I don't know. They might not have known (or cared) about the entire history of the song, but they probably knew that it was a classic American standard that had been around for ages.
Provenance of Titles
- Thread starter Laura Cynthia Chambers
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I don't know. They might not have known (or cared) about the entire history of the song, but they probably knew that it was a classic American standard that had been around for ages.
Yes, I don't deny that that is also a possibility, I just personally don't think that it was the case.
Possibly, but then again, I didn't know all the particulars, but I knew that the song dated back to the 30s at least. Heck, the movie, "Paper Moon," was set during the Great Depression so I tend to associate the song with that era . . . .
Mind you, I could just ask John Ordover or Dave Mack where they got the title from. I'm guessing it was Dave's idea, since I know for a fact that John hates old show tunes with a passion.
Possibly, but then again, I didn't know all the particulars, but I knew that the song dated back to the 30s at least. Heck, the movie, "Paper Moon," was set during the Great Depression so I tend to associate the song with that era . . . .
Mind you, I could just ask John Ordover or Dave Mack where they got the title from. I'm guessing it was Dave's idea, since I know for a fact that John hates old show tunes with a passion.
Yes, that definitely rules him out!
Exactly. It also doesn't help me that both "Metamorphosis" and "The Changeling" are in the second season, so I'm often seeing the two titles very close together in episode guides.
Those I don't really have trouble with, probably because none of them were in the same season. I did just have to look up "Return to Tomorrow" to confirm the plot, though. That is a generic title!I confess I find "Return to Tomorrow" somewhat generic, and perhaps too easily confused with "Tomorrow is Yesterday," which is not to be confused with "All Our Yesterdays."
Exactly. It also doesn't help me that both "Metamorphosis" and "The Changeling" are in the second season, so I'm often seeing the two titles very close together in episode guides.
Those I don't really have trouble with, probably because none of them were in the same season. I did just have to look up "Return to Tomorrow" to confirm the plot, though. That is a generic title!
And it doesn't really have much to do with the plot. It sounds like it ought be a time travel episode, but it's not. And I tend to mix it up with "By Any Other Name" for some reason.
And a confession: as many times as I've watched the episode, I've never thought "Space Seed" was a terribly good title. As shame they couldn't come with something better . . .like, I don't know, "The Wrath of Khan."
Well, that's just crazy talk! What would we call STII, then? "The Undiscovered Country"?And a confession: as many times as I've watched the episode, I've never thought "Space Seed" was a terribly good title. As shame they couldn't come with something better . . .like, I don't know, "The Wrath of Khan."
...Aren't you the guy who originally titled your third Khan book A World To Win?
...Aren't you the guy who originally titled your third Khan book A World To Win?
Actually, I originally wanted to call it The Eugenics Wars, Volume Three, but was talked out of it. Really.
But, you know, "A World To Win" would have been a much better title than "Space Seed."
It comes from the end where they leave him behind and make reference to having sown the augments there like seed.
Something Biblical might have been better, along the lines of sowing and reaping.
By the way, reading the Chakoteya script, he seemed awfully content to stay there and build a world. And in the Kelvin-timeline mirror universe, a (mostly) peaceful Khan seems to have done so ("Live Evil"). If not for the disaster that killed his people, how would TWOK era- Khan have greeted Kirk?
Something Biblical might have been better, along the lines of sowing and reaping.
By the way, reading the Chakoteya script, he seemed awfully content to stay there and build a world. And in the Kelvin-timeline mirror universe, a (mostly) peaceful Khan seems to have done so ("Live Evil"). If not for the disaster that killed his people, how would TWOK era- Khan have greeted Kirk?
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I don't know, maybe he would have found something else to be pissed off about. These genetically engineered megalomaniacs are all the same.
Oh, I get the meaning of "Space Seed." I just think it's kind of a lame title. Khan is a rather grandiose character; he deserved a more grandiose title. Plus, "Space Seed" only really refers to the outcome of the story, not the basic premise of an infamous tyrant from the past returning to the menace the future.
Space seed sounds like some kind of telepathic pitcher plant. I agree with you Greg. They might also add a dash of Sikhism to the title.
Something like:
Something like:
- The Lion of Heaven
- Menace from Eternity
- Stain of the Inheritors
- What Khan Hath Wrought
- Nothing of Him That Doth Fade
Coupled with the idea that any eugenics program is now off limits, "Forbidden Fruit" or something like that might work.
Or have they drawn from the Adam and Eve well too often? ("The Apple", "The Way To Eden", "This Side of Paradise", etc)
Or have they drawn from the Adam and Eve well too often? ("The Apple", "The Way To Eden", "This Side of Paradise", etc)
I like these two. They sound like TOS-style titles to me.
How about a play on the Milton quote at the end of the episode? "To Rule in Heaven"
Maybe that's the point though? The title doesn't give away anything regarding Khan's true nature. For a first time viewer, they'd be wondering what the real story was rather than being well ahead of the Enterprise crew.
I remember something about it being a Biblical reference.
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