff whose main job is to try and keep things straight. However, the fact is, that the show has always had contradictory stuff in it, back to TOS. Every utterance of a character is not proof of anything. A character could be wrong, misinformed, misremembering, or not wanting to admit to something. And beyond that, it is a TV show with 886 episodes (and counting), 13 movies, and a bunch of fan fic, spanning 55+ years. Sometimes they just goof something.
By the time S2 of SNW ends, and DISCO5/LD4 airs, we will be over 900.
And there was also in-show evidence and acknowledgement in ENT: "Regeneration" that First Contact altered the Trek timeline. "Tomorrow and Tomorrow and Tomorrow" added nothing new.
Gene's vision - in the future, humanity will explore the stars, overcome all human prejudices and be completely polyamorous, whether legally married or not
Wasn't it in "Little Green Men" when Nog comments that Gabriel Bell looks like Sisko?
No, it did not. All it did was say it out loud and specify a possible mechanism rather than just implying it.
I assume it is the same timeline as TOS unless I am told otherwise. BUT I assume we are supposed to forget some of the ways women (and many other people and events) are represented on TOS in the SNW version. If we judge everything by the way it adheres to 1960s mores, the show will inevitably fail to live up to that because it is trying to modernise that world for us while still fitting into the general timeline of big events. Obviously there will be some tiny details that don't match up because, shocker, SNW was not written at the exact same time as TOS by the exact same people. As for Spock being 'immoral' for being with someone else besides T'Pring, that is not different than TOS so I do not see the issue.
No. No, you aren’t.
I would argue not better or worse. I think actually very similar, just like Spock, but told in a way where the meaning is kept by changing or reinterpreting the actions.
I was telling a story the other day to somebody who works for me and is a fair amount younger. My point was that they should feel better about missing something that they felt guilt over but the story I told involved not being able to find a pay phone.
After feeling like an old man, I told them a more embarrassing story about missing a work call on my cell because I was on a date that became intimate and I didn’t have my charger with me.
Both the stories were to illustrate the same point I was trying to reassure them with. But one of them resonated so much more because they had life experiences that related. It wasn’t that they couldn’t imagine a pay phone. It was that driving around looking for a pay phone then is the same thing as not having a charger now. It’s the same experience.
If TOS Chapel had been demonstrably having sex with Spock it would have ruined the point to that audience that the love was unrequited and doomed.
If SNW Chapel wasn’t in an actual physical relationship with Spock it would have ruined the point of it being (eventually/deeply) unrequited or at least doomed love because of how this audience would interpret her.
I will say, I think both Chapels deserve more credit. They are both fully realized people, acted well, showing the suffering in their own ways that comes from the fact that love can’t itself always overcome circumstance.
And also, incidentally, a reminder that Spock as much as he has humanity also still holds a truly alien sensibility.
I was telling a story the other day to somebody who works for me and is a fair amount younger. My point was that they should feel better about missing something that they felt guilt over but the story I told involved not being able to find a pay phone.
After feeling like an old man, I told them a more embarrassing story about missing a work call on my cell because I was on a date that became intimate and I didn’t have my charger with me.
Both the stories were to illustrate the same point I was trying to reassure them with. But one of them resonated so much more because they had life experiences that related. It wasn’t that they couldn’t imagine a pay phone. It was that driving around looking for a pay phone then is the same thing as not having a charger now. It’s the same experience.
If TOS Chapel had been demonstrably having sex with Spock it would have ruined the point to that audience that the love was unrequited and doomed.
If SNW Chapel wasn’t in an actual physical relationship with Spock it would have ruined the point of it being (eventually/deeply) unrequited or at least doomed love because of how this audience would interpret her.
I will say, I think both Chapels deserve more credit. They are both fully realized people, acted well, showing the suffering in their own ways that comes from the fact that love can’t itself always overcome circumstance.
And also, incidentally, a reminder that Spock as much as he has humanity also still holds a truly alien sensibility.
Nope.
No; he and T'Pring are very clearly not happening right now. His partners have been consecutive, not concurrent.
Being progressive in your writing of women as strong and not eye candy does not mean you can't write women characters as having relationships with men. That's a ridiculous argument.
No. The entire point of her arc in this episode is that she does not have low self-esteem. Hell, she brags about how good she is at her job all the time. She's confident as fuck.
Seems to me that you're imposing your ideas about romantic relationships and monogamy onto Spock, even though for all we know Vulcans could have a completely different value system regarding how monogamy ought to function. There is no reason at this moment to assume that Spock and T'Pring have any continuing romantic obligations to one-another in Vulcan culture.
Indeed, it would be very logical for a person who is unsure of their feelings to put one relationship on "pause" and then investigate the potential for a relationship with another person, in order to clarify what they really want and make a long-term decision.
Dude. They only just had their first real kiss. Let's calm down and give them a chance to decide what they want out of each other first.
To be clear, Jess Bush was nominated for a Nebula Award; she did not win.
It was, but Quark's amusing response that all humans look alike arguably casts doubt about it being true, in-universe.
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