Spoilers The Admonition doesn't really make sense if you think about it.

Discussion in 'Star Trek: Picard' started by MrPointy, Mar 23, 2020.

  1. MrPointy

    MrPointy Captain Captain

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    (1) If you're the Robo-Federation and you're already monitoring the development of artificial life in the Milky Way Galaxy, and a race of Milky Way synths are suddenly about to be wiped out by organic life, why not just step in already? Why make the synths go through the trouble of finding a 8-star system, and then getting them to make the beacon to contact you? Just step in already.

    (2) What about android races in the Gamma Quadrant or Delta Quadrant. Why do they have to travel to the Beta Quadrant to get to an Admonition? GQ robots can at least get to the Wormhole, but what about those DQ robots? The Alpha Quadrant isn't too far, but what if I'm in the back corner of the AQ, behind the Breen Confederacy? How are the Breen going to let me through to the glowing thing?

    (3) Conversely, if I'm a DQ or GQ species minding my own business, why am I being wiped out of existence by the Robo-Federation because of the actions of some pointy-eared dickheads in the Beta Quadrant?

    (4) Let's presume, for example, that the Robo-Federation decided place an Admontion every 1,000 light years or so - to effectively cover a decent amount of space with these glowing panic buttons? At that point there would be so many octonary star systems and crazy anti-synthetic life cults, that most or all organic life would eventually figure out what was going on with them. They'd stop development of AI and synthetic life, so they wouldn't call the wrath of the Robo-Feds. Kind of defeats the purpose of allowing synthetic life to develop in the galaxy.
     
  2. Bad Thoughts

    Bad Thoughts Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    First, it's not clear what the intention of the creators of the Admonition were/are. We've already seen conflicting interpretations. I suspect we will see a third, particularly if we meet the creators.

    Second, the eight-star thing is just symbolism. Perhaps it is indulgent, especially within the Star Trek universe, which resists mysticism.

    Third, we could always argue that there may be many Admonitions through the galaxy. We could argue that the creators felt that a certain level of space travel would correspond to a certain level of development of artificial life.
     
    Last edited: Mar 23, 2020
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  3. Cyrus

    Cyrus Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Yes, there could be some twist on this, we have to wait for season finale before passing judgement. As to other quadrants or other galaxies they could have built more of these 8-star systems. There is no indication this is the only admonition location.
     
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  4. Spock Must Diet!

    Spock Must Diet! Lieutenant Red Shirt

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    They could also use other unique and unlikely astrophysical phenomena besides the octenary sun's. The point is to draw the attention of the scientifically minded. But I agree that as a practical matter, multiple Admonitions would be needed - if its purpose is actually what is stated.
     
  5. Agony_Boothb

    Agony_Boothb Commodore Commodore

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    If we use those robots Voyager came across in the Delta Quadrant as an example, it could be argued that synthetic life is pretty good at wiping out their creators. There could be thousands of civilisations who were destroyed by synthetics across the galaxy. In that case, the aliens responsible for the Admonition might not feel the need to intervene and perhaps there is another stage that synthetic life needs to achieve before they can become part of the Robo-federation. Or perhaps finding an admonition device and using it is crucial to the Robo-Federation coming to assist.

    Also consider that that the Admonition might not be about protecting synthetic life at all. Remember that it showed the Romulans imagery that intimated that they should put a stop to any and all artifical life. Whether the Romulans interpreted that imagery mistakenly remains to the be seen.
     
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  6. Mach5

    Mach5 Admiral Admiral

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    The hyped up this "admonition" as something so intense that it drives people mad, but didn't bother to make it look intense and disturbing for the audience. Instead of some nightmare fuel fuel imagery we're treated to some stock footage that mostly doesn't even make sense (Data?).

    It was Spock's vision from season 2 of Discovery all over again. A major plot point, something that fucked with his mind, that amounted to very little in the end.
     
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  7. Guy Gardener

    Guy Gardener Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Earlier episodes guessed that the physical admonition was built by the survivors of a synthetic attack.

    Episode 9 says that the message underpinning admonition is a playbook from elder synth gods who will come back and destroy all fleshies, if there happens to be some newborn synths nearby worth fostering, crouching nearby... Which the robophobes are proliferating.

    Stupid.

    At the least, the Zhat Vash have to have thought about switching out the super dangerous frequency that beckons the elder synths, for a harmless blank?
     
    Last edited: Mar 23, 2020
  8. Ar-Pharazon

    Ar-Pharazon Vice Admiral Premium Member

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    And does this robo-Federation celebrate any sort of religion?

    Futurama Robanukah 1a.jpg
     
  9. Guy Gardener

    Guy Gardener Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    The Robo Federation said that it was beyond time.

    So The Robo federation is already a collective of everyone that is ever going to be saved and initiated, but back in linear time, in the "present" not everyone in the robofederation has been called up yet.

    Similar to the Prophets of Bajor, where Sisko shagged his own dad, and then gave birth to himself.
     
  10. Gov Kodos

    Gov Kodos Admiral Admiral

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    What the Admonition really said:

    We apologize for the inconvenience.
     
  11. Jackson_Roykirk

    Jackson_Roykirk Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I think we only see bits and pieces of the admonition, even when Sutra was melding with Jurati. There is no way to portray the full admonition -- the version that drives people mad -- so it's fine if they don't even bother. They can just show us the bits and pieces to get the point across to the TV viewers that people are receiving the admonition.

    For example, when we saw the visuals during Sutra's mind meld with Jurati, it was only a story-telling device to show the viewers that Sutra is seeing the admonition.

    And the exact admonition itself can never be known to us, except that it is an awful and terrible thing.
     
  12. Spock Must Diet!

    Spock Must Diet! Lieutenant Red Shirt

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    Or the Admonition is a black flag operation by an entity that wants advanced AI's who are in vulnerable situations to call them for...nefarious purposes.
     
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  13. Ar-Pharazon

    Ar-Pharazon Vice Admiral Premium Member

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    Or: "this is a collect call, will you accept the charges?"
     
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  14. Turtletrekker

    Turtletrekker Admiral Admiral

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    I don't think the admonition is supposed to make sense at this point because we don't actually know but the admonition is.
     
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  15. Mach5

    Mach5 Admiral Admiral

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    My standards are low, but not that low.
     
  16. CorporalClegg

    CorporalClegg Admiral Admiral

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    Nothing in the show makes sense if you really think about it. But, you know, Star Trek.
     
  17. Tuskin38

    Tuskin38 Admiral Admiral

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    I have feeling we haven't seen the true message, just how the minds of the Romulans and Sutra have interpreted it.
     
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  18. KennyB

    KennyB I have spoken............ Moderator

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    This is the approach I am taking for now.........with just an hour left there's going to be a left turn we are not expecting, it will be LONGER than we expect, or there will be some loose ends going into season 2.......or something I haven't even considered......I am willing to wait and see.
     
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  19. Timo

    Timo Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    It's pretty difficult to see how something that drives humanoids mad could make sense. I mean, it's pretty much defined as the exact opposite.

    What the Admonition "really means", or what it is intended to achieve, are mysteries that might be explained to us later this week, or made even more mysterious or whatnot. But what the visual content we saw means... Is rather apparently already revealed to us, this being "nothing we could or should ever even dream of understanding". It's not "Who killed Laura Palmer?" or "What lies down the hatch?" level laziness in storytelling - it's something specifically intended not to make sense, and is fine as it stands.

    I'm just hoping we get the answer to the real mystery next week, or then a hint that there's a great quest ahead, or whatever. Because if we don't get that, then it really is just plain laziness.

    Timo Saloniemi
     
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  20. Dukhat

    Dukhat Vice Admiral Admiral

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    You mean like Commodore Oh’s incredibly stupid plan to get the Federation to ban synths by having them destroy the shipyard that’s producing rescue ships to save Oh’s own people? That’s like me shooting my own family to prove how dangerous guns are.
     
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