Spoilers Star Trek: Picard 3x08 - "Surrender"

[firehawk12]

Apparently, she needs Jack alive, and wasn't sure where he was on the ship, since she had to send goons to find him. I guess cutting off their "sight" works both ways (Ron Moore was right, there's too much damn technology in Star Trek, you have to call out that you're inhibiting the transporters or jamming the internal sensors if you want anything to take any time or effort).

But if you render all the organics unconscious, it's trivial to just search the ship for him deck by deck. But then again, these Changelings were short sighted enough to give themselves lungs and can die in space, so maybe that wouldn't have worked. lol

Because she was tortured and cut up by the S31 scientist whose face she wears now. Her identity is formed in that moment — she exists there.

Villains usually are silly. Vadic was in pain, clearly suffering and sadistic. It makes sense to her. Sufficient for me.

Mileage will vary.

It's just odd characterization. Her intelligence changes based on the needs of the plot and isn't consistent.
I don't mind turning her into a generic mustache twirling villain, but it just seemed like a massive departure from the character who was happy to let the Titan go if they handed over Jack way back in episode 2 or 3.

 

[Sparky]

Last we saw it was near the “nebula”.

Just sitting there for the Pakleds to find it.

 

[DaveyNY]

I know, that's what I'm referring to. Khan was being sent off into the great unknown, and why would Kirk go to check on them?

That's the irrational part on Khan's behalf, expecting Kirk himself to be the one.
But, it's obvious that Captain Kirk never even reported to Star Fleet that he had left Khan on that planet, or the Reliant would not have been searching in that system to begin with.
So technically, it is Kirk's fault that things played out the way they did.

 

[Tiberius Jim]

Honestly, I don't really care all that much what is behind the red door. Especially with the overwhelming majority of those in the know saying it lands with a resounding "Oh, okay." And you know what? That's fine. I don't need to gasp in shock and awe when we see what's behind there. I'm perfectly content with "Oh, okay."

As long as, at some point in the finale, someone on the Titan (Sidney, perhaps?) receives a signal on her panel, while the Titan is the in midst of a hopeless battle against networked Starfleet ships programmed to destroy her, and alerts Captain Shaw...
"There's another starship coming in....

...it's the Enterprise!"

*Enterprise-D warps in, phasers and torpedoes firing*

That's when I'll gasp, will be shocked and in awe, and may even shed a tear. Here's hoping.

That said, if they do anything even close to this, please please please let the SFX guys get the old girl right and do her justice.

 

[Racefuel]

The big problem I am feeling is that they won't be able to stick the landing.

According to WW they do, but he's also a hype man, which I get..but doesn't necessarily make what he says untrue

 

[DaveyNY]

...these Changelings were short sighted enough to give themselves lungs and can die in space...

They were forcibly altered to be that way by the Black Ops scientist.
I rather doubt they would have chosen to be altered in such a manner.

 

[Racefuel]

That's the irrational part on Khan's behalf, expecting Kirk himself to be the one.
But, it's obvious that Captain Kirk never even reported to Star Fleet that he had left Khan on that planet, or the Reliant would not have been searching in that system to begin with.
So technically, it is Kirk's fault that things played out the way they did.

Oh you're touching that uncomfortable little tidbit aren't you.

A starship captain would have been briefed on "Hey, there's a 20th century genetic superman with egomaniacal tendencies and a predisposition to conquest on the 5th planet in the Ceti Alpha system...maybe don't go there"

More than likely either Kirk didn't report it or it was ultra classified.

 

[fireproof78]

It's just odd characterization. Her intelligence changes based on the needs of the plot and isn't consistent.

No. It changes based on how emotionally in control she feels.

 

[jaime]

But if you render all the organics unconscious, it's trivial to just search the ship for him deck by deck. But then again, these Changelings were short sighted enough to give themselves lungs and can die in space, so maybe that wouldn't have worked. lol



It's just odd characterization. Her intelligence changes based on the needs of the plot and isn't consistent.
I don't mind turning her into a generic mustache twirling villain, but it just seemed like a massive departure from the character who was happy to let the Titan go if they handed over Jack way back in episode 2 or 3.

She only *said* she was happy to do that. Probably for expediency. She’s been talking about cutting bits off them since the beginning. She’s suffering from a post-exogenous morphogenic field stabilisation, with trans-consciousness transferral rejection syndrome. I made that technobabble up as a long way of saying she’s nuts.

 

[BBC 2 6pm]

Honestly, I don't really care all that much what is behind the red door. Especially with the overwhelming majority of those in the know saying it lands with a resounding "Oh, okay." And you know what? That's fine. I don't need to gasp in shock and awe when we see what's behind there. I'm perfectly content with "Oh, okay."

This would have been me too if it was just after an episode or two, like the other mysteries they cleared up very quickly early in the season. But now they've built it up so much I'm expecting a lot more. If you're gonna hang two cliffhangers in a row on something, it better be good!

 

[BBC 2 6pm]

She only *said* she was happy to do that. Probably for expediency. She’s been talking about cutting bits off them since the beginning. She’s suffering from a post-exogenous morphogenic field stabilisation, with trans-consciousness transferral rejection syndrome. I made that technobabble up as a long way of saying she’s nuts.

I think it would have been better if she'd seemed more conflicted or torn about killing and torturing people. I thought maybe they were heading that way.

 

[thribs]

Troi said it’s something “weak and ancient”. That’s probably the only clue we are getting.

 

[jaime]

I think it would have been better if she'd seemed more conflicted or torn about killing and torturing people. I thought maybe they were heading that way.

Me too. And I think maybe she is. Because she knows she’s becoming more and more like the solids that did it for her. It’s in the performance, I would say.
She was also shit scared of Mr.Blobby on her hand.

Gonna be a shock when Noel Edmonds turns up in the finale, though perfectly in keeping with Trek to discuss Crinkly Bottoms.

 

[Yistaan]

She only *said* she was happy to do that. Probably for expediency. She’s been talking about cutting bits off them since the beginning. She’s suffering from a post-exogenous morphogenic field stabilisation, with trans-consciousness transferral rejection syndrome. I made that technobabble up as a long way of saying she’s nuts.

And as usual Vadic's boss trusts her with the very important task of retrieving Jack. It's like Shredder delegating world takeover plans to Bebop and Rocksteady in Ninja Turtles.

 

[DaveyNY]

Troi said it’s something “weak and ancient”. That’s probably the only clue we are getting.

To me, that kinda rules out Armus.
He's not weak by any means, he's just trapped on the planet's surface.

 

[jaime]

And as usual Vadic's boss trusts her with the very important task of retrieving Jack. It's like Shredder delegating world takeover plans to Bebop and Rocksteady in Ninja Turtles.

Unless Vadic is in some way related to Jack… dun dun dun. She’s the only consistently ‘human’ Changeling, and strongly implied to be the first of her gang.
The question is, who is she and the changelings working for?

 

[Romulan_spy]

I think someone who saw it was quoted earlier in this thread and said it was underwhelming.

I am aware of the Dave Cullen review where he says he found it underwhelming. That doesn't mean that I will find it underwhelming. We shall see.

 

[Yistaan]

Let's say the Borg theories are right and that Section 31 injected Jack with Locutus (Locutus specifically because none of the many other ex-B, including Tuvok or born of ex-B like Miral are shown as affected) nanoprobes taken from Picard to turn them into monsters. That's why Vadic implies she hears the same voices and visions as Jack, etc.

The presumed timeline of Vadic's capture and experimentation is during the Dominion War. That was almost 30 years ago. That means that Starfleet let Picard believe he had a regular defect all these years that was actually Borg and never bothered telling him.

 

[Romulan_spy]

Troi said it’s something “weak and ancient”. That’s probably the only clue we are getting.

Could it be the Iconians? They are ancient.

 

[Racefuel]

To me, that kinda rules out Armus.
He's not weak by any means, he's just trapped on the planet's surface.

Unless the weakness is due to distance