Spoilers Star Trek: Discovery 1x11 - "The Wolf Inside"
- Thread starter Commander Richard
- Start date
I'm curious to know how there even is a MU Spock if Vulcans are hated. Even if MU Amanda didn't hate Vulcans herself, how would she end up with Sarek?
if the Defiant doesn't end up in the MU, the Discovery would have no way to return to the PU to report the Defiant ending up in the MU in the first place, creating one of those paradoxes that in speculative fiction leads to exploding universes and dissappearing siblings
And tacos that taste like rubber. Can't have that.
in short: wibbly wobbly timey wimey with the added complexity of alternate universes on top.
I'm no rocket surgeon, but I know that is something one does not mess with.
I'm no rocket surgeon, but I know that is something one does not mess with.
But do they know any details -- such as how and when whatever happens to the defiant happens? Will whatever happens to it happen during Defiant's first year in service -- or maybe not until after 20 years in service? Plus, if they don't know how the Defiant got there, they wouldn't know what to do (or what not to do) to keep it from happening again.
I suppose if Discovery came back to the prime universe armed with information about the existence of the Defiant in the MU and passed it on to Starfleet, Starfleet (I suppose) could try to "beat" history by NOT naming one of its ships "Defiant", but it seems to me that the ship could still eventually end up in that part of Tholian space with the dimensional rift whether it is named "Defiant" or not.
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Saru said their Defiant was out on patrol. So it already exists.
Ahh. Thanks! I must have missed that.
Maybe I should have said "they can change the name"
The rest still holds true: If they don't know how or when the Defiant will get there, there is not really anything specific they could do to keep it from happening other than recalling the Defiant and never allowing it to fly again.
But even if they recall the Defiant, that won't necessarily prevent whatever ship they send in its place to that part of Tholian space from having the same fate befall it.
Or they might want to do exactly that, in order to help out the MU the way Kirk helps out all those cultures that happen to deviate from his ideals.
If our heroes are to learn anything useful about the Defiant, among the things learned will be the exact specs of how she got into the MU. Starfleet can easily avoid having a starship at those exact coordinates at the exact time, then. Or then Starfleet can easily deploy the mother of all bombs there, for the Tholians to capture and trigger.
Timo Saloniemi
If our heroes are to learn anything useful about the Defiant, among the things learned will be the exact specs of how she got into the MU. Starfleet can easily avoid having a starship at those exact coordinates at the exact time, then. Or then Starfleet can easily deploy the mother of all bombs there, for the Tholians to capture and trigger.
Timo Saloniemi
True. And even if Discovery is able to tell Starfleet about the specifics of how the Defiant got there, that knowledge may be kept classified and not necessarily be something that is available to all Starfleet personnel -- not even captains and some admirals.
If Starfleet has that knowledge, another reason they don't use it to prevent the Defiant from getting lost in the dimensional rift may be that they are uneasy about the paradoxes that might occur if they do prevent it. So somewhere in the highest ranks of Starfleet, maybe someone decides the Defiant and its crew unfortunately will need to be sacrificed.
oh, I just realize that ISS discovery probably has spore drive, since we saw MU Starnets
Why not!
The MU in Star Trek has always been depicted as having a remarkably parallel history in some respects even though it has a remarkably divergent history in other respect.
Yeah, if you take a moment to think about it, it really makes no logical sense that, given its divergent history, the MU should be so similar to the prime universe in so many ways, but we Star Trek fans in general have always been OK with accepting that illogical concept for what it is and having fun with it.
Alternatively, they know its coming and send her there to investigate anyway. The real issue is the crew deaths, which were gruesome, and which shouldn't have to happen even if you need to send the ship - send a skeleton ship instead.
Also, I continue to maintain that the Defiant is a red herring. That crew likely didn't know about the interphase, and got caught up in it, and certainly didn't know about Enterprise's phaser fire which "kicked the Defiant away" (or else prime Kirk would be in Defiant when it arrived in the Mirror Universe). All they would have is Defiant's sensor readings about receiving phaser fire during interphase, highly likely to be corrupted, and possibly destroyed by the Tholians.
The only way home is the spore drive. IMHO.
if the sensors were still working at that point. Much of what the ship recorded could well have ended about the same time as the crew died/killed each other. Depends how much was set to auto-scan/record at the end. If things were just sitting idle, may not have captured much data that tells them anything but the Interphase situation that started the mess. Who knows if that is repeatable, and exactly how the Ent's phasers affected it vs. what may have happened without interference.
Almost definitely not repeatable, doubt that ship is going anywhere.
Almost definitely not repeatable, doubt that ship is going anywhere.
Review break:
I get why they gave them more time to bond but the Tyler/Burnham sequence at the start was a real momentum breaker for me that effected my premier enjoyment of the episode. It totally screwed with my (huge misshapen) head. I could not even hear what they were saying over the roaring sound of my expectations.
By the time I manged to synchronize my mental gears with the slower pace it then took off leaving me behind wondering what the hell was going on. Frustrated, I needed to take a break and recenter.
Upon rewatching, even Burnham seemed to be affected. That she too was dealing with events going from warp speed to impulse, suddenly being forced to sit and wait.
Reflecting, it's actually kind of cool that the writers seemingly understood they were slamming on the brakes there, that some people might feel thrown into the windshield and reflected that in Burnham's dialogue.
Everything else meet or surpassed my expectations so what's not to love? Ten!
I get why they gave them more time to bond but the Tyler/Burnham sequence at the start was a real momentum breaker for me that effected my premier enjoyment of the episode. It totally screwed with my (huge misshapen) head. I could not even hear what they were saying over the roaring sound of my expectations.
By the time I manged to synchronize my mental gears with the slower pace it then took off leaving me behind wondering what the hell was going on. Frustrated, I needed to take a break and recenter.
Upon rewatching, even Burnham seemed to be affected. That she too was dealing with events going from warp speed to impulse, suddenly being forced to sit and wait.
Reflecting, it's actually kind of cool that the writers seemingly understood they were slamming on the brakes there, that some people might feel thrown into the windshield and reflected that in Burnham's dialogue.
Everything else meet or surpassed my expectations so what's not to love? Ten!
Also, it just occurred to me... if Lorca is indeed from the MU, it's entirely in the realm of possibility that he accessed the Defiant's records and learned a few things about Prime Discovery, Burnham, the Battle of the Binary Stars, Georgiou, etc.
"My advice in making sense of temporal paradoxes is simple -- don't even try."
-- Captain Kathryn Janeway, Voyager
Sonequa Martin-Green wasn't horrible in this episode, which is a plus. But can you imagine if a strong, charismatic actress (who could actually act) was the lead? Like an actress on par with Isaacs? This show would be amazing.
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