Star Trek: Axanar

[Richard Baker]

Quite frankly I never noticed the cursing that everyone's been talking about when I watched it for the first time. Either I am just not that sensitive to that sort of thing, I am just a bad person or it seamlessly fit into context...

(oh well)

 

[Joel_Kirk]

And on further note: If "Star Trek" ever, in any capacity, had their characters use the n-word (which would be a huge, bold move) I would hope that it is followed up on as to 'why' it was being used and how is that individual or individuals going to learn that the archaic term is a 'no-no?'

Jake Sisko's character in "Far Beyond the Stars" said it, but I don't know if that's the same thing you're talking about.


Anyways, I thought this prelude was ok. It has pretty good production values for a fan film and for the most part great acting. But for some reason I can't really get into a fictional history documentary. Will definitely watch the movie though.

I haven't seen 'Far Beyond the Stars' in a while. However, I'm referring to the how the epithet is commercialized by rappers and used casually by some young people (black and non-black) without knowing the history or knowing how various African Americans feel about the word.

Anywho, it's interesting how this teaser has generated so much discussion....

I am also looking forward to the longer version of the film.

 

[slappy]

“They called me queen bi*** wh*** of the Federation”

And the film lost me.

Word. That was so colloquial (where any strong woman you don't like is labeled a bi*** as the go-to pejorative) that it felt ""today" and knocked me out of the story.

Why? No offense, but "bitch" and "whore" are hundreds of years old and they'll be used forever. Precisely because it hurts people's feelings such as yourselves.

 

[Tosk]

I haven't seen 'Far Beyond the Stars' in a while. However, I'm referring to the how the epithet is commercialized by rappers and used casually by some young people (black and non-black) without knowing the history or knowing how various African Americans feel about the word.

Jimmy does use the word casually in the episode. Someone said the dreaded "n-word" in a Trek episode and the world didn't end. No one even noticed. Because of the context.

 

[lennier1]

What I'm getting at is that we, the audience, do not determine when the story can and cannot use such words or tools. We are there to watch. Calling that woman the Queen Bitch showed us how badass she is. This is a positive thing showing a strong woman in command.

I saw it as the Klingons were so threatened by a female they had to try to degrade her- Garth get's a title while she gets slur.

If you consider the Klingon mindset it actually summed up her character quite nicely. If they needed that many insults crammed into one title for an enemy of theirs, she really must've been good at her work.

 

[Ithekro]

The background information (what little there is so far) suggests she was the second most deadly captain in Starfleet against the Klingons. Only topped by Garth. Second highest number of Klingon ships destroyed during the war.

 

[localyokel]

What I'm getting at is that we, the audience, do not determine when the story can and cannot use such words or tools. We are there to watch. Calling that woman the Queen Bitch showed us how badass she is. This is a positive thing showing a strong woman in command.

I saw it as the Klingons were so threatened by a female they had to try to degrade her- Garth get's a title while she gets slur.

If you consider the Klingon mindset it actually summed up her character quite nicely. If they needed that many insults crammed into one title for an enemy of theirs, she really must've been good at her work.

It doesn't enhance the story. ST isn't a profane franchise and as such it should only throw out worlds like this when it serves a good purpose. Here it doesn't. It serves to offend a large percentage of the viewers.

Nevertheless; I loved this production on the whole. So I can certainly live with it.

 

[137th Gebirg]

Define "large percentage". Is there any scientific evidence and links supporting your statements, or are you positing your opinion as fact?

I could just as easily say that a large percentage of the fandom is not offended by any of it (such as myself), and it would be just as valid (or invalid, as the case may be) as saying the opposite.

 

[BillJ]

Define "large percentage". Is there any scientific evidence and links supporting your statements, or are you positing your opinion as fact?

I could just as easily say that a large percentage of the fandom is not offended by any of it (such as myself), and it would be just as valid (or invalid, as the case may be) as saying the opposite.

+1

 

[Potemkin_Prod]

Frankly, I'm not offended at all. I just found it an awkwardly phrased statement, but that's just me.

 

[Bixby]

I find techno-babble in Star Trek a LOT more offensive to my intelligence than what the Klingons called Kate Vernon's character.
I don't mind at all that in this instance they got ''real''...

So I agree with 137th Gebirg...

 

[Noname Given]

It doesn't enhance the story. ST isn't a profane franchise and as such it should only throw out worlds like this when it serves a good purpose. Here it doesn't. It serves to offend a large percentage of the viewers.

Nevertheless; I loved this production on the whole. So I can certainly live with it.

I'd honestly say 'speak for yourself' because for an old TOS fan like myself, it added to the background and IMO showed she was feared/respected by Klingons (and the fact the Klingons were stated as using 'the strategy of least respect' -- meaning they didn't think much of Federation Captains or tactics again speaks VOLUMES about her character.)

I'd also love to see your statistics on the "large percentage" of viewers that were offended as I sure wasn't; nor were any of my friends I showed 'Prelude to Axanar' to.

 

[MikeH92467]

I was not offended by the use of those words. Whether it was good writing or not is a separate issue.

 

[lennier1]

It serves to offend a large percentage of the viewers.

After reading through this thread, it seems to only offend 90+ percent of the people born with a stick up their ass. I'd consider that an added bonus!

 

[Mage]

I saw it as the Klingons were so threatened by a female they had to try to degrade her- Garth get's a title while she gets slur.

If you consider the Klingon mindset it actually summed up her character quite nicely. If they needed that many insults crammed into one title for an enemy of theirs, she really must've been good at her work.

It doesn't enhance the story. ST isn't a profane franchise and as such it should only throw out worlds like this when it serves a good purpose. Here it doesn't. It serves to offend a large percentage of the viewers.

Nevertheless; I loved this production on the whole. So I can certainly live with it.

Considering that most people in this topic sofar feel that people need to stop making such a big fuss over this word, I don't thin it offends a large percentage of the viewers.

But hey, what to do I know, right?

 

[Ithekro]

So to attempt to shift the topic, what about the actual combat seen so far. Aside from everything being really close, does it make sense that the Klingon and late Ares are using torpedoes for the killing blows? Or that the Klingons don't seem to be firing beam weapons in combat?

Or maybe an understanding of the purpose of the popup phasers mixed with the blue phaser beams on the older starships?

 

[Mage]

It did feel that the combat was very close. But it looked great, so no complaints there.

As for the torpedoes as a killing blow, that does make sense. With the kind of energy-generators on starships, phasers should technically last for a very long time, with emiters and powergenerators being the only things taking up space. If the generator keeps on supplying unlimited energy, they could last forever. And I asume technology is advanced enough for that in the future.

Torpedoes however, are finite. You can't stack up unlimited amount of them (unlike Voyager ) and you need to resupply them, even if they can make them onboard. However, depending on the payload, they are more powerfull then a phaser.

So yeah, draining/disabeling your enemies shields with phasers, then taking them out with a torpedo makes sense.

Why aren't the Klingons doing it? Perhaps they are more gung-hoo when it comes to attack strategies. Take your most powerfull weapon, and keep shooting?

 

[137th Gebirg]

It serves to offend a large percentage of the viewers.

After reading through this thread, it seems to only offend 90+ percent of the people born with a stick up their ass. I'd consider that an added bonus!

For the win!

So to attempt to shift the topic...

THANK YOU!

I'm curious what this "devourer" thing was that Hertzler's character mentioned, immediately followed by drifting ship bits at Inverness 5. Is it some kind of Klingon super-weapon, or just some new tactic akin to WWII Germany's blitzkrieg that the less-experienced SF Captains were wholly unprepared for? I was fascinated by the implications, but they just kind of threw it out there and let it hang. Probably serving as more of a teaser for the full-length film that nobody's been talking about.

 

[Ithekro]

It sounds like the Klingons started just blowing up everything. Hounding Starfleet even during rescue operations. The clues seem to be that Sonya's force kept getting called to counterattack only to find the Klingons gone before her group could warp in. The second clue is that Garth mentions that whenever they tried to use the transporters on survivors, either the transporters would blow out or the Klingons would attack.

 

[lennier1]

I'm curious what this "devourer" thing was that Hertzler's character mentioned, immediately followed by drifting ship bits at Inverness 5.

In its effect, probably something similar to swarming (continuous attack->regroup->reposition->attack->...), a tactic the Mongols first used with devastating results on enemies unfamiliar with it, since it not only overwhelmed the target's defenses, but also had the demoralizing effect of making the attacking group appear much larger than it actually was.