Spoilers Star Trek: Discovery 1x15 - "Will You Take My Hand?"

[JD]

Now...would they be willing...and able...to get Greenwood and Quinto? Even if only for five to ten minutes?

Who might be Pike's "Number One" for DSC purposes?

They already got James Frain instead Ben Cross, so I have a feeling pretty much any familiar characters we see, except maybe Enterprise characters, will be recast.

So, the thin that bums me out is the resolution was too dang easy and dorsnt truly make any sense.
1.) Loreal convincing the klingons that there was a planet destroying bomb which she had the button to was too easy,

2.) convincing Cornwell in a five minute conversation, with genocide breathing down her neck, that this new plan is going to work, considering the risks seemed way to dang easy.

3.) I get Tyler's decision at the end and it makes sense, but Loreal was his torturer / rapist / lover, just too dang easy.

4.) Mike convincing George-yo without a real fight or conflict, too dang easy.

5.) They made this a bit of a deal, Emperor George-yo pretending to be captain George-yo but miraculously this never panned out to be any sort of a problem.

Just lame easy writing, a little saddening with such great acting.

It certainly wasn't a well-thought-out plot, that's for certain.

As for Tyler...that was just insulting. It's like Discovery writers were afraid to pull the trigger on practically every single potentially realistic and interesting plotline they introduced:

A nuanced portrayal of a wartime commander who'd suffered a lot, was still suffering, and had more common sense and strategic acumen than all of the Admiralty combined...

...nah, he's Mirror Universe. Because Prime Universe Starfleet captains are all neutered utopian beta-males (except for Kirk but, apparently, the writers have forgotten that Kirk acted a lot like Lorca did and no one's condemned him for it).

A sensitive portrayal of a male victim of sexual abuse and torture (by a woman, no less!), suffering from PTSD, and struggling to come to grips with the aftermath of what he'd experienced...

...nah, he's this completely implausible bastard stepchild of Frankenstein's Monster and the Manchurian Candidate.

A realistic portrayal of a human, raised on Vulcan, who's struggling to find her way, only to make a horrible decision to mutiny against her surrogate mother/captain, and now must find a way to redeem herself every time she looks in the mirror...

...nah, mutiny is no big effin' thing; here's a full expungement of your record.

Good lord, they could've done so much with all of these issues but...they didn't. They didn't do it. They went the easy way out with each and every one of them and the end result was a poorer product, in my estimation.

I kind of feel as if this is just the normal growing pains of the series and, perhaps, a season-long prologue of sorts. I suspect we'll get the episodic planet-a-week type adventures next season to a greater degree and, mayhap, that's for the best.

Sorry, but this really bugs me, it's L'Rell and Georgiou.

As for the episode, I enjoyed it, even if the resolution of the Klingon War was a big underwhelming.
Loved all the stuff on Qo'nos, and especially loved stoned Tilly and Clint Howard.
I was pretty happy with where they left things with pretty much everyone. I'm glad Georgiou and Ash are still out there, even if they won't be a regular presence.
Even if the way it played out could have used some work, the idea behind the resolution of the Klingon War felt very Trek to me. The war ending through both sides cooperating and talking to each other really felt like a true Trek to me. On top of that the big speech at the end really solidified the fact that they are staying true to Trek's ideals.
I was a bit surprised and kinda disappointed we didn't get at least one more big epic battle, or even a Burnham/Georgiou fight before the end.
Loved seeing the Enterprise at the end there.

 

[Agony_Boothb]

I'm a gawdam prophet.

You're like that blind russian lady Baba Vanga

 

[JD]

Anybody notice the Ceti Alpha V eels from Wrath of Khan in the Orion marketplace? Nice little Easter egg.

Yeah, I caught that, but I couldn't tell if there were any other easter eggs there other than the Trill.

 

[The Memetic Susurrus]

TATV was worse. As was the Neutral Zone and Shades of Grey.

Granted...but those were, alas, "a long time ago..." ;-)

 

[Vger23]

While I agree the [final] group of writers isn't as talented as one would like, I do think this episode represents the culinary failure created by the Too-Many-Cooks Syndrome that was so obvious early in the series.

Given recent events, it's a pretty safe bet Fuller was the problem all along and no one knows how much damage his decisions (and departure) did, so I'm willing to give the final group the benefit of the doubt. However, I do absolutely agree CBS needs to bring in a new showrunner - someone with some experience.

It seems clear to me that Fuller is a bit of an unreliable and whacky chap. I have attributed much of this seasn's unevenness to his involvement and hasty departure.

I'm looking forward to a more cohesive season 2. If they an make S2 mor cohesive and retain the fun and other things that made S1 one of my favorites...they'll have hit it.

 

[Midquest]

I expected a shoot 'em up, but got a pretty quiet and thoughtful denouement mostly set in a place looked like Blade Runner meets Miyazaki. That's not a bad thing at all.

Now excuse me while I ponder the idea of seeing Pike and Number One again.

 

[CorporalClegg]

TATV was worse. As was the Neutral Zone and Shades of Grey.

Some of Star Trek's best episodes were season finale's So were some of its worst. This one realistically falls somewhere in the middle.

 

[thribs]

I hope they fix the Klingons next season so they actually look like Klingons. And show some of the Augment ones. Should be cheaper.

 

[Locutus of Bored]

Red pill party of one...

The only thing missing is the word cuck.

Knock it off or you'll earn an infraction.

 

[thribs]

Best of Both Worlds and Scorpion are my favourites. The season 5 finale of DS9 was good as well but I don’t remember the name.
DS9 has a few good cliffhangers, thinking about it.

 

[eschaton]

While I agree the [final] group of writers isn't as talented as one would like, I do think this episode represents the culinary failure created by the Too-Many-Cooks Syndrome that was so obvious early in the series.

Given recent events, it's a pretty safe bet Fuller was the problem all along and no one knows how much damage his decisions (and departure) did, so I'm willing to give the final group the benefit of the doubt. However, I do absolutely agree CBS needs to bring in a new showrunner - someone with some experience.

Fuller may indeed have been a problem. I think the story was hurt tremendously by his spendy nature if nothing else. Big money went into the first two episodes, and it's been pretty clear that Discovery has had a much lower budget since then, severely limiting the type of stories they could tell.

But I'm not sure I'd blame the arc's failures as a whole on him. We know he didn't come up with the idea of Lorca being a MU character, for example.

I certainly hope that when the "seventy five year mission" comes out, we get the backstory of what occurred this season. I'm sure it would be interesting reading.

 

[XCV330]

10/10
Perfect ending.

 

[The Memetic Susurrus]

It seems clear to me that Fuller is a bit of an unreliable and whacky chap. I have attributed much of this seasn's unevenness to his involvement and hasty departure.

I'm looking forward to a more cohesive season 2. If they an make S2 mor cohesive and retain the fun and other things that made S1 one of my favorites...they'll have hit it.

I hate to say it, in re: Fuller, but I think you're right. He's beginning to get something of a reputation of not finishing what he started and it would not surprise me a bit if a lot what we've seen as unevenness could be attributed to a conflict in visions. The writing team had to, unenviably, pick up a lot of the pieces when he left. Who knows what survived? For all we know, it might have been worse...but probably not.

Still, loved him on Hannibal. Just wish he could've finished out this one season, just to see what he would've made of it.

 

[Silversmok3]

Must have watched a different season. The entire season was about living up to Federation/Starfleet ideas.

Really?
Cause the dudes with the black badges don’t appear to care about “Boldly Going Where No Else Went Before” . Neither did Admiral Cornwall, who installed an alternate dimension war criminal and gave her the highest value defensive asset in Starfleet. The Emperor of the Terran Empire is the head of a morally bankrupt dictatorship; she would have jumped Discovery to Paris,blown a hole through the Presidents office and set herself up to rule . Instead the leader of a Mirror Universe dictatorship is sneaking a bomb into Qonos under orders of a Federation she despises? WTF.

The reason Picard speech’s worked for Picard is because (TV Picard anyways) he didn’t say one thing and do something else. It doesn’t work for a convicted mutineer whos a fugitive from Federation justice.

Yes kids,she’s a fugitive; Captain Lorca was himself a fugitive from the Mirror Universe, so .....how is his wartime conscription of Burnham and her subsequent promotion to Specialist legal? He wasn’t the lawful captain of Discovery.

The season started off good,then got lost in the mycelial network of lazy writing.

 

[Agony_Boothb]

Best of Both Worlds and Scorpion are my favourites. The season 5 finale of DS9 was good as well but I don’t remember the name.
DS9 has a few good cliffhangers, thinking about it.

Call to arms was the name of the season 5 DS9 finale

 

[Campe]

9/10. Loved seeing the new 1701 and the TOS-esque uniforms in the background albeit a little fuzzy. I thought the whole arc was tied up a little too neatly and quickly. I would have liked to see a longer finale or a two-parter.

Bring on season 2!

 

[Vger23]

Fuller may indeed have been a problem. I think the story was hurt tremendously by his spendy nature if nothing else. Big money went into the first two episodes, and it's been pretty clear that Discovery has had a much lower budget since then, severely limiting the type of stories they could tell.

But I'm not sure I'd blame the arc's failures as a whole on him. We know he didn't come up with the idea of Lorca being a MU character, for example.

I certainly hope that when the "seventy five year mission" comes out, we get the backstory of what occurred this season. I'm sure it would be interesting reading.

It wasn't entirely his fault for sure.

My guess is that his premise had unquestionable problems. Then, he left, and the remaining staff REALLY struggled with what to do with it and how to make it their own while still living up to the elements that had already been committed to.

So, part was on him in terms of development...part on himfor his departure...and part on the remaining staff for struggling to pull it back together totally smoothly.

 

[Jesse1066]

I gave it a 10, mostly for the easter eggs.

 

[Boomer359]

The peeing Klingon had two streams. No wonder McCoy had questions about their anatomy.

Also, poor Voq. Really puts "bone grinding" in a new light. That's a hell of a sacrifice.

 

[XCV330]

So would the battle of Axanar have taken place in those lost 9 months?

It took place in lawyer's offices and California court filings.