Niners Unite...around Babylon 5! - The Continuing Arc
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Re: First time impressions from the Babylon 5 virgin
I figure this is the place to ask. Season five is in the mail. Afterwards, I fully intend to pick up the movies box set and see the remaining films. The questions I have are:
(1) Are the novels worth it, I know that only some are canon, but I am unsure which ones.
(2) Is Crusade worth it? I realize it was cancelled prematurely, but Galen appears both in A Call to Arms and in the forthcoming Lost Tales DVD, so I don't want to be in the dark on his character.
(3) Is Legend of the Rangers worth it? I've heard a lot of negative criticism of this pilot that didn't go anywhere, but it has G'Kar in it, so I'm unsure whether I want to view it or not.
(4) Anything else in the B5 Universe that I am unaware of and should check out?
I figure this is the place to ask. Season five is in the mail. Afterwards, I fully intend to pick up the movies box set and see the remaining films. The questions I have are:
(1) Are the novels worth it, I know that only some are canon, but I am unsure which ones.
(2) Is Crusade worth it? I realize it was cancelled prematurely, but Galen appears both in A Call to Arms and in the forthcoming Lost Tales DVD, so I don't want to be in the dark on his character.
(3) Is Legend of the Rangers worth it? I've heard a lot of negative criticism of this pilot that didn't go anywhere, but it has G'Kar in it, so I'm unsure whether I want to view it or not.
(4) Anything else in the B5 Universe that I am unaware of and should check out?
Re: First time impressions from the Babylon 5 virgin
I am not a true "completist", but... I am of the opinion that you should experience everything B5 related at least once.
The novels are indeed worth it, at least these are:
"The Shadow Within" - by Jeanne Cavelos
"To Dream in the City of Sorrows" - by Kathryn M. Drennan
The Psi Corps Trilogy - by J. Gregory Keyes
"Dark Genesis: The Birth of the Psi Corps"
"Deadly Relations: Bester Ascendant"
"Final Reckoning: The Fate of Bester""
The Centauri Trilogy - by Peter David
"Legions of Fire, Book 1: The Long Night of Centauri Prime"
"Legions of Fire, Book 2: Armies of Light and Dark"
"Legions of Fire, Book 3: Out of the Darkness"
The Technomage Trilogy - by Jeanne Cavelos
"The Passing of the Technomages Book 1: Casting Shadows"
"The Passing of the Technomages Book 2: Summoning Light"
"The Passing of the Technomages Book 3: Invoking Darkness"
Now, I personally believe that Crusade is definitely worthwhile. Not all B5 fans feel that way, but I most assuredly do.
Legend of the Rangers..... you're right. Not a whole lot of good is said about it. Personally... I think it could have been better... alot better. That aside, watch it at least once.
I am not a true "completist", but... I am of the opinion that you should experience everything B5 related at least once.
The novels are indeed worth it, at least these are:
"The Shadow Within" - by Jeanne Cavelos
"To Dream in the City of Sorrows" - by Kathryn M. Drennan
The Psi Corps Trilogy - by J. Gregory Keyes
"Dark Genesis: The Birth of the Psi Corps"
"Deadly Relations: Bester Ascendant"
"Final Reckoning: The Fate of Bester""
The Centauri Trilogy - by Peter David
"Legions of Fire, Book 1: The Long Night of Centauri Prime"
"Legions of Fire, Book 2: Armies of Light and Dark"
"Legions of Fire, Book 3: Out of the Darkness"
The Technomage Trilogy - by Jeanne Cavelos
"The Passing of the Technomages Book 1: Casting Shadows"
"The Passing of the Technomages Book 2: Summoning Light"
"The Passing of the Technomages Book 3: Invoking Darkness"
Now, I personally believe that Crusade is definitely worthwhile. Not all B5 fans feel that way, but I most assuredly do.
Legend of the Rangers..... you're right. Not a whole lot of good is said about it. Personally... I think it could have been better... alot better. That aside, watch it at least once.
Re: First time impressions from the Babylon 5 virgin
^^
Okay, thanks. I think I'll pass on LOTR for the moment, but I'll definitely try and pick up those books at the used bookstores when I get home. I guess I'll have to save up and snatch Crusade, but only after I buy the rest of the series first.
^^
Okay, thanks. I think I'll pass on LOTR for the moment, but I'll definitely try and pick up those books at the used bookstores when I get home. I guess I'll have to save up and snatch Crusade, but only after I buy the rest of the series first.
Re: First time impressions from the Babylon 5 virgin
One should *probably* read the Centauri trilogy after the Technomage trilogy, although it isn't required by any means.
If you can get your hands on the unfilmed Crusade script "Value Judgements", read that prior to The Fate of Bester.
One should *probably* read the Centauri trilogy after the Technomage trilogy, although it isn't required by any means.
If you can get your hands on the unfilmed Crusade script "Value Judgements", read that prior to The Fate of Bester.
Re: First time impressions from the Babylon 5 virgin
^^
Hmm. Okay. And to ask further questions, where exactly do these books fall during the course of the series? (I figure this summer I'll watch all of Babylon 5 and read the books in the best order possible in preparation for the Lost Tales, if I don't start before)
^^
Hmm. Okay. And to ask further questions, where exactly do these books fall during the course of the series? (I figure this summer I'll watch all of Babylon 5 and read the books in the best order possible in preparation for the Lost Tales, if I don't start before)
Re: First time impressions from the Babylon 5 virgin
The Psi Corps trilogy pretty much spans the entire story of B5, because it deals with the earlies days of the Corps. It then goes ... well, I can't tell you anything else lest I spoils some of S5 for you.
The Centauri trilogy takes place between the last two episodes of S5, I think
The Technomage trilogy begins in 2258 - S2 in B5 time.
The Psi Corps trilogy pretty much spans the entire story of B5, because it deals with the earlies days of the Corps. It then goes ... well, I can't tell you anything else lest I spoils some of S5 for you.
The Centauri trilogy takes place between the last two episodes of S5, I think
The Technomage trilogy begins in 2258 - S2 in B5 time.
Re: First time impressions from the Babylon 5 virgin
Okay, thanks all. I look forward to getting my hands on those books and seeing the whole of Babylon 5. Also, I'm hoping season five comes in the mail. I've just been watching my season four box set over and over again-- gaining more appreciation for it, yes, but I'm hankering for some new Babylon 5.
Okay, thanks all. I look forward to getting my hands on those books and seeing the whole of Babylon 5. Also, I'm hoping season five comes in the mail. I've just been watching my season four box set over and over again-- gaining more appreciation for it, yes, but I'm hankering for some new Babylon 5.
Re: First time impressions from the Babylon 5 virgin
Novels are quite good. I am still looking for some of them them but I heard that Psi-Corps Trigology and Centauri Trigology are best. They are also finales of some unanswered plot points.
Crusade is also very good in my opinion. It had a great potential. But it had ended prematurely and without having a chance. Just like Firefly.
Babylon 5 tv movies are not bad either. Most of them are tied to original characters so they have JMS quality. "In the Beginning" , "Thirdspace" and "A Call to Arms" ( pilot of Crusade ) are worth looking. Also waiting and wondering "Voices in Dark". "River of Souls" is mediocre at best. But.... Stay away from Legend of Rangers. I haven't seen a tv movie so awful like this.
Novels are quite good. I am still looking for some of them them but I heard that Psi-Corps Trigology and Centauri Trigology are best. They are also finales of some unanswered plot points.
Crusade is also very good in my opinion. It had a great potential. But it had ended prematurely and without having a chance. Just like Firefly.
Babylon 5 tv movies are not bad either. Most of them are tied to original characters so they have JMS quality. "In the Beginning" , "Thirdspace" and "A Call to Arms" ( pilot of Crusade ) are worth looking. Also waiting and wondering "Voices in Dark". "River of Souls" is mediocre at best. But.... Stay away from Legend of Rangers. I haven't seen a tv movie so awful like this.
Re: First time impressions from the Babylon 5 virgin
A View From The Gallery
This is a similar episode to TNG's Lower Decks. I liked the light-heartedness of this episode. At times it was prettty funny. Unfortunately, like all the episodes so far this season, this is mostly a stand-alone story with no major plot threads, other then Garibaldi and Lochley's continuing hate for each other.
Learning Curve
Let me preface this review by saying that I like all of Star Trek, even Voyager, so naturally I like stand-alone episodes. So on one hand, I liked this episode. On the other hand though, I remember back in Seasons 2-4 when all these plot threads were intertwined and it kept you coming back for more. Those were some excellent episodes. This episode is a stand alone episode, one I liked, but it's probably the first in Season 5 to have an ending that sets up the next episode. Things are not even close to being as intertwined and interesting as they were in Seasons 2-4, but on its own, I really liked this episode. What Lochley's connection with Sheridan is, I don't really know. But judging by Delenn's reaction, could it be that they had a romantic relationship in the past? I'm guessing I'll be finding out next episode in Strange Relations.
A View From The Gallery
This is a similar episode to TNG's Lower Decks. I liked the light-heartedness of this episode. At times it was prettty funny. Unfortunately, like all the episodes so far this season, this is mostly a stand-alone story with no major plot threads, other then Garibaldi and Lochley's continuing hate for each other.
Learning Curve
Let me preface this review by saying that I like all of Star Trek, even Voyager, so naturally I like stand-alone episodes. So on one hand, I liked this episode. On the other hand though, I remember back in Seasons 2-4 when all these plot threads were intertwined and it kept you coming back for more. Those were some excellent episodes. This episode is a stand alone episode, one I liked, but it's probably the first in Season 5 to have an ending that sets up the next episode. Things are not even close to being as intertwined and interesting as they were in Seasons 2-4, but on its own, I really liked this episode. What Lochley's connection with Sheridan is, I don't really know. But judging by Delenn's reaction, could it be that they had a romantic relationship in the past? I'm guessing I'll be finding out next episode in Strange Relations.
Re: First time impressions from the Babylon 5 virgin
Strange Relations
Byron is realy starting to annoy me. I can just imagine that if the station is exploding around him, and he needed to run for the escape pods, he would stop and relate a parable about something that figuratively means something or other. And what the hell was that song at the end? That was so weird it was hilarious (but not funny in a good way). Then there's Lochley's past relationship with Sheridan. Sheridan sure married a lot didn't he? Although that twist was very soap opera-ish, I think it'll open up a lot of interesting character moments between them and Delenn. Bester was delightfully evil, as usual, in this episode. He just wasn't in it enough. It's in the Lochley/Bester scenes that I wish Ivanova was still on the station, then Bester would've been pushed out of the nearest airlock, instead of capitulating to his demands. Either that, or Ivanova wouldn't have stopped Garibaldi from shooting Bester. Yes, I really want to see Bester die. Hopefully he does in a future episode. G'Kar and Londo, the newest married couple on B5, has gotten closer. G'Kar is now Londo's bodyguard. How hilarious is that? What a journey both these characters have been on through this series.
Strange Relations
Byron is realy starting to annoy me. I can just imagine that if the station is exploding around him, and he needed to run for the escape pods, he would stop and relate a parable about something that figuratively means something or other. And what the hell was that song at the end? That was so weird it was hilarious (but not funny in a good way). Then there's Lochley's past relationship with Sheridan. Sheridan sure married a lot didn't he? Although that twist was very soap opera-ish, I think it'll open up a lot of interesting character moments between them and Delenn. Bester was delightfully evil, as usual, in this episode. He just wasn't in it enough. It's in the Lochley/Bester scenes that I wish Ivanova was still on the station, then Bester would've been pushed out of the nearest airlock, instead of capitulating to his demands. Either that, or Ivanova wouldn't have stopped Garibaldi from shooting Bester. Yes, I really want to see Bester die. Hopefully he does in a future episode. G'Kar and Londo, the newest married couple on B5, has gotten closer. G'Kar is now Londo's bodyguard. How hilarious is that? What a journey both these characters have been on through this series.
Re: First time impressions from the Babylon 5 virgin
, but whereas Ivanova was clearly in the rebel camp and emotional... Lochley is here more as a means and a symbol of healing the post-civil war rift that Clark & Sheridan created.
(insert innocently whistling here......)
Understandable, but keep reminding yourself of Lochley's role. She is a completely different type of character from Ivanova. Both are very strong women, in a good way
, but whereas Ivanova was clearly in the rebel camp and emotional... Lochley is here more as a means and a symbol of healing the post-civil war rift that Clark & Sheridan created.So... you think that would have been enough, huh?
(insert innocently whistling here......)
Re: First time impressions from the Babylon 5 virgin
Byron: "What a piece of work is man. How noble in reason. How infinite in facilities. In form and moving, how express and admirable. In action, how like an angel. In apprehension, how like a god. The beauty of the world. The Paragon of Animals"
Picard: "What Hamlet might say with irony, I say with conviction - what a piece of work is man! How noble in reason, how infinite in faculties, in form and moving how express and admirable, in action how like an angel, in apprehension how like a god!"
Byron: "What a piece of work is man. How noble in reason. How infinite in facilities. In form and moving, how express and admirable. In action, how like an angel. In apprehension, how like a god. The beauty of the world. The Paragon of Animals"
Picard: "What Hamlet might say with irony, I say with conviction - what a piece of work is man! How noble in reason, how infinite in faculties, in form and moving how express and admirable, in action how like an angel, in apprehension how like a god!"
Re: First time impressions from the Babylon 5 virgin
If only Byron was played by Patrick Stewart.
If only Byron was played by Patrick Stewart.
Re: First time impressions from the Babylon 5 virgin
Secrets Of The Soul
This was an average episode up until the end, where it really had a nice twist that took me by surprise. This episode had no Garibaldi, no Sheridan, no G'Kar, no Vir, and no Londo. The story was based around Franklin, who I like, and the other plot around Byron, who annoys me to know end. The Franklin plot was by the numbers with a storyline that has been done before. The Byron plot, was surprisingly, more interesting, but still pretty pedestrian. Until the end. So, let me get this straight. The Vorlons created the telepaths for use as cannon fodder. That makes a whole lot of sense. And when you take into account the inherent superiority of telepaths, especially those of the psi cops, it's very ironic. It's also interesting that it seems they're making Byron and his cult of telepaths the bad guys coming up. If this is the case, I welcome it. I want to see Byron die a slow and horrible death, (he deserves one for stealing Lyta from Zack. Poor Zack), and if he's a bad guy, my wish will probably come true (I hope). One thing did disturb me about this episode. And no, I'm not talking about when all the telepaths crowded around Lyta and started rubbing her. It was the end, when Byron and Lyta were "doing it", and all the telepaths crowded around to watch
. Between this and the singing a couple episodes ago, what othe weird things will happen in the coming episodes with these telepaths?
Day Of The Dead
I am very surprised how good this episode is. In fact, it is my favourite of the season, so far. Even Penn and Teller were good in it. I was so surprised to see all these old characters return: Adira, Dodger, and especially, Morden. I never thought I'd see Mr. Morden again, but I'm very happy I did. Interestingly, he appears to Lennier. Does this prophesy that Lennier will be heading down a dark path this season? Well, he doesn't like Sheridan. That much is obvious. And if Morden is to be believed, and I have no doubt his prophecies will be 100% fulfilled, Lennier will betray the Rangers and die. Then there's Kosh's message to Sheridan. I have no idea what it means, but it's nice to have another Kosh saying to figure out. I wonder who the other main characters would have saw if they were in that section of the station? I would guess that Ivanova would see her father, Marcus his brother, Sheridan would see Melissa (or Kosh, as is implied). I don't know who G'Kar or Franklin would see. Any ideas?
By the way, I was actually supposed to watch In The Kingdom Of the Blind first, because I watching them all in chronological order rather than airdate order, but I totally forgot and watched Day Of The Dead instead. According to the Lurker's Guide, it looks like Day Of The Dead falls after the telepath crisis is over. The chronological order also explains how G'Kar and Londo are back on the station during this episode, when they left for Centauri Prime a couple episodes ago. Anyway, I don't think I blew anything by watching it this way, so next I'll be watching In The Kingdom Of The Blind.
Secrets Of The Soul
This was an average episode up until the end, where it really had a nice twist that took me by surprise. This episode had no Garibaldi, no Sheridan, no G'Kar, no Vir, and no Londo. The story was based around Franklin, who I like, and the other plot around Byron, who annoys me to know end. The Franklin plot was by the numbers with a storyline that has been done before. The Byron plot, was surprisingly, more interesting, but still pretty pedestrian. Until the end. So, let me get this straight. The Vorlons created the telepaths for use as cannon fodder. That makes a whole lot of sense. And when you take into account the inherent superiority of telepaths, especially those of the psi cops, it's very ironic. It's also interesting that it seems they're making Byron and his cult of telepaths the bad guys coming up. If this is the case, I welcome it. I want to see Byron die a slow and horrible death, (he deserves one for stealing Lyta from Zack. Poor Zack), and if he's a bad guy, my wish will probably come true (I hope). One thing did disturb me about this episode. And no, I'm not talking about when all the telepaths crowded around Lyta and started rubbing her. It was the end, when Byron and Lyta were "doing it", and all the telepaths crowded around to watch
. Between this and the singing a couple episodes ago, what othe weird things will happen in the coming episodes with these telepaths?Day Of The Dead
I am very surprised how good this episode is. In fact, it is my favourite of the season, so far. Even Penn and Teller were good in it. I was so surprised to see all these old characters return: Adira, Dodger, and especially, Morden. I never thought I'd see Mr. Morden again, but I'm very happy I did. Interestingly, he appears to Lennier. Does this prophesy that Lennier will be heading down a dark path this season? Well, he doesn't like Sheridan. That much is obvious. And if Morden is to be believed, and I have no doubt his prophecies will be 100% fulfilled, Lennier will betray the Rangers and die. Then there's Kosh's message to Sheridan. I have no idea what it means, but it's nice to have another Kosh saying to figure out. I wonder who the other main characters would have saw if they were in that section of the station? I would guess that Ivanova would see her father, Marcus his brother, Sheridan would see Melissa (or Kosh, as is implied). I don't know who G'Kar or Franklin would see. Any ideas?
By the way, I was actually supposed to watch In The Kingdom Of the Blind first, because I watching them all in chronological order rather than airdate order, but I totally forgot and watched Day Of The Dead instead. According to the Lurker's Guide, it looks like Day Of The Dead falls after the telepath crisis is over. The chronological order also explains how G'Kar and Londo are back on the station during this episode, when they left for Centauri Prime a couple episodes ago. Anyway, I don't think I blew anything by watching it this way, so next I'll be watching In The Kingdom Of The Blind.
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