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Spoilers Spyfall, Part One grade and discussion thread

How do you rate Spyfall, Part One?


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Yes it was............So this is a version of the Master that still has the drum sounds, maybe an incarnation after Simms but before Missy.

Does the Master remember any of his prior forms?
If he still hears the drums it would suggest being an incarnation before Simms even. After the events in The End of Time the drums -- which were a signal to guide the Timelords to that particular point in time and space -- should have stopped. And the behaviour of the older Simms Master in World Enough and Time/ The Doctor Falls suggests he doesn't hear them anymore.
Most likely it's just an easter egg recycling of the Time Lord Hearts beat rhythm which itself is a riff of the baseline the show's theme tune. Something which they've done a few times already as door knocking.
 
What if this Master is actually a clone created during Saxon's days as a way of surviving his actual death. This would explain why he's so much like Simm and also avoid invalidating Missy's redemption.
 
What if this Master is actually a clone created during Saxon's days as a way of surviving his actual death. This would explain why he's so much like Simm and also avoid invalidating Missy's redemption.

If they (Moffat) can invalidate the Masters redemption ("get out of the way"), then Chibnill can return the favor and invalidate Missy's. I said from day one that TEoT was just as much about the Master's redemption as it was a farewell for 10 (and an intro for 11).
 
Nah, War Doctor bumps them up by one, then Handy Jar Doctor bumps up another one...Smith is 13. He could only regenerate because of the extra cycle granted at his Doctors death. Capaldi is Nu-1.
Capaldi is after the first regeneration of the new cycle, as Troughton was after the first change of the previous cycle.
 
Only after so many incarnations. In a show where continuity for the Doctor went from "it's part of the TARDIS, without it I can't survive" (Power of the Daleks) to "Get me to the zero room, the TARDIS is hurting me" followed by going to a place that's free of all technology in order for convalescence ("Castrolvava") and every story in between or since adding to or replacing canon with something different... making it up as they go along each time. For regeneration, there just is no consistency and RTD just about ruined it by using it as a lame "get out of peril free" card and then when it came time for him to regenerate or use the sonic screwdriver, the contrivances used were laughably bad. So to try to carry that over into later (or retcon into previous) incarnations isn't going to work.

Moffatt carried it over, and Chibbers has run with it. The First Doctor and Susan were possibly from the far future, until they weren't. Making it up as they go IS this show. So don't complain if something someone made up (Doctor can heal instantly if still regenerating unless killed outright) gets picked up and used again. It does work, you just don't like that it does. Bit like the civil service and Dominic Cummings.
 
Me too

(Granted if she has retained her memories), this will be her 5th face of the Doctor. She'd getting up their with dear old dad with number of Doctors she's had! I think some nice reference or call back to the Brigadeer about this would be sweeeet.
Eh, as it is every time Kate makes an appearance we get bashed over the head with references to the Brigadier in a vain attempt to solidify it for the two people who might not yet get the fact that she's his daughter. If she does return again, how about not mentioning she's the Brigadier's daughter? We all remember the dozen times per episode they mentioned it in in the other episodes she was in, we don't need to be reminded again.
All we need now is a Master / Doctor kiss.
Capaldi and Missy kissed in season 8.
Was the Master trying to pull Yaz?

After she fell for him, he'd either drive her insane or murder the little copper, but there was a focus on Yaz, and that's a very kissable face that the Master was wearing.
Yeah, I also noticed they seem to be developing something between the Master and Yaz. Could be interesting to see how that develops in future episodes. At the very least, it gives Yaz something to do.
If they (Moffat) can invalidate the Masters redemption ("get out of the way"),
That wasn't really redemption. The Master just wanted Rassilon dead more than he wanted the Doctor dead in that moment.
 
... What if the Master is not 'our' Master, but a Master from one of those alternate Universes. Maybe the Master isn't the Escape Artist that we always assumed that he was. Replacement Masters simply keep jumping into our Universe via that abandoned coal mine in Lackawanna!
 
... What if the Master is not 'our' Master, but a Master from one of those alternate Universes. Maybe the Master isn't the Escape Artist that we always assumed that he was. Replacement Masters simply keep jumping into our Universe via that abandoned coal mine in Lackawanna!
That would depend on how beholden Chibnall is to RTD's ideas. RTD stated that Time Lords are unique to our universe, meaning there aren't any in any other universe in the entire multiverse.

Regardless, we're probably overthinking things since anyone who actually thought the Master was truly dead with Missy were the ones deluding themselves.
 
Is it me, or did he seem to be portraying the Master as somewhat "unwell" once the reveal came? There were segments where he seemed to be trying to catch his breath or supporting himself on the backs of the seats... another unstable regeneration, given the supposed impossibility of such in "his" last appearance?
Maybe he was ill from all that scenery he chewed.
 
I do kind of hate the idea that the Master/Missy's redemption arc, so much a part of the show a mere two seasons ago, could be tossed aside so easily; Missy had become so complex that it seems a retrograde step to just change her back into a cackling loon supervillain. But I suppose change is the nature of the show, right?
 
There's definitely an argument that allowing the Master to be reinvented continuously is the very thing that let Moffat do such a great storyline with Missy, and being tied down to that would prevent Chibnall or any future writer from doing a similarly effective reinvention.

I don't know, I'm reserving a lot of judgement about this episode until I see the conclusion. There's simply no way to tell how or if this interacts with the Missy arc. Like, at the moment, it feels weird to have the Master reset to, what, 35 years ago with the shrink-ray stuff when their redemption arc was a little over a season ago. Seriously, the last two-parter was when we previously saw the Master, that's not a lot of time for an off-screen reinvention. Add to the fact that both Harold Saxon and Missy were built up and built up with extremely direct, personal attacks on the Doctor... well, again, we need to see part 2, but at the moment, it feels like the Master is just wanking around being evil for laughs, without the same sort of personal obsession and vendetta that characterized their more recent appearances.
 
Can I ship the Doctor and Master?

Oh gosh darnit I forgot that Capaldi and Missy did kiss. But they didn't nookie.
 
The simplest solution seems to be that this Master is a regeneration that came before Missy. I mean did we actually see Simm regenerate into her? I don't recall exactly, but I don't think we did. Simple, but cheap.
 
Capaldi is after the first regeneration of the new cycle, as Troughton was after the first change of the previous cycle.

Hmm. That is an interesting way of looking at it, but Capaldi doc wouldn’t have existed without the new cycle. I suppose what you are arguing is essentially that Smith is both 13 and 1 as a result of that regeneration. Which is also interesting because it means that any ‘new cycle’ is always one less than an initial cycle.
 
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