Spoilers Star Trek: Discovery 2x04 - "An Obol for Charon"

[Nerys Myk]

Does anybody seriously think that Spock actually killed anybody? I mean, did Scotty actually kill that belly dancer on Argelius? Did Sarek actually kill the Tellarite ambassador? Did Kirk really assassinate Gorkon?

Heroes falsely being suspected of murder is as old as THE FUGITIVE at least.

Don't believe the Federation propaganda. They're all guilty!!!!!

 

[Alan Roi]

Does anybody seriously think that Spock actually killed anybody? I mean, did Scotty actually kill that belly dancer on Argelius? Did Sarek actually kill the Tellarite ambassador? Did Kirk really assassinate Gorkon?

Heroes falsely being suspected of murder is as old as THE FUGITIVE at least.

I said attempted murder. And none of the others actually believed they killed anyone. Spock on the other hand, bit of a different story in Amok time. He would have happily beaten Kirk to a pulp for just insulting him and his old/current girlfriend in This Side of Paradise or McKoy in Alll Our Yesterdays. he really depends on his Vulcan logic and discipline to keep his rage in check.

 

[Nerys Myk]

Spock's an angry drunk.

 

[JoeZhang]

The last scene of the season will be Spock laughing maniacally "I got away with it - like my ancestor Jessica Fletcher!"

 

[Greg Cox]

I think some of the perceptions here about friendship are interesting. I have a best friend, who is essentially a brother of mine. He has 3 half-siblings. The only reason I even know this is because our other friend, who is equally as close, and knew him since he was a baby, knows this as a matter of course..

An excellent point. I can think of dozens of friends and colleagues whom I've known for decades, hang out with regularly, have even collaborated on books with, but do I know all about their siblings and cousins and such? Of course not. And when you're talking about a far-flung universe where your family members are likely scattered across six quadrants, how likely are even your close friends to be that familiar with your family tree? How often did Beverly Crusher discuss her siblings with Deanna? But does anybody think that Troi wouldn't get weepy if Beverly was on her deathbed? In general, Star Trek characters only discuss their long-lost relatives when they become a plot point. "Why, look, it's my estranged sister whom I've never mentioned before!"

Hell, Kirk didn't even know that Sulu had a daughter . . ..

 

[IMC Headquarters]

Kelvin Spock would have beaten Khan to death.

Yeah, don't block Spock. Grok Spock. But don't block him.

Say...what if Saru now develops love ganglia to replace those of fear?

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

Is this not the same guy who will attempt (and believe he succeeded) to murder his best friend and superior officer?

Spock gets a free pass in that case because of the pon farr.

 

[Nerys Myk]

Kelvin Spock would have beaten Khan to death.

Prime Spock was well known for handing out beatings (usually on Kirk)

 

[Alan Roi]

Spock gets a free pass in that case because of the pon farr.

Spock wasn't really going for the 'incapable of telling right from wrong' due to Vulcan horniness defense there.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

Spock wasn't really going for the 'incapable of telling right from wrong' due to Vulcan horniness defense there.

The point is, the kunat kalifee is a recognized, legal duel to the death as per Vulcan culture. If Spock had killed Kirk, he would not have been guilty of any crime. It's not murder in any sense of the word; it's Spock doing his part to fulfill his obligations to his mate (and to Vulcan society in general).

It would be grossly inaccurate to say that Spock was attempting to murder Kirk. He did no such thing. Spock was simply fulfilling his place in the ceremony; the fact that T'Pring chose Kirk as her champion (as was her right) was the kicker. Once she did that, Spock literally had no choice but to fight Kirk to the death.

 

[Rusty0918]

Spock could have committed the murders that he was accused of, but under the influence. Actually it would be a bold chance for them to take that avenue with him. Though it might taint the way we look at him.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

Extreme emotional disturbance would surely be a defense in any jurisdiction. Even when Vulcans are involved.

Remember, Vulcan emotions are much rawer and more dangerous than human emotions. When pushed to the limit, there's no telling what a Vulcan might do.

 

[Nerys Myk]

Spock could have committed the murders that he was accused of, but under the influence. Actually it would be a bold chance for them to take that avenue with him. Though it might taint the way we look at him.

Or, if like his father, he had a reason. And would do so logically and efficiently.

 

[Tim Thomason]

I like the theory posted online that the holographic communicators are just huge security risks waiting to happen. Basically, that the viewscreens have always been unable to look at what's on the aft-facing consoles in other shows, which could contain vital information, but some of the holographic communicators have been shown to observe their surroundings quite fully. Tilly's desk, for example.

It also goes with the low-tech theory that 2260s occurs after some massive computer hacking was done upon Starfleet.

 

[dahj]

Holocomms are basically 4-camera smartphones.

You don't need 4 cameras on a smartphone!

 

[Alan Roi]

Once she did that, Spock literally had no choice but to fight Kirk to the death.

Sure he had a choice. He could have said screw Vulcan tradition, its illogical, and not be put into a position of killing his best friend. The cost would have been high, but then so was killing his best friend.

 

[Alan Roi]

Extreme emotional disturbance would surely be a defense in any jurisdiction. Even when Vulcans are involved.

Remember, Vulcan emotions are much rawer and more dangerous than human emotions. When pushed to the limit, there's no telling what a Vulcan might do.

So Vulcan's get to take the Machismo defense? I guess Brazil and its laws are a lot more in vogue in the 23rd century Federation?

 

[Ar-Pharazon]

I gave it a 10 again, because it was a veritable emotional rollercoaster and it was actually the first episode this season that managed to bring tears to my eye; twice, actually. The first was when they finally figured out what the sphere wanted and were able to fulfill its dying wish in the very last moment, and it pushed them clear of the explosion and even showed were Spock went, out of gratitude. The second was when Saru survived after all. I've found both sequences cathartic, and it was helped greatly by the stellar performances from the entire cast. Number One's role was a bit shorter than I expected, but it did turn out to have a huge impact.

I would say three moments. The two you mention, plus Tilly singing Space Oddity, for some reason. If anybody's music is remembered in 300 years, why not David Bowie?

 

[SJGardner]

I would say three moments. The two you mention, plus Tilly singing Space Oddity, for some reason. If anybody's music is remembered in 300 years, why not David Bowie?

For me, much of the poignance of the scene came only in retrospect. As I was first watching the episode, I was far too tense and worried for Tilly to truly appreciate not only how appropriate that song was to the situation but how the entire sequence spoke volumes about the depth of her and Paul's relationship. I admit I don't know Bowie as much as I should but I agree that he'd definitely be among those who withstand the test of time and the more I think about it, the more sense it makes for Tilly finding his music close to her heart.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

Sure he had a choice. He could have said screw Vulcan tradition

No, he couldn't.

Never mind the expectations of Vulcan society, Spock was biologically compelled to take part in the kunat kalifee. All Vulcans are. It's absolutely unavoidable. It is, quite literally, in their blood.