Spoilers The Ghost Monument grade and discussion thread

[Timelord79 (he/him)]

The bit with them stranded in space just in the nick of time to be picked up by random passing by starships felt very Hitchhiker‘s Guide to me...

The EMP trick came straight from Banakavalata in Voyage of the Damned.
He would have been so proud.
The Doctor oversold her smarts here, though.

 

[David cgc]

On the subject of guns and killing people, the Classic Doctors were always contradictory on that. 5 uses a blaster in Resurrection of the Dalakes not too different than the one that Ryan used last night. Also, I seem to recall in The Brain of Morbius (where the show hints are earlier Doctor incarnations) that the Doctor basically used poisoned gas to kill someone.

Reminds me of these montages (uh, NSFW language warning on the music), which I'm pretty sure were first edited when a segment of fandom was having a fit about Moffat not understanding Doctor Who because the Doctor deflected blaster bolts and was ambivalently complimentary about River's gunplay in "Day of the Moon."

 

[Gingerbread Demon]

OK I loved this episode. Jodie is surely going to be one of my favourite Doctors.

My favourites are

Christopher Eccleston
David Tennant
Peter Capaldi
Jodie Whittaker

Did not warm to Matt Smith much.

Killer bandages. OK I can maybe accept that they were infused with nanites that gave them locomotion and the ability to speak. But really that's the most different thing I have ever seen in new Who. Certainly will keep people talking.

"The Timeless Child"

Every series we seem to find some new as yet unknown aspect of The Doctor and I like that for the most part. I wonder if this will be one of the running themes this series. Also another mention of the Stenza so wonder if we will hear from them again or see the race guy again.

That for some reason made me think of "The Amazing Race" on a galactic scale and I wonder if that's exactly what they were trying to go for with this episode.

Poor TARDIS. She was sick of the Doctor blowing her console up so that's why she ejected the Doctor so she could rebuild in peace. Only she did it millions of miles away from Earth but I understand how she might have felt.

I LOVE, LOVE, LOVE the new look of the old girl. We enter the TARDIS and are inside the actual police box, but now the console room is actually like a bubble attached to the "back" of the police box. it's a fantastic effect that they pulled off here. I just bloody love it.

Overall 7.5 for me loved this episode.

 

[Christopher]

I LOVE, LOVE, LOVE the new look of the old girl. We enter the TARDIS and are inside the actual police box, but now the console room is actually like a bubble attached to the "back" of the police box. it's a fantastic effect that they pulled off here. I just bloody love it.

Like I remarked before, the previous console room had the same structure, with a vestibule for the exit that was the same size and shape as the police box interior; it just wasn't styled to look like a police box interior, so it wasn't as obvious.

 

[BritishSeaPower]

I had a hard time rating this one. On the one hand, the plot was better and better paced for this one. On the other hand, I felt the execution of the plot felt a little... one track... for a race and could have used a little twist or mystery. Good focus on character, but Yaz felt short changed in the mix. And I felt like we needed one more good scene with the racers. That said, I did enjoy it quite a bit. Felt like a classic episode condensed into a single outing. Keys of Marinus in 45 minutes. The TARDIS crew is very good. Good chemistry, good character and all have good and somewhat unique interplay with the Doctor.

Jodie is fantastic. A sort of Fifth Doctor by way of Nine and Eight. I feel like there's less settling in of her character. I did note some Tennant-ish, but as others have said: They are the same character and Capaldi was sneaking some Baker-cadaence into his first few episodes. Graham is a compelling character. Very much in the Chesterson mould. Ryan feels the most nuanced. Yaz could use a focus episode. Thought the guest stars were great, Angstrom in particular.

LOVED the new theme and title sequence. Love the new TARDIS exterior. Like the new interior well enough, though it feels a little closed off with the crystal columns. I do not like the console room extending from the back wall of the police box. It breaks the illusion of being bigger on the inside, as the console room isn't inside the 4 walls, now it's tacked onto the back. The whole reunion sequence and the companions entering the TARDIS was great.

I had a feeling the Stenza were going to be a soft recurring threat from the dialogue about how they kept their captives suspended in time. Not particularly interested in the timeless child stuff. Kinda thought we'd be moving away from the Moffat-era mythologizing.

I'd (unhelpfully) rate it as better than good but not quite very good.

If we are going to indulge in wild speculation at any point, I’ll put my elaborate theory of to what the Timeless Child refers to the forum.

I’ve long suspected that the First Doctor wasn’t on his first regeneration cycle. We’ve on screen evidence for this but was never followed up. Anyway, Twelve claimed to not remember if he was a little girl or little boy on Gallifrey, Thirteen mentioned last week that it was a long time since she’d bought women’s clothes, though the doctor usually steals them. I think we’re going further in to the Doctors past this time, before One.

Quite how anyone outside gallifrey would know something about the doctor that the doctor doesn’t remains to be seen.

While I know it was referencing the "uncounted" Warrior and 10.5, the Many Faces of the Doctor Who comic from Titan, which is about the 12 to 13 regeneration, has a throwaway line to "They will call you the thirteenth, even though that's not right."

When you mentioned this, I had the passing thought that maybe we'd get something like the Doctor's childhood as a little girl as indicated by Missy.

 

[BritishSeaPower]

Two additional thoughts as I was taking out the garbage:

1. This episode looked amazing, great cinematography, amazing colors. However I found the shaky-cam in the opening sequence to be too noticeable. As well, watching it from iTunes on my AppleTV, I noticed some "jumping" every so often, like a bad PAL/NTSC conversion.

2. I'm somewhat worried about next week's Rose Parks episodes and I can't place a finger on exactly why.

 

[Farscape One]

She's 2000 years old. They're all children to her.

But he is the oldest human, so by your example, the eldest son. I have noticed a lot of older siblings get more passes on things that would bother parents than if a younger one did the same thing. (Things I have from various families and in my wife's. Your experiences may be diffetent.)

 

[Asbo Zaprudder]

I'm somewhat worried about next week's Rose Parks episodes and I can't place a finger on exactly why.

As am I - my fears are that placing the incident in a sci-fi setting could be seen as trivialising its importance or come across as needlessly didactic (depending on how it's handled in dialogue).

Anyway - the biscuit - wasn't it a custard cream?

 

[SolarisOne]

Overall better than the first episode. I bumped my rating up from "good" to "very good" this time. Whittaker is undoubtedly the Doctor, and has already surpassed Tennant on my list of nuWho Doctors (granted, he's at the bottom of the list, but then so were all of the others on their first few episodes. She might surpass Eleven eventually--emphasis on "might".) Some of her delivery is like Tennant's, but that was never my problem with him--her characterization is radically different.

I do have a rather difficult time understanding what she's saying, though.

However, that gorram music.... I don't like the new composer at all. Murray Gold, why have you forsaken us?! The score is mostly how I connect emotionally with what's going on. This music is waaaaaaaaaaaaay too understated for my tastes.

The opening seemed very much a modern throwback to the First Doctor's. Kudos.

The TARDIS dematerialization effect is superb. It actually looks like there's a bit of gravitational lensing as the dematerialization begins, which is exactly how I would portray it. The interior was meh, for the most part. I'm with Christopher on this one--Capaldi's interior was the best one. The random-props-on-a-console thing lost its charm halfway through Eccleston's run.

 

[The Nth Doctor]

Anyway - the biscuit - wasn't it a custard cream?

Which would be a nice touch since Jodie said in her AMA for reddit that custard cream is her favourite biscuit.

 

[Gingerbread Demon]

Yeah add me to the list of worried people. Next week will either be good or a stinker, or just plain off. Putting such a historical character into a scifi setting could go sideways.

 

[Lakenheath 72]

The moment I remember the most is when the Doctor is reunited with the TARDIS. The love, the emotional intimacy between the two. One of my favorite episodes of the nuWho is "The Doctor's Wife".

It is hard for me to judge the episodes. I am watching a 50 minute program with 20 minutes of commercials. These disruptive breaks hurt the show's flow.

 

[Asbo Zaprudder]

It is hard for me to judge the episodes. I am watching a 50 minute program with 20 minutes of commercials. These disruptive breaks hurt the show's flow.

In the UK, the show is shown on BBC One without commercials and it's not obvious to me where such breaks would go, which makes me wonder if it's even a consideration for the production team at all and BBC America just shoehorn them in regardless of the story.

 

[Gingerbread Demon]

In the UK, the show is shown on BBC One without commercials and it's not obvious to me where such breaks would go, which makes me wonder if it's even a consideration for the production team at all and BBC America just shoehorn them in regardless of the story.

Watching some older shows off dvds some of them have a fade where a commercial break is supposed to start and a fade in when it ends, you see the breaks on some of these shows as a very short fade to black, with the fade out and fade in. So they did cater for those in the old days but yeah now it's harder to tell where the ads are supposed to go.

 

[Asbo Zaprudder]

Watching some older shows off dvds some of them have a fade where a commercial break is supposed to start and a fade in when it ends, you see the breaks on some of these shows as a very short fade to black, with the fade out and fade in. So they did cater for those in the old days but yeah now it's harder to tell where the ads are supposed to go.

If you mean classic DW, I doubt they catered for commercial breaks at all. If you mean other shows, such as TNG, that aired first on channels with commercials, yes, the breaks are a lot more obvious. I expect the script has to be written with pacing that takes breaks into consideration. However, I have no knowledge of how production deals with such things. When I watched shows in the US, the placing of commercial breaks often seemed quite random and disruptive.

 

[Evil Robert]

Yeah, I'm a little disappointed about the appearance of an arc phrase after they said it would be all standalones. Who knows, maybe it was just a minor continuation but I doubt it, especially considering The Doctor's promise to shut down the hunt..

Could still be stand alones until the final episode, which be default would also be a standalone due to only a few key phrases tying things in.

I know. I know. Semantics and word play, but you'd think after 7 years with Moffat, we'd be use to it! Lol

Anyway, love your analysis as always EMH, i agree with it whole heartily.

I'm honestly not that keen with the idea return of Tim Shaw's race after another name drop tonight.

Along with everybody rose, i kinda hope against hope the Timeless Child is Susan (or Romana - timeless cause she's in eSpace??).

However the biggest thing I took away from the latest Doctor Who episode: Everybody clearly went to the Prometheus School of running away from things in a straight line!!! Lol

 

[Gov Kodos]

As am I - my fears are that placing the incident in a sci-fi setting could be seen as trivialising its importance or come across as needlessly didactic (depending on how it's handled in dialogue).

Anyway - the biscuit - wasn't it a custard cream?

Hopefully, the story works because I would loath any sense she needed some white people to help her, buck her up, or give her a hand to her purpose in life and history because Ryan and Yaz just aren't likely to save anything like that for me.

 

[Starkers]

As am I - my fears are that placing the incident in a sci-fi setting could be seen as trivialising its importance or come across as needlessly didactic (depending on how it's handled in dialogue).

Anyway - the biscuit - wasn't it a custard cream?

Given the writer I'm hoping the subject matter will be treated very sensitively.

Hopefully, the story works because I would loath any sense she needed some white people to help her, buck her up, or give her a hand to her purpose in life and history because Ryan and Yaz just aren't likely to save anything like that for me.

Irrespective of the potential for white saviour trope, one of the things I do hate is when something major happened in the past and it only happened because the Doctor was there, it seems to devalue humanity somewhat.

 

[Photoman15]

Obviously the Timeless Child will be the one The Doctor has/had/will have as 13.

 

[Pindar]

Love the Doctor, Love the new credits and theme, love the custard creme dispenser.

The story was dragging it down a bit, I voted very good.

Not 100% sure on the new cosole room but I am sure it will grow on me. It's better than Capaldi's which I never liked.