Spoilers Would Picard actually want to...

Discussion in 'Star Trek: Picard' started by PatB1974, Aug 4, 2020.

  1. Makarov

    Makarov Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Maybe Soong altered his android-body-acceptance parameter temporarily when he transferred him in and the real Picard is just waiting to activate and go nuts on the crew for reviving him
     
  2. Charles Phipps

    Charles Phipps Commodore Commodore

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    I liken it to getting a really garish tie at Christmas from your kids. Its a terrible gift but you're going to wear it anyway.

    Picard was fully prepared to die on this mission but he's not going to gainsay a few extra years of adventuring. He also doesn't have the same desire to die as a human being that Data does. Data needs a "good death" to complete his transformation from machine to man. Picard is a man so he knows its inevitable for him and that's enough.

    But I fully believe it's possible we might see Picard go through a minor existential crisis in the next season too. It'd be a shame if he didn't have at least one person believe he's a Picard-programmed android like Nurse Chapel's old beau.
     
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  3. WarpTenLizard

    WarpTenLizard Commander Red Shirt

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    Picard is a man of duty. He has known since the start that his true purpose in joining these new characters on their adventure is to keep the show financially afloat so that the real main characters can continue the saga of "Star Trek."

    Note, I have nothing against Picard or Patrick Stewart, but he just feels so obviously shoe-horned into this new show, as such an obvious cash-grab. They wanted to make a new crew, and continue expanding on the "Star Trek" universe, but because TV is a business and life is life, they could only do that with a major "Star Trek" icon as the mascot. And Picard's presence doens't harm the story by any means, but he just feels like a tour guide for the audience to follow around as we get to know the real main cast of this new show.
     
  4. Charles Phipps

    Charles Phipps Commodore Commodore

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    I think you put the cart before the horse. They knew that TNG fans would watch for Patrick Stewart. The new crew is just there to pad him out.
     
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  5. Llywela

    Llywela Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    And let's face it, we barely got to know the new characters at all, even after ten episodes - the show was so heavily skewed toward telling Picard's story that the ensemble got lost in the shuffle. If he was there only as a 'tour guide for the audience to follow around as we get to know the real main cast of this new show', we'd have come out of S1 knowing the new crew a hell of a lot better than we do!
     
  6. The Old Mixer

    The Old Mixer Mih ssim, mih ssim, nam, daed si Xim. Moderator

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    I'd say that they're striking a balance. They need young, pretty faces to sell the show to a broader audience, but this is first and foremost a Patrick Stewart vehicle.
     
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  7. MrPicard

    MrPicard Jean-Luc's Loving Husband Premium Member

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    Are you basically saying that Sir Patrick has an old and ugly face? :vulcan::lol:;)
     
  8. WarpTenLizard

    WarpTenLizard Commander Red Shirt

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    If that were the case, why bother with all the sub-plots with the various new characters, developing the Romulan species, or making a new story out of the "XBs"? It seems to me that they just wanted to do another "Star Trek" series with a mostly new crew, and continue the story of the "Star Trek" saga, like TNG, DS9 and VOY each did; but they would only be able to do so with something hugely iconic to ensure ratings. Hence Picard.

    Again, not a bad thing. I don't mind Picard. But he's Big Bird to me. I came to Sesame Street to see Cookie Monster, Snuffaluffagus and the Count; Big Bird was just the tour guide there to introduce me to the muppets I was *really* there to see. Same with Picard.
     
  9. Charles Phipps

    Charles Phipps Commodore Commodore

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    Because there needs to be a show around Picard? Also, the XBs are a Picard storyline (with a bit of Seven).

    I also don't believe the "new" crew would last past Patrick Stewart's involvement.
     
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  10. Dukhat

    Dukhat Vice Admiral Admiral

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    I’m curious as to why this ‘crew’ even needs to stay together, as Picard really doesn’t need them
    anymore. He can just go back to his vineyard with Elnor. Assuming Jurati isn’t sent to prison for Maddox’s murder, she should be able to go back to her lab at the Daystrom Institute with Soji. Rios can go back to his freight business, Seven can go back to the Fenris Rangers, and Musiker can go back to her prefab house and UFP-AA.
     
  11. fireproof78

    fireproof78 Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Same reason why Riker was never promoted in TNG.
     
  12. Charles Phipps

    Charles Phipps Commodore Commodore

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    Well Picard literally stated that the only reason he was on his vineyard was because he was waiting to die. He has no desire to return to that life and it was never the life he wanted in the first place. While a bit of a downgrade, leading a crew of bucaneers is still closer to the life he wants for, say, the remaining 10 years or however long he's still got in his android body.

    Jurati can't return to normal life, Rios wants to serve someone like Picard, Seven adventuring with them IS what the Fenris Rangers do, and Raffi expressed her [presumably platonic] love for Picard in the last episode.
     
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  13. diankra

    diankra Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Potentially, if 'true' Borg turn up, they might 'sniff' him and spot the difference.
    Someone has wondered if he'd still smell the same to his dog.
     
  14. Dukhat

    Dukhat Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Ah, yes, a completely unrealistic scenario. Which is what I expect PIC season 2 to be.
     
  15. fireproof78

    fireproof78 Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    I think Picard might get closer to realistic depending. It's all in how it's set up.
     
  16. Pubert

    Pubert Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    yeah the new crew really was boring in my opinion. Just don’t care about them like I did the TNG crew.
     
  17. Sci

    Sci Admiral Admiral

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    If I were a writer on the show, I would assert that you can't tell Picard's story without telling the other characters' stories, too, because none of these people live in a vacuum. Picard's story is informed by his relationships with others, and telling Picard's story obliges the writers to tell the stories about the people closest to him.

    The producers have been very clear from the start that the fundamental premise was bringing back Picard, and everything else was built around how you execute that premise.

    I mean, that's cool, but it doesn't really speak to the broad popularity of the character or the central premise of the show. Picard's not actually my favorite Star Trek character -- that's probably Elim Garak -- but Picard is clearly many people's favorite character, and Star Trek: Picard is very much about Picard.

    I don't know if it "needs" to, but I think it will, because their experiences together in PIC S1 created a "found family" dynamic and bonded them together emotionally.

    I mean, sure, but he could have gone back to his vineyard any time during the entire seven-year run of TNG, too. An important part of the point of the first three episodes of PIC S1 was that Picard was on the vineyard because he had given up on life -- he was, in his own words, "waiting to die." I think it is unlikely Picard wants to go back La Barre.

    But would she want to? Why would Soji want to go to Daystrom?

    All three of those characters were isolated and miserable before Picard brought them together. Why would they want to go back?
     
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  18. Dukhat

    Dukhat Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Well, my original point was, why does Picard actually need these people anymore. The whole reason for his sojourn on a non-Starfleet ship is complete. He found Maddox, the synth planet, saved Soji, and regained face with Starfleet. Unless the writers come up with a convincing reason why he needs to continue on with La Sirena and crew, why shouldn’t he go back to LaBarre, if only to decide what he wants to do next with the rest of his synthetic life?

    Where else would she go? Her whole life was a lie; she’s a synthetic person with no home and no family. Where better to learn about herself than the place where the study of synthetic life is foremost? What would she do on La Sirena anyway? Learn to fly it?

    Because as I mentioned before, Picard doesn’t really need them anymore. Unless Picard plans on reinstating himself, Rios and Musiker and have them serve together on a Starfleet vessel (it seemed quite easy for Riker to reinstate himself, after all), there’s no reason for them all to stay together on La Sirena unless some contrived reason presents itself (which, I will admit, is probably the likely scenario for season 2.) And as for Jurati, what possible reason would she have to stay, other than as Rios’s new girlfriend? I suppose if Soji stayed, they could hang out together, but then again, Jurati killed the guy who created her, so how’d that go?
     
  19. fireproof78

    fireproof78 Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    I think the larger reason is they had all discovered, or rediscovered, something amazing in their time together. So, as part of that shared experience they decide to continue forward as a matter of personal choice and building relationship, so more of a human need for community than any other.
     
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  20. Llywela

    Llywela Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    I didn't find the new crew boring. On the contrary, I really enjoyed what we saw of them. That's why I want to be allowed to get to know them better.
    Picard doesn't need to need the new crew for them to stay together as a crew - heck, since it isn't his ship, it isn't actually his decision, even. He has no power to hire and fire here. They can stay together because each of them, as individuals, chooses that this is where they want to be, at least for now. Maybe Picard stays with La Sirena because he isn't ready to return to La Barre yet, and Rios lets him stay because a) Picard is paying for the use of the ship, and b) Rios likes having the famous Picard on board. Maybe Raffi stays because she's realised during S1 that being active and being around other people is better for her mental health than moping in isolation in the desert - and because she is getting close to Seven and La Sirena offers them a place they can be together and get to know one another without either one having to actively choose to go to the other's turf. Maybe Elnor stays because he has no place else to go and feels he's forged a bond with this group of individuals, especially Picard who has been a father-figure to him. Maybe Agnes is only planning to stay aboard until her case comes to trial. Maybe Soji is still trying to figure out where she belongs and wants to see something of the universe along the way. And maybe Rios is cool with them all sticking around because he's realised he likes having a crew around him. There are lots of possibilities. The precise reason for each of the group staying aboard, I am guessing, is going to form at least part of the story told in season 2 - the story of what comes next for each of these people.

    Then again, we weren't told at the end of S1 exactly where it was they were going, so maybe they haven't actually chosen to stay together - for all we know, they'd laid in a course for a suitable place for them all to disembark and go their separate ways and S2 might be telling the story of how that journey gets detoured along the way!
     
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