Spoilers She-Hulk: Attorney at Law discussion thread

[Dee1891]

I always noticed and liked his smirk/smile on just one side, and we saw it often enough in his show. I felt it expressed that, for various reasons we saw, he had a hard time letting himself be fully happy. The last scene of the series with him, Karen, and Foggy having a drink, with the whole Kingpin thing apparently settled, he was smiling and relaxed . I thought his appearance in She-Hulk carried on that relaxed, happy Matt.

Charlie Cox really expresses a lot with his face. He's great to watch.I could go with another Defenders series with Matt, Jen, Jessica, and Luke. I read somewhere Finn Jones throwing out the idea of a Heroes for Hire series; I could go with him too if the writers could handle him the right way.

I had no problems with the way Danny Rand was handled on Netflix, especially since Season One of "Iron Fist" is one of my favorite seasons of that franchise. Both Finn Jones and Mike Coulter had great chemistry and I would have loved to see them together in a "Heroes For Hire" series. As for Daredevil's appearance in this series, my feelings are . . . . eh. Aside from Season One, I was never a fan of "Daredevil".

 

[Skywalker]

Okay, I'm gonna go ahead and need them to give us Daredevil: Born Again immediately.

 

[Set Harth]

You’d think with this show being a comedy that the echo location discussion would lead to her comparing him to a bat, and hence Batman.
The joke was right there.

"Sonar. Just like a..."
"Submarine. Like a submarine, Mr. Wayne."

 

[Reverend]

I honestly thought this felt like a Mat who moved on from his really bad demons and found more happiness in life but still pretty tough as nails (in sofar a Netflix show can portray that). I enjoyed it.

Pretty much. Though I think people are confusing tone with personality; while 'Daredevil' was a dark and gritty show, Matt was still a charmer at times (like seriously, I think he's had more on screen sex partners than just about every other MCU hero combined) and had a very wry sense of humour. This show just emphasised that side of him more.

Also worth remembering that it's been a while since all of that went down. IIRC the last season of Daredevil took place in '17, while this show takes place in either '24 or '25 depending on who you ask (or both, depending on how much time has already passed over the course of the first season.) That's at least two or three years if he blipped, but seven or eight if he didn't! Either way, it's plenty of time for him to have moved on and found some equilibrium in his life.

 

[FPAlpha]

I haven't seen it yet ( had a horrible day yesterday and went to bed as soon as i came home) but it seems it is a very good one. A friend of mine regularly rips the show to pieces, she hates it and only waited until Daredevil appeared and she didn't hate that episode ( why she still watched the entire run is beyond me, she just could have read reviews to see if it's the episode he appears in).

 

[Hartzilla2007]

So it’s been noted that Matt Murdock has apparently improved his parkour skills.

 

[Timelord79 (he/him)]

So it’s been noted that Matt Murdock has apparently improved his parkour skills.

He’s using MCU physics now.

 

[FPAlpha]

He’s using MCU physics now.

I have seen a spoiler clip the day before the episode aired when She Hulk smashes the roof and he's about to fall into the crack but vaults out of it Spiderman style.

That took me a bit out of the entire thing. The Netflix show had him more or less realistically but here he seems much more agile than normal for eben a well trained human, i'm not sure i like it.

 

[Starkers]

That was great, and I've never watched the Netflix show but I like Cos as Daredevil and he and Jen had great chemistry.

Loved DD's walk of shame.

I do want Jen to tear the heads off the people who did that at the end though

 

[Guy Gardener]

Assholes in tactical gear, probably damage control, show up the moment she hulks out, because she was provoked by unknown persons, who might just be those assholes in tactical gear.

 

[Guy Gardener]

That was great, and I've never watched the Netflix show but I like Cos as Daredevil and he and Jen had great chemistry.

Loved DD's walk of shame.

I do want Jen to tear the heads off the people who did that at the end though

It wasn't sexual or slutshaming.

They just wanted to put her in a cage and they manufactured a reason.

 

[FPAlpha]

If I had to rationalize it, Matt's abilities have always been beyond "normal". I mean, I've trained like hell in my life and never come close.

His senses are enhanced but so is every neural connection in his body. He senses one thing, sees the entire picture and reacts. Like (totally mundane) when I'm driving. What I see ahead is what's going to happen in 5 seconds. What I see around me is what's happening now. What's in my rear view mirror is both what has happened, and what is speeding up to me. I have to process this all and get a picture of past, present, and future.

Not kidding, this is how I drive. I don't focus on one thing; not the road, not the song on the radio, not you sitting beside me chatting, not the pedestrian that's about to step out, not that cyclist that might be doing any goddam thing. It's all there, right now all around me. And this is how i imagine Matt's reality x10. It's not so farfetched that I can't believe it in a sci-fi world.

I've tried to explain this to my son when I teach him to drive. He kind of gets it. It's not all that far-fetched. "Seeing" it all is Matt's real super-power.

The real superpower is Matt's way above average perception but that doesn't mean his body is also on superhuman levels. Comics fudge this of course and rank "olympic level training" as something that a human could do when in reality it would be only possible in a gym with extensive preparation ( and nobody attacking them or the building collapsing).

As i have said i haven't seen the episode yet but the clip, to me, really showed something that Spiderman would be able to do ( who has an enhanced body and strength) but not a normal human, even a very well trained one.

For me the only concern is further down the road with the upcoming Daredevil show - i simply don't know yet if i want to see a hyperagile Daredevil instead of a "realistic" one that we got in the Netflix show.

 

[Guy Gardener]

Matt Murdock in the comics has super sensitivity. When he punches someone in the face, it feels like someone dropped 3 cars on his hand.

This should make him terrible at unarmed combat.

 

[Oso Blanco]

For me the only concern is further down the road with the upcoming Daredevil show - i simply don't know yet if i want to see a hyperagile Daredevil instead of a "realistic" one that we got in the Netflix show.

I don't. I like the realistic version a lot more. Maybe it was just a CGI problem, just like She-Hulk's face whenever she was in her office.

Does that have something to do with her hairstyle? She always has her hair up in the office, and that's when her facial moves look like really bad CGI.

 

[CorporalCaptain]

I think some of the time She-Hulk has uncanny valley issues. But I fully expected ("knew") that would happen up front; it's to be expected. On the other hand some of the sequences are truly fantastic. I suspect that they're on the bleeding edge of what they can deliver on time and (reasonably) within their budget. I don't know, but perhaps they focus on perfecting some sequences while leaving others at whatever level they have to. This type of animation will only get better over time. Plus, with a larger budget (reportedly it's pretty large as is), they could undoubtedly do more. In terms of story, heart, and acting, the show is delivering.

 

[FPAlpha]

So i have seen the episode and i have to divide up my thoughts into MCU Daredevil and Netflix Daredevil.

As an MCU Daredevil this works - he has been written completely in the MCU mold, i.e. funny oneliners during a fight, witty comments beside and less dramatic.

If however you take the Netflix "origin" into account it's atrocious because it takes everything away that made me such a huge fan of the Netflix Marvel shows, mainly Daredevil and Punisher. The Netflix shows had a more gritty and down to earth feeling which suited these street level superheroes - their powers were not superflashy, they didn't level whole cityblocks and their stories were very interesting and unfolded slowly.

Now it's not fair to judge an extended cameo appearance and call doom on the entire character but if this is the template how Daredevil will be when he gets his own MCU show i will have to continue to separate both versions. I'm sure i will like MCU Daredevil, after all i watch MCU movies and shows for the oneliners and flashy fights but the Netflix shows have a special place with me because they were so different from the standard MCU mold.

 

[Dee1891]

I've always felt that Daredevil, along with Luke Cage, Jessica Jones, Iron Fist and the Punisher; were part of the MCU since 2015. The Netflix shows DID reference the MCU movies a good deal, if not as much as "Agents of SHIELD". Frankly, I feel that Kevin Feige was being full of it, when he "declared" that the Marvel TV shows were not a part of the MCU. Or when he had accused "SHIELD" of not following the movies - which was a big lie.

 

[FPAlpha]

I've always felt that Daredevil, along with Luke Cage, Jessica Jones, Iron Fist and the Punisher; were part of the MCU since 2015. The Netflix shows DID reference the MCU movies a good deal, if not as much as "Agents of SHIELD". Frankly, I feel that Kevin Feige was being full of it, when he "declared" that the Marvel TV shows were not a part of the MCU. Or when he had accused "SHIELD" of not following the movies - which was a big lie.

I don't recall the Netflix shows actively referencing the MCU too much - i can honestly only remember Daredevil season 1 where they had a Stan Lee poster somewhere on a wall and the NYC fight in Avengers was mentioned casually in a newspaper.

Agents of Shield tried to be connected in its first season, obviously Coulson's miraculous survival and the appearance of Jackson's Nick Fury were big pieces and they had some smaller ones ( apart from the connection to the events in Winter Soldier) but onwards from season 2 they were basically detached for the most part and then stopped entirely referencing the MCU when it became apparent that the movie franchise wasn't interested in a collaboration and the MCU never even mentioned them in a single sentence.

I don't think Feige was full of it - he just has a very clear plan about the MCU ( at least until Endgame, now i'm wondering what the plan is but we are just somewhere in the middle so it may not be apparent yet) and for it to work he needs total control, something he didn't have as much with projects outside of Marvel Studios. The Disney+ shows are completely in the fold though - Loki was used to kickstart the Multiverse, Wandavision returned to familiar characters and laid groundwork for movies and other TV Shows and Ms. Marvel will connected directly to the next Captain Marvel movie etc.

 

[Guy Gardener]

I don't recall the Netflix shows actively referencing the MCU too much - i can honestly only remember Daredevil season 1 where they had a Stan Lee poster somewhere on a wall and the NYC fight in Avengers was mentioned casually in a newspaper.

Agents of Shield tried to be connected in its first season, obviously Coulson's miraculous survival and the appearance of Jackson's Nick Fury were big pieces and they had some smaller ones ( apart from the connection to the events in Winter Soldier) but onwards from season 2 they were basically detached for the most part and then stopped entirely referencing the MCU when it became apparent that the movie franchise wasn't interested in a collaboration and the MCU never even mentioned them in a single sentence.

I don't think Feige was full of it - he just has a very clear plan about the MCU ( at least until Endgame, now i'm wondering what the plan is but we are just somewhere in the middle so it may not be apparent yet) and for it to work he needs total control, something he didn't have as much with projects outside of Marvel Studios. The Disney+ shows are completely in the fold though - Loki was used to kickstart the Multiverse, Wandavision returned to familiar characters and laid groundwork for movies and other TV Shows and Ms. Marvel will connected directly to the next Captain Marvel movie etc.

The Timeline Diverged with Infinity War.

For those those who haven’t been regularly tuning in, a little bit of backstory: Last May, just before the fifth season finale, the episode “The One Who Will Save Us All” (Season 5, Episode 20) featured the first mention of Thanos in any of the Marvel television series. Long story short, General Glen Talbot became the super-powered villain known as Graviton and in a discussion with the the alien “Confederacy,” confirmed the Earth was currently under attack by Thanos’ forces. Now, we already know that Adrian Pasdar’s character did not in fact intervene with Thanos’ invasion, and if you kept watching the rest of the season, you found out that Talbot was blasted into space. The point you should all take away from this though, is that it put Agents on the same timeline as the beginning of Infinity War.

https://collider.com/agents-of-shield-mcu-timeline-explained/

 

[Gov Kodos]

All of that joy and fun came crashing down in the final minutes. Despite the fourth-wall breaking that warned us that things were about to get bad, it still hurt to see Jen have her privacy violated in such a public and humiliating fashion, all to deliberately provoke her anger and make her look bad. There are a lot of implications from that cliffhanger and I don't know how the finale will be able to satisfactorily addresses all of the issues presented, while giving Jen the opportunity to redeem and vindicate herself. Oh, and deal with whomever is behind this attack on her persona.

I have been thinking Holloway is the big bad behind everything ever since he picked up the phone when Jen decided to take on the Blonsky parole hearing. Just the way he said 'There you are!' made me feel he had more up his sleeve than getting a hulk on the payrole.

I think he has been reeling her in from the start when she revealed herself in ep 1. Revealing him as the big bad could tie all the issues together and allow a rapid resolution. I wouldn't be surprised he tries using some experimental formula to make him a red hulk followed by a big throw down wish involves Emil helping Jen and Bruce as well. Jen was trying to call him in the wedding episode so I wouldn't be surprised it foreshadowed his coming back, especially after Jen had the very hulk smash moment he warned her of.

Jen did have her anger moment before but they were subtle. Crushing the stapler unawares in the Titania name brand episode. Her screaming fit with Ched in the same episode. The heavy party drinking at the wedding. Jen is good at burying her anger but she isn't great at acknowledging her anger. She suppresses it but like Spock it can come out all Pon Farr under particular forms of induced duress. I suspect Holloway has been wanting to cage Jen from the start. This episode was the culmination of that plan. Now, they can get blood samples and all sorts of other things since She-Hulk is a public menace.