Spoilers Star Trek: Discovery 5x02 - "Under the Twin Moons"

[Farscape One]

There was also a time when the Romulans were allies in the Dominion War... for about a year and a half. Plenty of time.

 

[Quantum21]

There was also a time when the Romulans were allies in the Dominion War... for about a year and a half. Plenty of time.

So were the Breen. My spidey sense is telling me they are going to show up. Is L'ak a Breen I wonder?

 

[SJGardner]

Completely agreed. Kovich is the DISCO version of Garak. (NO ONE can be Garak except Garak, but part of why he was so awesome was that you never truly knew what he was going to do and really know him well. Even the things we DO know are only pieces of a much larger puzzle.)

New headcanon: He is in fact Garak himself. He's forgot to deactivate the "human filter" that he'd applied all the way back in that fanfic reading on Alexander Siddig's podcast for centuries, in a very "I'm not a cat" moment that Kovich, being a connoisseur of everything Old Earth, really appreciates the irony of. He's obsessively collecting trivia about Earth culture in an attempt to figure out why Bashir kept denying its obvious inferiority to Cardassia's cultural achievements.

 

[Fateor]

Throwing in another thing we don't know to replicate accurately - Greek fire. This is because the people who made this terrifying weapon kept the making of it a secret and, when they died, the knowledge was lost with them.

A lot of things were lost because of how knowledge was disseminated or stored or, if it fell out of favor or never had favor to begin with a particular group, it was abandoned or destroyed.

Star Trek has always had a dubious relationship with science. I just rewatched "Genesis". The science in that episode, just bad. Watching it this time, I picked up this nugget from the episode -

PICARD: What is it?
DATA: These kittens were born less than twenty four hours. It would appear that Spot's transformation took place at approximately the same time.
PICARD: So Spot was giving birth to the kittens at the same time that she was changing into a reptilian lifeform.
DATA: I believe so. For some reason, the intron virus was not passed on to the kittens. I do not know why.

How does a lizard give birth to kittens?

No, we can accurately replicate Greek Fire.

What we can't do is confirm the accuracy to scientific standards, because there is no recording of the exact recipe for us to hold the replication up to and go 'see, they're the same'.

It's the same thing for all of the ancient "lost" technologies.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

So were the Breen. My spidey sense is telling me they are going to show up. Is L'ak a Breen I wonder?

Is there any particular reason to suspect that L'ak is any other species than what he appears to be?

 

[Tuskin38]

Is there any particular reason to suspect that L'ak is any other species than what he appears to be?

His species is listed as unknown, so he could be anything.

 

[137th Gebirg]

I just re-watched The Chase. I think it's a good thing they decided to follow up on something with these kind of far-reaching implications and hope it goes well.

As to why the Progenitors did it, here's the dialogue from the episode:

HUMANOID: You're wondering who we are, why we have done this, how it has come that I stand before you, the image of a being from so long ago. Life evolved on my planet before all others in this part of the galaxy. We left our world, explored the stars, and found none like ourselves. Our civilization thrived for ages, but what is the life of one race, compared to the vast stretches of cosmic time? We knew that one day we would be gone, that nothing of us would survive. So, we left you. Our scientists seeded the primordial oceans of many worlds, where life was in its infancy. The seed codes directed your evolution toward a physical form resembling ours. This body you see before you, which is, of course, shaped as yours is shaped, for you are the end result. The seed codes also contained this message, which we scattered in fragments on many different worlds. It was our hope that you would have to come together in fellowship and companionship to hear this message. And if you can see and hear me, our hope has been fulfilled. You are a monument, not to our greatness, but to our existence. That was our wish, that you too would know life, and would keep alive our memory. There is something of us in each of you, and so, something of you in each other. Remember us.

One of the reasons why I have always loved "The Chase" is that it's very much a representation of what STAR TREK is at its core. I'm thrilled that DISCO decided to use this episode as the springboard for the season, because while I have a lot of issues with DISCO, and it is at the very bottom of the list of franchise shows for me... DISCO certainly does have the spirit of the franchise embedded in it.

And for that reason (even more so than being what helped bring the franchise back to tv again), it has very much earned its name... STAR TREK.

Probably one of my all-time TNG episodes. Until now, I've felt it sadly underrated and lost forever in the shadows of episodes like BoBW, Inner Light & AGT.

So glad to see the story resurrected and continued. It was one of TNG's more high-concept themes, that didn't necessarily involve "the end of all life as we know it", but more one that could have led to peaceful coexistence between cosmic siblings - hence, "One Day"... They've kind of added the "potential end of the world" caveat as a means to light a fire under the crew as a source of extreme urgency, which I guess is to be expected. They also invented this new "Red Directive" trope. I was halfway expecting one of the DISCO crew to blurt out, "Dafuq is THAT?", with someone else deadpan responding, "Sounds bad", or a more meta "Very dramatic" quip. I guess they've abandoned the Orville-like humor that they once dabbled with - probably for the best.

In any case, I hope it works out for the best. Good choice for a series finale. Looking forward to the ride.

 

[UssGlenn]

Remember us.

Do we know exactly what the Red directive was classifying? Was it the entire Progenitor story, or just the fact that they had found their technology? Because if it's the former, that's really disrespectful. Against all odds they get a message billions of years to the future, and you classify it's existence.

 

[137th Gebirg]

Well, that's why I think they had to add the "end of the world as we know it" contrivance. Until DSC S5 took up the plot, it was nothing more than a "here we are, we are you, you are we, you are each other" message-in-a-bottle from epochs past. In order to "up the ante", as it were, they needed to add the potential for interstellar disaster if the insanely powerful ancient tech from this dead civilization "fell into the wrong hands". Up until now, there was never any indication that anything other than the genetically-coded message survived from the Progenitors. So, without that, the whole incident shown in "The Chase" would have been relegated to a simple "Oh, by the way..." footnote in humanoid history, buried deep in the archives of Memory Alpha, forgotten as near-thoroughly as the original episode that introduced the concept.

 

[Quantum21]

Well, that's why I think they had to add the "end of the world as we know it" contrivance. Until DSC S5 took up the plot, it was nothing more than a "here we are, we are you, you are we, you are each other" message-in-a-bottle from epochs past. In order to "up the ante", as it were, they needed to add the potential for interstellar disaster if the insanely powerful ancient tech from this dead civilization "fell into the wrong hands". Up until now, there was never any indication that anything other than the genetically-coded message survived from the Progenitors. So, without that, the whole incident shown in "The Chase" would have been relegated to a simple "Oh, by the way..." footnote in humanoid history, buried deep in the archives of Memory Alpha, forgotten as near-thoroughly as the original episode that introduced the concept.

While The Chase was self-contained as an episode story it was part of a much bigger picture. The implications of what the Progenitor's did, and what other tech they had being billions of years older seemed wide open to me. It's the single greatest untied thread of TNG. Nothing else really comes close. A couple of body snatching bugs seems tame in comparison.

In addition to this the writers seem to be pushing philosophical implications, which I suppose would be true for many people.

So my interest in where they go in this season is about as high as it can be.

 

[fireproof78]

While The Chase was self-contained as an episode story it was part of a much bigger picture. The implications of what the Progenitor's did, and what other tech they had being billions of years older seemed wide open to me. It's the single greatest untied thread of TNG. Nothing else really comes close. A couple of body snatching bugs seems tame in comparison.

It was also implied, in dialog, as a potential weapon, so the possibilities still exist. They were not explored as such in the episode but that doesn't make them less possible.

 

[Quantum21]

It was also implied, in dialog, as a potential weapon, so the possibilities still exist. They were not explored as such in the episode but that doesn't make them less possible.

I still like my idea of a Slaver Weapon-like Swiss Army knife of technology. Why specialize when you're kinda awesome?

 

[Kzinti]

shame that saru is ''leaving'' after 2 episode i was hoping he would remain first officer for a bit longer...


after watching episode 3 edit : never mind saru as ambassador fits pretty well for him and rayner ''won'' me over
7/10

 

[hbquikcomjamesl]

Remarkable. So Rayner's a Kellerun. I don't even remember the DS9 episode that introduced the species.

The plot thickens. We have ourselves a scavenger hunt. Everything jumps off from "The Chase," and we have another kind of chase. <Zathras>At least there is symmetry.</Zathras>