USS Enterprise (eventually) on Discovery?

[jaime]

Not any more than DIS Klingon cloak screws up the Balance of Terror. And the point is really not about any specific character anyway.

I know. That’s why I said Sulu is about the only character whose gender doesn’t affect any of his activities in any plots. Not without additional rewriting anyway. You could go with Uhura, but Charlie X and the famous kiss episode suddenly get a lot more complicated. As indeed does the planet of intergalactic peace.

 

[Tosk]

You just need to accept that things need to change for 21st century audiences. The show isn't only for you.

They don't need to accept it. Trekkies have been ignoring what they don't like and embracing what they do for decades. No reason to change that now.

 

[jaime]

They don't need to accept it. Trekkies have been ignoring what they don't like and embracing what they do for decades. No reason to change that now.

In some cases they also don’t need to change things for the 21st C. They may choose to, but these days that seems a grey area.

 

[Push The Button]

Nope. It isn't an alternate reality.

You just need to accept that things need to change for 21st century audiences. The show isn't only for you.

Wow, are we still fighting about this? Three days later?

 

[Tuskin38]

Wow, are we still fighting about this? Three days later?

It will be argued 10 years from now.

 

[Push The Button]

It will be argued 10 years from now.

Repeat to yourself: It's just a show, I should really just relax.

 

[Tuskin38]

Repeat to yourself: It's just a show, I should really just relax.

I am relaxed, this isn't stressful.

 

[Dijeirusan]

Whether canon or not, TOS showed the Constitution class as the front-line, best-of-the-best. "Only twelve like it in the fleet", "He commands not a space ship, but a starship a very special vessel and crew."

That's a character's opinion within the show. Like I think Ford is the best family car brand, and you might think Honda is.

And nothing in DIS has discredited the Enterprise being the best.

 

[XCV330]

I know you're going for humorous effect here, but it's a strange choice of analogy to do it with. The Bond films have never even pretended to have anything resembling consistent continuity. That ship sailed way back in the '60s.

Except when they do, such as On Her Majesty's Secret Service, Diamonds Are Forever, For Your Eyes Only, License To Kill, Skyfall, etc.

And yes I primarily was trying to make a joke of it, but my minor point is the EON Bond films never developed some high priesthood of fandom to tell them what was and wasn't visual continuity. Viewers just accept and watch and wait a few years for the next one, knowing it will look different, too. They are both 50+ year old franchises with sci-fi elements that have had to continually update themselves to keep from looking ridiculous.

Bond fans don't REALLY expect their character in modern films to be chain-smoking two packs a day, delivering STD's to new islands and new civilizations, driving a Blower Bentley (though I wish he would) and deciding who is the homosexual assassin by whether or not they can whistle. If Star Trek Fundamentalists had to step in to the role, as fans, they would demand these things.

 

[mos6507]

they simply can not make things look 23rd Century advanced with how the TOS visual aesthetic was.

But they could have updated it in a way that wasn't so garish and butt-ugly.

 

[gwud]

I've found that with a lot of Discovery, if only they'd push the impulse engines together, not add the extra to the nacelle struts, not shortened the neck, made the blue glow dimmer in the engines it would have been so much more acceptable to everyone and not looked bad at all, still glowy and modern. The same with the Disco bridge, if they'd not added random see through screens, the bridge would have looked far more acceptable. I'm interested in seeing what they do the the Enterprise bridge. Just like the Cage bridge with dim lights and large glass panels in front of everyone.

 

[Tuskin38]

But they could have updated it in a way that wasn't so garish and butt-ugly.

It's not ugly at all.

 

[Firebird]

I think either option works, but I'd go for 2 due to the registries. They were both - presumably - extensively refitted to include the spore drive elements such as the spinning saucer plates.

I think the original Crossfields look like the earlier art we saw - stubby nacelles, no saucer gaps etc. That ship looked a lot older than the Constitution for me. It's a saucer with a big flat engineering deck and some nacelles, pretty basic.

I like the idea that the version of the Discovery we saw in the first promo was the original configuration of the Crossfield class, before the installation of the Spore Drive.

 

[INACTIVERedDwarf]

Here is what Ex Astris Scientia had to say:

The appearance of Captain Pike's USS Enterprise was quite obviously meant as a beacon, to assure us that everything will be better and more traditional in the second season. But aside from my criticism of the overdone reimagination of the ship, I can't see anything but cheap fan service in it. In my view, it is a crossover of the kind that already ruined ENT: "These Are The Voyages" (the notorious "Valentine to the fans"). My apprehension may be premature. But I just don't want to see the original Enterprise, reimagined or not, in a series that otherwise acts like TOS had never existed. In this regard, it may be even unusually honest of Discovery that the Enterprise was redesigned from TOS- to DIS-style. But this only deepens the rift that Discovery has opened between itself and the rest of the franchise, and also between the fans. I dread the insistence of DIS fans that the "real" Enterprise in TOS should look like the DIS ship and the demands to retcon it accordingly, and I don't think my reaction will be friendly.

It was to be expected that, unlike Star Trek Enterprise, Discovery would not respect the look of the original USS Enterprise NCC-1701. Their Enterprise is described as an"olive branch to fans concerned about old-school canon". Well, I am such a fan, and to me it is a further slap in the face. Like everything else that the producers deemed dated, the ship was redesigned to fit with the reimagination dictate of the series. The basic proportions of the Constitution class are roughly the same as they were in "The Cage" or in TOS. The shapes of the saucer, the engineering hull and the nacelles were modified to be more streamlined. The bridge, the shuttlebay region, the impulse engines, the nacelle pylons and the aft ends of the nacelles are totally different now. Shiny and heavily structured plating was added all over the hull. I'm not saying the ship looks bad now, but the radically different appearance is a further sign that the makers of the series don't care for the assets of Star Trek (let alone for old-school fans). And it is the final nail in the coffin, regarding a possible reconciliation of the reboot ships of Discovery with the existing Starfleet design lineage from TOS to ENT (which, unlike the Klingon redesign, was not a totally hopeless case so far). If not even the Constitution class looks the way it would have to, why should any other ship in the series? Why should I even bother to make up explanations for angular nacelles if there are much more obvious obstacles for the Discovery ships to fit in? I will take care of the Discovery ships in the future. But TOS, TNG, DS9, VOY and ENT designs will have precedence in cases of contradiction because they came first and they respected each other. The "new" Constitution class is exemplary in this regard. As far as I am concerned, it has no right to exist outside the Discoveryverse.
​

 

[mos6507]

It's not ugly at all.

I'm referring to DSC production design in general. The Enterprise reimagining is the only bright spot there, and only probably because they knew there would be mass rioting if they pushed the envelope too far because I can assure you that left to their own devices they would have made it look as bad or worse than the JJ Prise.

 

[Tuskin38]

I'm referring to DSC production design in general. The Enterprise reimagining is the only bright spot there

My bad.

 

[Prax]

What if Kirk had a nice thick naval beard.

 

[XCV330]

Here is what Ex Astris Scientia had to say:

The appearance of Captain Pike's USS Enterprise was quite obviously meant as a beacon, to assure us that everything will be better and more traditional in the second season. But aside from my criticism of the overdone reimagination of the ship, I can't see anything but cheap fan service in it. In my view, it is a crossover of the kind that already ruined ENT: "These Are The Voyages" (the notorious "Valentine to the fans"). My apprehension may be premature. But I just don't want to see the original Enterprise, reimagined or not, in a series that otherwise acts like TOS had never existed. In this regard, it may be even unusually honest of Discovery that the Enterprise was redesigned from TOS- to DIS-style. But this only deepens the rift that Discovery has opened between itself and the rest of the franchise, and also between the fans. I dread the insistence of DIS fans that the "real" Enterprise in TOS should look like the DIS ship and the demands to retcon it accordingly, and I don't think my reaction will be friendly.

It was to be expected that, unlike Star Trek Enterprise, Discovery would not respect the look of the original USS Enterprise NCC-1701. Their Enterprise is described as an"olive branch to fans concerned about old-school canon". Well, I am such a fan, and to me it is a further slap in the face. Like everything else that the producers deemed dated, the ship was redesigned to fit with the reimagination dictate of the series. The basic proportions of the Constitution class are roughly the same as they were in "The Cage" or in TOS. The shapes of the saucer, the engineering hull and the nacelles were modified to be more streamlined. The bridge, the shuttlebay region, the impulse engines, the nacelle pylons and the aft ends of the nacelles are totally different now. Shiny and heavily structured plating was added all over the hull. I'm not saying the ship looks bad now, but the radically different appearance is a further sign that the makers of the series don't care for the assets of Star Trek (let alone for old-school fans). And it is the final nail in the coffin, regarding a possible reconciliation of the reboot ships of Discovery with the existing Starfleet design lineage from TOS to ENT (which, unlike the Klingon redesign, was not a totally hopeless case so far). If not even the Constitution class looks the way it would have to, why should any other ship in the series? Why should I even bother to make up explanations for angular nacelles if there are much more obvious obstacles for the Discovery ships to fit in? I will take care of the Discovery ships in the future. But TOS, TNG, DS9, VOY and ENT designs will have precedence in cases of contradiction because they came first and they respected each other. The "new" Constitution class is exemplary in this regard. As far as I am concerned, it has no right to exist outside the Discoveryverse.
​

EAS negative about Discovery? Shocked.. shocked I tell you. Maybe they'll be relevant again some decade.

 

[Ovation]

Here is what Ex Astris Scientia had to say:

The appearance of Captain Pike's USS Enterprise was quite obviously meant as a beacon, to assure us that everything will be better and more traditional in the second season. But aside from my criticism of the overdone reimagination of the ship, I can't see anything but cheap fan service in it. In my view, it is a crossover of the kind that already ruined ENT: "These Are The Voyages" (the notorious "Valentine to the fans"). My apprehension may be premature. But I just don't want to see the original Enterprise, reimagined or not, in a series that otherwise acts like TOS had never existed. In this regard, it may be even unusually honest of Discovery that the Enterprise was redesigned from TOS- to DIS-style. But this only deepens the rift that Discovery has opened between itself and the rest of the franchise, and also between the fans. I dread the insistence of DIS fans that the "real" Enterprise in TOS should look like the DIS ship and the demands to retcon it accordingly, and I don't think my reaction will be friendly.

It was to be expected that, unlike Star Trek Enterprise, Discovery would not respect the look of the original USS Enterprise NCC-1701. Their Enterprise is described as an"olive branch to fans concerned about old-school canon". Well, I am such a fan, and to me it is a further slap in the face. Like everything else that the producers deemed dated, the ship was redesigned to fit with the reimagination dictate of the series. The basic proportions of the Constitution class are roughly the same as they were in "The Cage" or in TOS. The shapes of the saucer, the engineering hull and the nacelles were modified to be more streamlined. The bridge, the shuttlebay region, the impulse engines, the nacelle pylons and the aft ends of the nacelles are totally different now. Shiny and heavily structured plating was added all over the hull. I'm not saying the ship looks bad now, but the radically different appearance is a further sign that the makers of the series don't care for the assets of Star Trek (let alone for old-school fans). And it is the final nail in the coffin, regarding a possible reconciliation of the reboot ships of Discovery with the existing Starfleet design lineage from TOS to ENT (which, unlike the Klingon redesign, was not a totally hopeless case so far). If not even the Constitution class looks the way it would have to, why should any other ship in the series? Why should I even bother to make up explanations for angular nacelles if there are much more obvious obstacles for the Discovery ships to fit in? I will take care of the Discovery ships in the future. But TOS, TNG, DS9, VOY and ENT designs will have precedence in cases of contradiction because they came first and they respected each other. The "new" Constitution class is exemplary in this regard. As far as I am concerned, it has no right to exist outside the Discoveryverse.
​

Well, my days of not taking that website seriously are certainly coming to a middle.

 

[fireproof78]

I'm referring to DSC production design in general. The Enterprise reimagining is the only bright spot there, and only probably because they knew there would be mass rioting if they pushed the envelope too far because I can assure you that left to their own devices they would have made it look as bad or worse than the JJ Prise.

Yes, of course, because all the production team wants to do is make things ugly