Spoilers Star Trek: Picard 3x08 - "Surrender"

[Danja]

I know a lot of people keep screaming "We want Seven as captain of the Enterprise-G or Titan as a new show".

Am I the only one who would love a more understand relationship between Shaw and Seven? She still is learning about Starfleet and being a captain. What it truly means to lead. Shaw actually gave her the honor of taking down the Shrike.

I wouldn't mind a final scene in the last episode where we see the Titan in Spacedock, prepping for leaving. Some banter on the bridge between Seven and the crew. Shaw comes out of his ready room, there's a bit of dialogue, doesn't matter what. He takes his seat, Seven takes hers. He looks at her and says: Commander Seven.... Take us out.

EDIT: I absolutely loved Seven taking a stand and yell in Shaw's face 'My name is Seven Of Nine!'

I'd hate to leave her as a Commander for all eternity (especially under a racist idiot like Shaw).

We may or may not get a spinoff. This may be our last chance to see her.

Besides, Cadet Kirk was named Captain of the Enterprise. He was named Captain of the Enterprise with very little in the way of preparation.

If he can do it, why not Seven? (Seven has eighteen years of military experience.)

 

[KennyB]

I wasn't crazy about how Shaw herded everyone into the Ready Room (way to create a room full of targets).

She was already shooting crew members one at a time on the bridge.........Don't see him really having a choice.

 

[Danja]

She was already shooting crew members one at a time on the bridge.........Don't see him really having a choice.

Why make things easier for her?

 

[Mage]

I'd hate to leave her as a Commander for all eternity (especially under a racist idiot like Shaw).
/sci
We may or may not get a spinoff. This may be our last chance to see her.

Besides, Cadet Kirk was named Captain of the Enterprise.

Going from Cadet to Captain is just dumb. No real world works like that. There's is fantasy/scifi and there's credible.

Shaw is not a racist idiot. He suffers from trauma. Learning how to work with a person who used to part of what he hates, can heal him. Is his PTSD written poorly? I suppose. But it's PTSD nontheless.
Seven has literally JUST started with Starfleet. Fannymacfanfans might love the idea of Admirals falling in love with a character like we do, but again, a real world navy/military structure just doesn't work like that. So yeah, having Seven actually earn her captain stripes/pips instead of just giving them to her like a fanwank works better as a story.

 

[NCC-73515]

Not quite. It was all because of the 2000 presidential election. Generally, blue meant the incumbent and red the challenger, due to the association of blue with stability and red with change, but not for all networks. But because of how closely 2000 was decided and how long the vote in Florida was litigated, networks realized they needed to coordinate the color assignments to avoid confusion during the extended coverage, and as a result, the entire media was abuzz with talking heads hitting people over the head with the importance of whether a specific swing state would end up blue or red for long enough that the association of Republicans with red and Democrats with blue got stuck in the minds of the public.

And yet, there have been older uses of these colors. From Wiki:
Traditional political mapmakers, at least throughout the 20th century, had used blue to represent the modern-day Republicans, as well as the earlier Federalist Party. This may have been a holdover from the Civil War, during which the predominantly Republican north was considered "blue".
Later, in the 1888 presidential election, Grover Cleveland and Benjamin Harrison used maps that coded blue for the Republicans, the color perceived to represent the Union and "Lincoln's Party", and red for the Democrats.

 

[BBC 2 6pm]

That’s a whole other wing, Vadic and her crew of birdy-buckets are the attack dogs. There’s a kind of weird sense that apart from her herself, they aren’t even very good at changing shape. Either too damaged or new recruits I guess. Vadic isn’t the boss, and is a bit too nuts to be in charge.

She's clearly not totally in charge, but I don't buy that she's just the attack dog and was sent to get Jack. She has the Picard body, for example. She's clearly pretty central to the whole thing.

 

[BBC 2 6pm]

Why make things easier for her?

How would him relocating the ready room make it easier for her?

 

[Danja]

She has the Picard body, for example. She's clearly pretty central to the whole thing.

She HAD it (she did before the Shrike was blown into a million pieces).

How would him relocating the ready room make it easier for her?

I meant scattering them around the ship (or even ... GASP! ... having them fight!)

 

[Citiprime]

Rewatching the episode, Troi's description at the end during the observation lounge discussion is interesting. She calls the "darkness" that surrounds Jack "ancient and weak."

That sounds more like something on the spectrum of the Pah-Wraiths than the Borg Queen. The only problem is that I don't think they would have an ultimate villain with absolutely no connection to Picard.

 

[BBC 2 6pm]

Rewatching the episode, Troi's description at the end during the observation lounge discussion is interesting. She calls the "darkness" that surrounds Jack "ancient and weak."

It's Darth Plagueis.

 

[Danja]

Going from Cadet to Captain is just dumb. No real world works like that. There's is fantasy/scifi and there's credible.

It was good enough for Kirk.

Shaw is not a racist idiot. He suffers from trauma. Learning how to work with a person who used to part of what he hates, can heal him. Is his PTSD written poorly? I suppose. But it's PTSD nontheless.

How often has he deadnamed her this season? Even after she told him to stop.

Seven is a soldier, not a therapist. It's not her job to fix Shaw's issues.

Seven has literally JUST started with Starfleet. Fannymacfanfans might love the idea of Admirals falling in love with a character like we do, but again, a real world navy/military structure just doesn't work like that. So yeah, having Seven actually earn her captain stripes/pips instead of just giving them to her like a fanwank works better as a story.

If she does, we might never see it.

The series finale is in two weeks. I would rather not have to leave it to the fans' collective imagination.

 

[Mage]

It was good enough for Kirk.



How often has he deadnamed her this season? Even after she told him to stop.



If she does, we might never see it.

I would rather not have to leave it to the fans' collective imagination.

Just because they decided to do that for one movie, doesnt mean it makes sense. In TOS, Kirk commanded a ship as a Lieutenant for a while before going back to other duties.

And yes, he deadnamed her. Again, trauma.... The last few episodes have shown he's changing.

 

[BBC 2 6pm]

And yes, he deadnamed her. Again, trauma.... The last few episodes have shown he's changing.

Deadnaming is a bit complex in a military/naval environment I think. You could argue that it's totally correct to call someone whatever is on their paperwork.

 

[Mage]

Deadnaming is a bit complex in a military/naval environment I think. You could argue that it's totally correct to call someone whatever is on their paperwork.

Is that true? Interesting. Especially since Shaw is a stickler for rules.

 

[Danja]

Deadnaming is a bit complex in a military/naval environment I think. You could argue that it's totally correct to call someone whatever is on their paperwork.

There's the question of just what the "rules" are.

 

[Cortez]

This. Totally. These modern writers can't structure for shit. Also I get the impression - I'm not saying it is this, but it feels like this - that the episodes are almost written in isolation. And like a game of Chinese whispers they are writing a story they can only partially see from the episode before. The flow is erratic between episodes. It takes a lot of skill to write an arc vs episodes in isolation where logical structure doesn't need to follow week to week. And you get to episode eight and you thin when I boil it down... what has happened? It looks a lot, a lot of noise... but has it really progressed much story?

Ah sure we got TNG crew all sitting down together again, what more could you ask for?

Ah, it's just very disappointing. Chinese whispers is a great way of describing it. My own wild theory is that they were possibly told that they had a limited budget and a short space of time with which to write the script since alot of the money had been spent on TNG cast members salaries, so yeah, get cracking and fast. And it does feel like cast members had a bit of input into the story, which doesn't sound like a great good idea to me.

I'd love to think that Shaw suddenly comes to his senses, drags them out of his ready room, tells them that only for sheer blind luck (thanks Data and scriptwriters) and an absolute idiot of a villain (apologies Amanda Plummer) they'd all be dead as dodos right now, just like alot of his crew members right now. Meanwhile he's thrown Seven of 9 into a holding cell for gross dereliction of duty.

But that won't be happening. There'll be no fallout, no consequences. You only have to watch the last the scene with Shaw, where he asks his still active commander to obliterate the enemies ship to know that this part of the season is over. Blank canvas for the writing staff in next episode.

 

[starburst]

Good point... that said it might be regs to use a persons official name on their paperwork to address them in todays military but by the early 25th century I'd imagine it would be different, especially in an organisation like Starfleet which always makes out they are progressive on paper at least.

Though come to think of it the whole they/them pre-nouns seemed to be a big "coming out" type of deal in Discovery which is 700 years or more later.

 

[Orac Zen]

You could argue that it's totally correct to call someone whatever is on their paperwork.

You could, and Shaw certainly seems a very rule-oriented person. However, Seven has made it absolutely clear on several occasions that she wants to be called Seven of Nine. Shaw's ongoing insistence on doing otherwise strikes me as discourteous and utterly disrespectful, and a really petty thing for a starship captain to be hung up on. Having more respect for rules than for a human being is not - IMO at least - a good thing. (I've discovered the mileage of others varies a great deal in this matter.)

 

[BBC 2 6pm]

You could, and Shaw certainly seems a very rule-oriented person. However, Seven has made it absolutely clear on several occasions that she wants to be called Seven of Nine. Shaw's ongoing insistence on doing otherwise strikes me as discourteous and utterly disrespectful, and a really petty thing for s starship captain to be hung up on. Having more respect for rules than for a human being is not - IMO at least - a good thing. (I've discovered the mileage of others varies a great deal in this matter.)

Oh sure, they’re obviously just setting him up to show his redemption by calling her Seven. But like the Jack reveal, it’s gone on just a bit too long.

 

[Cortez]

They are space pirate vengeance blobs, not the Romulan Empire. Their strategy is big guns, terror, and hoping no one notices they have vital organs now.

They are exactly what the scriptwriter's require them to be at any given moment, logic be damned. It's a highly important mission, absolutely crucial to the attack on Starfleet. Not crucial, actually critical to its success. They may as well have sent the Marx Brothers.