Discussion in 'General Trek Discussion' started by Amasov, Jun 20, 2020.
Why is insulting Abrams still a thing?
Because it's both easy and true.
Kurtzman, Roberto Orci, and Damon Lindelof (the writers) also get some of the blame for 09 and ID for being so bad. But films are more a director's vision than the writers/producers (which tv is more their vision and control), so Abrams will invariably get the full blame.
If it's just a random star exploding that would be fine, but a supernova destroying an entire galaxy is just blatantly unrealistic in my opinion.
So we can just insult a man no matter what?
Blame is one thing; insulting is another.
If "sounding very nonsensical" is the criteria by which we are going to determine "what is Star Trek" and "what is not Star Trek," you will have very, VERY little left of the franchise.
I mean, just looking at the movies:
TMP- Voyager 6 disappears into "black hole" and re-emerges somewhere else? The Enterprise is the only starship in the entire fleet capable of intercepting a threat that is ~3 days away from Earth?
TWOK- A magical space torpedo that terraforms planets, or in this case, somehow creates an entire planet out of nebula dust, even though that is not at all what it was designed to do (and it just happens to magically be in the goldilocks zone of a star). Somehow, the Reliant, a dedicated science ship, does not recognize that Ceti Alpha VI has recently "exploded" and, even worse, somehow mistakes planet V for planet VI?
TSFS- A corpse is not only brought back to life, but it is "reborn" and somehow survives/grows rapidly in a matter of hours without significant food or water, and ages rapidly like the planet around it (somehow linked???)...and then we are able to put the soul/personality back into that re-animated corpse because "Vulcan powers." I love Star Trek III, but c'mon man.
TVH- If you go really fast around the sun, you can travel back and forth through time at will, and a giant turd in space sending out amplified whalesong somehow drains power and creates environmental turmoil for entire planets?
TFF- The Enterprise, a starship now featuring 72 decks, travels from the Neutral Zone to the Galactic Core in about 7 hours at Warp 7.
TUC- Some nonsense about "subspace shockwaves" hitting the Excelsior, even though they are lightyears away from Klingon Territory. The Enterprise arrives 1,000 lightyears from Federation HQ in a matter of what looks like hours, without engaging warp drive.
GEN- A magical space ribbon that allows people infinite access to infinite timelines and possibilites exists. You can't fly a ship into it without getting wrecked (even though earlier in the film clearly shows that the El-Aurians were IN THE NEXUS before they were beamed off the Lakul, hence Soran's obsession), but apparently standing in front of it on a planet surface is perfectly safe and it just scoops you up harmlessly.
FC- The Borg suddenly have the ability to create a temporal vortex, that they use after sending only one ship to assimilate Earth. Later, the Enterprise just "recreates the vortex" and heads home like no big deal. Nope.
INS- There's a magical radiation that has healing and regenerative powers, but it can only be harnessed by collecting it in a way that makes the planet uninhabitable...and we're meticulously recreating the indigenous village on a holodeck so that we can relocate the population on a planet where they will clearly realize they've been relocated? Makes absolutely no sense.
NEM- The Enterprise picks up posotronic signals from lightyears away. There's a magical radiation that "destroys organic matter at the subatomic level," and a bad guy who can't figure out if he hates Romulans, hates Picard, hates Earth, hates the Federation, wants Picard for his blood, wants to kill Picard without getting his blood, etc etc etc.
And those are just the movies. If you looked carefully enough, you'd find absolutely ridiculous things throughout the franchise are pretty common. The idea is to enjoy or not enjoy the show and the characters...but if you over-scrutinize this stuff...you better be prepared to abandon the franchise all together, because it almost never holds up to close scrutiny.
I always thought the “destroy the galaxy” bit was simply hyperbole.
"Threatened the galaxy" was probably just Old Man Spock exaggeration to make his point. The destruction of Romulus did go on to have seismic effects in the known galaxy since one of the three largest powers in the Alpha Quadrant no longer existed and became a rump shell of its old self as survivors fled to new planets to attempt to keep Romulan culture intact.
Regarding the Genesis planet, didn't the Regula I moon end up becoming that planet?
I’m forever grateful to them for making my favourite, by far, of all the Trek movies and near the very top of all the Trek I’ve watched since 1973. So…”blame” now means “credit”?
Different strokes for different folks. 09 and INTO DARKNESS are at the very bottom of the movies for me. Even NEMESIS was better than those two.
I adore 2009 and BEY. STID is now my absolute least favorite Trek film with the possible exception of NEM. It all depends on the day and my mood.
BEYOND was great. It is light years ahead of the other Kelvin movies.
No, the film depicts the planet forming exactly where the Reliant exploded. The visual effects (a brief shot on the view screen) actually show the nebula elements coalescing into the newly formed planet. It's more noticeable on the recently released 4k version.
Regula I might have been destroyed in the Genesis Effect, though, and its constituent components became part of what finally coalesced into the Genesis Planet.
Possibly, but the film is pretty clear that this is not how the Genesis Device is designed or intended to be used. They even go so far as to be on a long-term search for a planet "that will satisfy the requirements" for a test. That would seem to imply that a particular world with a particular mass, gravity, solar orbit, etc is crucial to the device functioning properly.
If they could just turn Regula I into a viable test planet (or simply light the thing off inside any old nebula), why have the Reliant out there searching for months for a test site?
Yeah, I never bought that Regula I became the Genesis Planet. Number one, the final battle in space took place deep within the nebula and Regula I was just outside of it. So the locations don't even match up for one to be in the right spot to transform into the other.
No. I don't think I made any aspersions as to his hygiene, his abilities as a friend, his punctuality, or his work ethic. It may be that he's never even tried to get out of jury duty.
I don't think he has a very good grasp on how anything works outside of Hollywood and I feel it hampers his abilities as a storyteller. (I think Nick Meyer has many of the same faults, but he seems to read more books.)
Because of this I might not draw as straight a line between the faults of the other films and "red matter" as I should.
But when you have your 20 something fall out of bed one morning and end up with a starship it starts to color your perception of the rest of the details.
EDIT: By the way, I think he's very good at characters and he's a genius at casting. FOR SHAME!
No, just that he can't word well.
I can see that but I also think it lends credence towards the theme of falling in to success. I think Kirk's arc is more interesting for it.
Light years ahead of all other Star Trek movies. I love it.
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