My probably wrong theory is that Jack is possessed by a Pah-wraith and the rebel Changelings wanted him because with Sisko Prophet protecting the wormhole, they’re cut off from the Great Link, and who better to help than the Pah-wraiths?
Spoilers Star Trek: Picard 3x08 - "Surrender"
- Thread starter Commander Richard
- Start date
Nope. I'm referring to when they awkwardly played the Voyager theme with misplaced sentiment, before she beamed down to go on a vengeful killing spree. Killed two guards by shooting them in the back and attempted murder on a crowded room, then executed Vagisil...
Thankfully S3 gave us a more flattering version of the character.
My probably wrong theory is Evil Wesley: angry, bitter, rejected, flunked-out-of-starfleet lonely supplanted Wesley. Lore and Data were just a preview of what's to come. As for the red eyes, my whole family looks that way, at least in 70s photographs.
EAS gave this a nine Wow. Highest rated of the entire season and series. Before season 3 the highest rated episode was a 7.
https://www.ex-astris-scientia.org/episodes/pic3.htm#surrender
https://www.ex-astris-scientia.org/episodes/pic3.htm#surrender
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People grow apart. As far as we know, it’s been around 30 years since Geordi saw either Hugh or Ro. There’s people I was close to a decade ago I don’t speak regularly with. I can’t imagine where we’ll be twenty years from today.
The season has been fairly good (with episodes 1 and 6-8 being the weak spots) but I’m not sure if it hits ALL the right beats.
And I’m a Trek fan since 1983.
YA know, it could just be that Geordi just isn't into drinking wine.
I don't care for it at all.
First glass is battery acid I find.
Second glass you get warm and fuzzy.
Third glass I become more interesting and sexy.
Fourth glass, it's some how suddenly tomorrow and I'm vomiting into a shoe box.
...
No money, whatever, communism means impossibly long lines to get scarce items.
PIcard gives wine to everyone for birthdays, weddings and Christmas.
Lazy #itch.
Geordi has 16 cases of undrunk Cheateau Picard in his basement.
I enjoyed the episode. I'll certainly replay the Data scenes, and I think the way he triumphed was cleverly done. It's good to see such focus placed on Geordi and Data's relationship, which the movies rather neglected.
But my issues with this season continue to mount.
For one, this is the single most visually and thematically bleak season in the history of the franchise. It's ridiculously and casually violent, with an extremely limited color palette, and that for me is a very unpleasant combination. And I've never had an issue like this before with any Trek season, show, or film. At this point, gone is any of the brightness and whimsy of the first season.
And I find myself struggling to find much that feels like a fresh take. This season feels thoroughly unoriginal to me. The highlight might well be this episode's handling of Data, but there's little else that feels like an innovation.
I also can't help feeling like there's not a lot of thought being put into how this world works. That's a loss. Say what you will about Season 1, but I believed Chabon's xBs, the security and politics of research on the Cube, and even the internal logic of the imagined kingdom Kestra created. Here, the rules of everything from ship and station security to the nature of changeling biology feels slapdash at best.
I'm also irked by the way Matalas doesn't seem able to play within the rules set up my his predecessors twenty odd episodes ago. His choices don't feel like logical progressions but rejections. He's undone the wonder of Nepenthe, left Raffi and Seven's relationship unplumbed, rewritten Data's fate. I don't care if one likes or dislikes Season 1; I don't think I've ever seen a show so unflatteringly disdain its own established story.
I'm sad to find this season so flimsy when TNG has meant so much to me. Most of the episodes seem relatively solid, yet somehow it all seems far less than the sum of its parts.
I don't really want to argue with folks or rain on anyone's parade, as I see there's a lot of joy about this season that I'm not feeling. So, I think I'll leave it at that.
At any rate, I'm glad the show gets Geordi and Data's friendship right.
But my issues with this season continue to mount.
For one, this is the single most visually and thematically bleak season in the history of the franchise. It's ridiculously and casually violent, with an extremely limited color palette, and that for me is a very unpleasant combination. And I've never had an issue like this before with any Trek season, show, or film. At this point, gone is any of the brightness and whimsy of the first season.
And I find myself struggling to find much that feels like a fresh take. This season feels thoroughly unoriginal to me. The highlight might well be this episode's handling of Data, but there's little else that feels like an innovation.
I also can't help feeling like there's not a lot of thought being put into how this world works. That's a loss. Say what you will about Season 1, but I believed Chabon's xBs, the security and politics of research on the Cube, and even the internal logic of the imagined kingdom Kestra created. Here, the rules of everything from ship and station security to the nature of changeling biology feels slapdash at best.
I'm also irked by the way Matalas doesn't seem able to play within the rules set up my his predecessors twenty odd episodes ago. His choices don't feel like logical progressions but rejections. He's undone the wonder of Nepenthe, left Raffi and Seven's relationship unplumbed, rewritten Data's fate. I don't care if one likes or dislikes Season 1; I don't think I've ever seen a show so unflatteringly disdain its own established story.
I'm sad to find this season so flimsy when TNG has meant so much to me. Most of the episodes seem relatively solid, yet somehow it all seems far less than the sum of its parts.
I don't really want to argue with folks or rain on anyone's parade, as I see there's a lot of joy about this season that I'm not feeling. So, I think I'll leave it at that.
At any rate, I'm glad the show gets Geordi and Data's friendship right.
What is it with Picards and doors in the mind?
Generational Trauma. Next Generational.
It’s very neatly written at carefully tucking and putting old threads to bed, and course correcting for things.
It’s like Matalas has written himself and other fans an apology for some of the missteps, and so far has managed to avoid making any new ones.
The closest thing to bigger than a nitpick is this is not the first time Data has had emotions… but… those were on a damaged chip, and could later be turned off. I wonder if they were essentially simulated versus the real that he is now experiencing.
There’s no way it was simply forgotten - not only does that not mesh with everything else this season (aside from Ros exposed ear not being the right one for her to wear her earring on possibly… I keep having trouble remembering, and haven’t bothered to check…) but the scenes with him and Geordi were very reminiscent of the ones in Generations. In much the same way we had shots from FC echoed too.
And everyone has had at least one moment to shine, one moment focused on their character.
Haven’t seen that since ST V lol.
Which, interestingly has another echo with Deanna trying to take Wills pain.
This is quite an excellent job of synthesis — let’s see if it sticks the landing.
Generational Trauma. Next Generational.
It’s very neatly written at carefully tucking and putting old threads to bed, and course correcting for things.
It’s like Matalas has written himself and other fans an apology for some of the missteps, and so far has managed to avoid making any new ones.
The closest thing to bigger than a nitpick is this is not the first time Data has had emotions… but… those were on a damaged chip, and could later be turned off. I wonder if they were essentially simulated versus the real that he is now experiencing.
There’s no way it was simply forgotten - not only does that not mesh with everything else this season (aside from Ros exposed ear not being the right one for her to wear her earring on possibly… I keep having trouble remembering, and haven’t bothered to check…) but the scenes with him and Geordi were very reminiscent of the ones in Generations. In much the same way we had shots from FC echoed too.
And everyone has had at least one moment to shine, one moment focused on their character.
Haven’t seen that since ST V lol.
Which, interestingly has another echo with Deanna trying to take Wills pain.
This is quite an excellent job of synthesis — let’s see if it sticks the landing.
Vadic's fate may be worse than death. If she isn't truly dead, she's broken into a zillion splinters, frozen, and drifing off into space for eternity, never to be found, reassembled, or thawed. Eventually pieces of her will be drawn into black holes, into stars, and destroyed piecemeal. But is she truly dead the way a solid would be?
I think it’s been quite clever (as my other post just stated)
But…
To address one thing — you are right that it has the dark violence (and swearing) that are hallmarks of modern Trek, but for me, so far, the light moments are there — like with the birth of the nebula, or the rebirth of Data, the second chances for Will and Deanna… there seems a deliberate contrast that I suspect will be completed in the end. The darkness is going to be… symbolically sloughed off.
if we do go to the Ent D, it will be an expression of this too. Opposite to the dark halls of the Titan.
Part of this is couched in nostalgia, but I do wonder if it isn’t a deliberately structured case of ‘it is always darkest before the dawn’ being played out in a variety of ways.
And there was very little whimsy in s1 that wasn’t then immediately undercut by violence or darkness of some kind. Nepenthe came with the story of Thad, silly space dandy’s came with Seven executing someone and Ichebs death, and all the Borg stuff came with GoT level characters and the death of Hugh. Even the planet of ai flowers had its people stabbing each other in the eye. It was edgelord wearing a colourful waistcoat of whimsy at best.
This is… the other way around.
One would imagine that the fiery explosion of the Shrike right next to Vadic's floating parts, probably flash fried and boiled off what remained of her.
Um...Vadic's remains were in close proximity to the Shrike when it was torpedoed to smthereens, so they're effectively neutralized for keeps.
Changelings are near-infinitely adaptable, but they are not immortal. Klingon disruptors, warp core energy, and the odd genocidal virus can put PAID to them. And other stuff.
They're all glorified extras and potential redshirts.
Anyone disappointed Amanda Plummer was never on the Ready Room?
Yeah, when Data started handing his memories over one by one, I was thinking: "Okay, this is a little mental Aikido here. Data is going to subsume him, not the other way around." I like they way they played that.
Lets play who has the Katra.
WORF: I love this new power washer! I'm going to the Hall of Warriors and cleaning every statue inside. Kahless will sparkle like the blade of a newly forged bat'leth.
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