Niners Unite...around Babylon 5! - The Continuing Arc

[Neroon]

Re: First time impressions from the Babylon 5 virgin

There is also this one by Terry Jones. It is based upon what he published in the Official B5 Magazine a few years ago. Unfortunately, the link only covers up through the events that occur in season 2. Bear in mind that this all goes way back to well before Valen ever appeared. Both of the documents together provide you with a superb, all-inclusive view. The digital version from ISNNEWS does include some corrections over what Jones published. I did end up keying in the rest of it myself, from the remaining issues of Jones' work.... and I was exhausted afterwards.


PK, have you consulted the Master Episode list out at the Lurker's Guide? That doesn't include the books, but it does have the B5 run and the movies.

 

[Harvey]

Re: First time impressions from the Babylon 5 virgin

"No Surrender, No Retreat"

Season four really gets amped up into high gear beginning with this episode, which is one of my favorite of the series. Next to the brilliant "The Face of the Enemy," it's my favorite of the season. Sheridan's battle for Proxima III (which I realize has been often mentioned, but I really don't know what it is--I'm glad Mars has been established in the series by this point, because it's nice to know what you're fighting for) is contrasted nicely with Londo and G'Kar's scenes. And Corwin, who was featured in season three but has been all but in the background this year, has more to do in this episode. I wish that character got to go somewhere in the spin-offs (also, in season five, but alas...).

Grade: A+

"Exercise of Vital Powers"

This episode couldn't have been as good as the last one, but it is good nonetheless. Lyta continues to get the short end of the stick (really, Zack is the only one on the station who treats her with any sense of decency). Garibaldi's narration is a bit overdone, both in the writing and the performance (not surprising, since according to the flawed but interesting Del Rey season guides, Jerry Doyle didn't like doing ADR). We finally meet Edgars, who is great because he's not a villain. Shades of grey, sure, but despite his mustache there is little mustache twirling to be had here, and that is a good thing. And, hopefully, this is the last mention of "Franz" we'll ever hear in the series.

Grade: A-

 

[Harvey]

Re: First time impressions from the Babylon 5 virgin

"Babylon 5: The Shadow Within" (Novel) (2257)

This book starts off a little slow, with a writing style that wasn't as engaging as it could have been, and quite frankly, bored me a little. Luckily, the book really picks up after the first 50-100 pages, when John and Anna's stories get kicked into high gear. I think my favorite part of this book is the subplot involving Morden, which manages to transform his character from a mysterious (and evil) one into a tragic one. John's story is surprisingly good as well, which surprised me, since JMS says it's not canon (or at least that's how I understand it). The only part of the story that doesn't jive with canon for me is the description of Captain Best's actions at the Battle of the Line. From what we saw of the battle from In The Beginning, I don't think anyone would have been condemned for running. I recall the president's call to be a plea and not an order, but it's been a while, so maybe I'm just misremembering ITB.

It's also nice to have Kosh appear in the book, though I think his character is infinitely more suited for a television environment--getting inside of his head is a mistake, I think. Things are set up rather nicely for the Gathering, though. Part of me wishes this had become on of the TV movies perhaps instead of River of Souls (which I have not heard good things about) or Thirdspace (which I liked, but I wonder if this would have been better).

Grade: B+

 

[Harvey]

Re: First time impressions from the Babylon 5 virgin

Just a heads up, but http://www.bestbuy.com has seasons 1-5 of Babylon 5 for 19.99 each. Of course, the movie collection, LOTR, and Crusade aren't on sale--being the ones I want to purchase--but hopefully this will help someone else complete their B5 collection on the cheap.

 

[Mal]

Re: First time impressions from the Babylon 5 virgin

Hirogen Alpha said:
Just a heads up, but http://www.bestbuy.com has seasons 1-5 of Babylon 5 for 19.99 each. Of course, the movie collection, LOTR, and Crusade aren't on sale--being the ones I want to purchase--but hopefully this will help someone else complete their B5 collection on the cheap.

far be it for me to question the wisdom of the free market, but how exactly do you sell 968 minutes of Babylon 5 (1 season) for $19.99, and then try and sell 75 minutes of Babylon 5 (The Lost Tales) for $22.99?

 

[Harvey]

Re: First time impressions from the Babylon 5 virgin

^^
Those 75 minutes are new, and aren't selling for much less than that anywhere else. Furthermore, they're being eaten up at that price--the Lost Tales is still one of the top sellers at Amazon.

Those 968 minutes on the other hand, are old, and owned by most all who would buy them at full price.

It's all about demand. (Now, tell me when the movies box set will drop in price. I can't believe they're charging full price on that--the same as a season of the show--when it contains only ten episodes worth of material compared to 22.)

 

[Mal]

Re: First time impressions from the Babylon 5 virgin

^ ok, then what about 90 minutes of Legend of the Rangers for $14.99?

 

[Harvey]

Re: First time impressions from the Babylon 5 virgin

^^
Proof that there is no justice in the world.

And, to move onto what may be the exact opposite of LOTR...

"The Face of the Enemy"

This is probably my single most favorite episode of Babylon 5. Everything about it is brilliant--the acting, the music, the direction, the camera work, and the writing--everything comes together in top form. The scene where Sheridan is taken captive is probably the single best shot scene in the entirety of B5. Where most other work on the show is traditional and in the background, the camera work, use of still photography, and magnificent editing (aided by an outstanding piece by Christopher Franke) work to create an amazing piece of work. Immediately following is another brilliant piece of cross-cutting between Ivanova and the ISN report and Sheridan's actual treatment, which is beautiful and resists the most obvious cut (when ISN reports Sheridan is being treated well) to instead hold on Claudia Christian's face, allowing her acting (which I have often been critical of) to shine.

After that, we finally get the reveal of everything that has been happening to Garibaldi. When Edgars reveals all, the music is gone, and the acting is paramount. The camera work is subtle (save for the beautiful move onto Lise at the end of the conversation) allowing for the excellent actors to carry the scene. Following this is of course Bester's reveal, further explaining everything that has happened. Walter Koenig is excellent, turning exposition (admittedly, very well written exposition) into something chilling. The further use of still photography as well as the zoom in onto Garibaldi's eye (which is actually a zoom out that has been reversed I've found out) give this scene even more visual flair. Finally, the way Gariabldi's scream melds into the scream of the tram as well as Christopher Franke's music (which is in top form--and I'm not the biggest fan of some of the choices he's made on B5). Lastly, we get Garibaldi's panicked return to Edgar's home in search of Lise, which is all shot handheld (and unlike some of the excessive handheld work found in other productions, is entirely motivated). The final use of still photographs in the ISN report caps a stunning episode of Babylon 5.

I only wish it had occurred earlier in the arc of the series. I know for a fact that it could convince several people I know to give Babylon 5 a look (or a second look), but it comes so late in the arc that I'm afraid it will give away most of the series' surprises.

Oh, yeah... Grade: A+

 

[Harvey]

Re: First time impressions from the Babylon 5 virgin

"Intersections in Real Time"

The last episode was brilliant. This episode is pretty close. A play with six short acts, this episode unfolds as one of the hardest hours of Babylon 5 to watch, but also the best. The direction is excellent--what could be boring and stagnant is kept fresh, especially with the high angles and subjective angles that are so rarely used on Babylon 5. Sometimes, JMS writes dialogue that just doesn't work. This is not one of those times. He put a lot work researching interrogation techniques (from what I've gathered) and it shows.

The acting is the best it has been on the series for all involved-- Boxleitner, Alexander, and Birk all shine.

Grade: A

 

[Harvey]

Re: First time impressions from the Babylon 5 virgin

"Between the Darkness and the Light"
Of the last five episodes, this one is the weakest. It's still a very watchable episode, but it's an over the top Susan Ivanova monologue, an out of focus close up of Ivanova on her death-bed, a continuity error of Garibaldi's hood in the opening, and a funny scene with Lyta, Franklin, and Garibaldi that goes for a beat or two too long short of being as good as the others. That said, there's plenty of good stuff here, including the opening with Sheridan, which almost makes me wonder if JMS had a whole second episode of interrogation material in him, but had to loose it in favor of a truncated season.

Grade: A-

"Endgame"
This is it--Endgame. Everything falls into place here. There's not a whole lot that's surprising about this episode, except maybe Marcus' sacrifice (and even that becomes apparent pretty quickly), but that doesn't stop it from being satisfying. They sure got some of the worst actors ever to play Starfury pilots in the end, though. I bemoan the series for not being able to show more pilots because of budgetary constraints, but when they do show them in this episode, I don't buy their performance. I guess I should have listened to Uhura--be careful what you wish for. But wrong series. "We're here to place President Clark under arrest!"

Grade: A

"Rising Star"
When I saw this episode for the first time, a few months ago, I had this to say:

Hirogen Alpha said:
I haven't seen Sleeping in Light yet, but I have the feeling that if I never do, I'll still be satisfied with this episode as a beautiful coda to the universe of Babylon 5. It's a shame that the Telepath War and the Drakh War won't be seen beyond a few fleeting moments in the following season, movies, and Crusade, but somehow, everything still feels complete. Garibaldi and Lis are finally together on Mars. Mars is free. Delenn and John are finally together. John's father is safe. The interstellar alliance has been formed, and John is their president.

I've got to go to work now, so the finale will have to wait. I've had mixed feelings about this season, but Rising Star hits all the right notes. It was a new age. It was the end of history. It was the year everything changed. To know that a show could go from The Gathering to this is amazing. I finally understand why so many hold this show to be so special.

:thumbsup:

I stand by those remarks, misspellings aside. "Rising Star" is a great end to a good season. Unfortunately, it really is an end, and for the first time, Babylon 5 will have to start itself up again next season, and from what I recall from my first viewing, it takes a while for that to happen. This is the end of season four for me--I know I still have Deconstruction left, but I've always considered that a season five episode. In the final analysis, the second half of the season was better than the first. The first episodes were slow until they reached their conclusion, which was abrupt and unsatisfying. The later episodes were faster, and reached a far more satisfying conclusion. There were losses, and not everything was solved with explosions, but it was satisfying.

I've started reading Peter David's Legions of Fire books, since I don't want to spoil much of Galen with the Techno-Mage books, and I've enjoyed what I've read thus far. I don't know when I'll be watching season five--perhaps it will be as early as tomorrow, perhaps it will be several weeks. I know there are still two seasons worth of material to watch, or rewatch, not to mention ten canon books waiting to be read, but it still is sad knowing before long, I'll be saying goodbye to these characters all over again. Bring on the Lost Tales.

One last question--I've listened to the DVD Suite on the season four DVDs a number of times, and it really is a fine selection of Christopher Franke's music. It is on one of the CDs I have yet to purchase or was it specially composed or arranged for the DVDs? Its an excellent piece of work either way.

 

[Jan]

Re: First time impressions from the Babylon 5 virgin

Hirogen Alpha said:
One last question--I've listened to the DVD Suite on the season four DVDs a number of times, and it really is a fine selection of Christopher Franke's music. It is on one of the CDs I have yet to purchase or was it specially composed or arranged for the DVDs? Its an excellent piece of work either way.

To the best of my knowledge it was composed for the DVD. I think that it, along with the beginning of track #6 of the 'In the Beginning' CD and the 'Death of the Station' track from 'Sleeping in Light' are my favorite passages of all.

 

[Harvey]

Re: First time impressions from the Babylon 5 virgin

^^
I've listened to track 6 on ITB a number of times just this past week, but I don't have the Sleeping in Light CD yet. I'm also a big fan of the song from The Face of the Enemy, but perhaps I am the only one.

 

[Jan]

Re: First time impressions from the Babylon 5 virgin

Hirogen Alpha said:
I'm also a big fan of the song from The Face of the Enemy, but perhaps I am the only one.

I'm pretty sure I've got that CD but I don't recall anything particular from it. Thanks, I'll have to dig it out for a listen.

Jan

 

[chrisspringob]

Re: First time impressions from the Babylon 5 virgin

That song from "The Face of the Enemy", the one that plays when Sheridan is in the bar fight, wasn't that also used in the movie "Strange Days"? It's either the same song, or they're very similar.

 

[Harvey]

Re: First time impressions from the Babylon 5 virgin

^^
I've only seen Strange Days once, so I don't know. It's possible, though. The Face of the Enemy CD doesn't give any extra information on the song. I had assumed it was a Christopher Franke composition. Did he also work on Strange Days? I know they used the Doors song of the same name (or at least a cover of it) in the film, but beyond that, I don't remember.

 

[Harvey]

Re: First time impressions from the Babylon 5 virgin

"The Deconstruction of Falling Stars"

This episode is basically composed of six segments, and I have very mixed feelings about each.

Segment one: 2262, Babylon 5: I think this is the best part of the episode, following up immediately on the heals of Rising Star. Sheridan and Delenn are both reluctant heroes, but they of course return to a huge welcome, courtesy of Garibaldi. Where's Lise? Season five will explain that away, but I still find it strange that she Garibaldi would return to Babylon 5.
(A)

Segment two: 2262, ISN: I'm not a huge fan of the ISN segments, as I have voiced in the past, but this one mostly works. It unfolds like a cable news talking heads show would, with emphasis on emotion and opinion rather than fact. It's nice that they got some archival pictures of Bruce Boxleitner (and his real life/on screen wife as well), but some of the other pictures from him that are stills from ITB as well as publicity photos for B5 are kind of cheesy looking and out of place.
(A-)

Segment three: 2362, ISN: I understand the intention of this segment, but like the worst of the ISN material B5 has done, it is done without subtlety or believability. The professors make their point to an extreme that I don't find myself buying. Delenn breaks through security with ease, and makes it to the studio almost instantly. There's plenty of things foreshadowed here--the telepaths, David Sheridan, the destruction of Babylon 5, and John's death at Coriana 6--but it's not done with any subtlety, and mostly, its stuff we already knew about, or in the case of David, stuff that still hasn't been explained.
(C+)

Segment four: 2762, Earth: Garibaldi has some nice moments here, but in the end, it isn't the real Garibaldi, so I don't care. I don't buy another Earth Civil War, either, and the way it is presented isn't any subtler than the previous segment. The hologram technician practically looks into the camera and tells us he evil. Please.
(C-)

Segment five: 3262, Earth: I like this segment more upon second viewing, but it still leaves me feelings "so what?" in the end. Mostly, the main character here repeats things we have already heard from Delenn and others. It's interesting to see the Babylon 5 characters being incorporated into something that is almost scripture, but in the end, it will have no bearing on the next 22 episodes, so I'm not that interested. And the flashing roman numerals with the camera angle are annoying, though interesting from a production perspective.
(C+)

Segment six: 1,000,000 years in the future, Earth: Humanity has become the Vorlons, or close to them. The sun is going nova, the Earth is destroyed. Humanity leaves for somewhere (which, given Lyta's season five proclamation, is probably the Vorlon homeworld). The destruction of Earth dissolves into Sheridan and Delenn, in bed. The dialogue here sums up the point of the episode nicely. Perhaps it would have been better to just have that scene and shown us something else instead. I don't know.
(A)

The faith manages dedication at the end is a nice nod to fans, and a smirk towards detractors of the show. Though, given my mixed feelings about season five, I don't know if its entirely justified. And speaking of season five, this episode is out of place with the season four opening credits (Which, curiously, have Claudia Christian in them--I guess they solved whatever contractual problems they had during the original airing). It's not even 2261 anymore during this episode!

Average Grade: B

 

[chrisspringob]

Re: First time impressions from the Babylon 5 virgin

Hirogen Alpha said:
Segment one: 2262, Babylon 5: I think this is the best part of the episode, following up immediately on the heals of Rising Star. Sheridan and Delenn are both reluctant heroes, but they of course return to a huge welcome, courtesy of Garibaldi. Where's Lise? Season five will explain that away, but I still find it strange that she Garibaldi would return to Babylon 5.

I can double check my script book when I get home, but I'm pretty sure the original script has *Ivanova* and Franklin greeting them, rather than Garibaldi and Franklin. But then of course, CC left the show, so that part had to be rewritten at the last minute. So it was a last minute decision to do that, and maybe JMS hadn't thought through the implications of Garibaldi returning to the station so quickly. Still, it would have made more sense to have it be Zack, or someone else.

Also, I seem to recall, in the script book that includes the Season 5 memo on how to set things up for the spinoff series (which eventually became Crusade, but was originally supposed to be about the Rangers), it sounds like Garibaldi was supposed to be off-station for much of the season, though still very much a part of the story. Not sure if this is the real reason for the change or not, but I'm wondering if moving him back to B5 was part of a budget-saving move. I know they had to cut down on costs in order to get it renewed for Season 5. It does seem as though there were more off-station scenes in Season 4 than in Season 5. Maybe they had to do it this way in order to keep the budget down?

 

[Harvey]

Re: First time impressions from the Babylon 5 virgin

^^
Interesting about Ivanova. There are definitely some inconsistencies between Rising Star and season five which would result in more scenes on the station. Londo's rise to emperor isn't as fast as Rising Star implies (as I read it), and Garibaldi doesn't marry Lise and move to Edgars Industries until the very end of year five.

 

[Harvey]

Re: First time impressions from the Babylon 5 virgin

So much for a relaxed viewing schedule. It looks like I might actually have a job lined up, and it will be full time starting this Friday, so I'm watching as many episodes as I can. Only two months to go until the Lost Tales.

"No Compromises"
I have a lot of mixed feelings about season five, but this episode is actually pretty good. Lochley receives a good introduction, which also gives Corwin some more screen time. I do have a problem with the overall plot though. First of all, the opening on Mars seems like it belongs in a season one or two episode. I feel like were past that--this is a series that has moved onto bigger and better things, and this is two steps backwards. Furthermore, I don't buy the Gaim ambassador being killed and nobody noticing. Even further, the assassin fires off a PPG numerous times in his room, and no one reports it. You'd think that would get somebody's attention.

The assasination plot aside, there are plenty of things to like about this episode. Lochley is not Ivanova, and that's a good thing. It would have been a cheat to introduce a clone of the character, though introducing any character this late in the game is a little hard to swallow. G'Kar eats up the screen every time he's on it. "Fine. Let's eat." Classic G'Kar. Garibaldi also gets plenty to do, and Lise is mentioned, thankfully. I'm glad she wasn't forgotten, though even having the two characters apart seems to be a little bit of a cheat. Sheridan and Delenn also get to develop their new relationship as husband and wife in several scenes, which are a joy.

And then there's Byron. What more can be said that hasn't already? I don't like the actor at all, and the writing is even worse. Every-time what he is saying should just be left as, he goes on. And on, and on. This is JMS at his worst when it comes to writing dialogue. His first encounter with Lochley is actually kind of chilling, the way the sound just drops out in the background, but Byron goes on longer than he should even here. And "Special Simon" dies, delegating his character to a plot device that's needed to get Sheridan out of danger. As much as I loathe child actors, I find his death to be unfortunate, since most of Byron's telepaths aren't developed at all.

Grade: B-

 

[chrisspringob]

Re: First time impressions from the Babylon 5 virgin

I just checked the script book, and yes, it was originally Ivanova who was there to greet Sheridan and Delenn in "Deconstruction", not Garibaldi.

And here's an excerpt from that memo about Season 5 that was written when Season 4 was still in production:

Garibaldi becomes involved more heavily with Lise Edgars, and finds himself inheriting certain government black projects that Edgars had initiated, and ends up in the middle of some very ugly situations that compel him to return to B5 to enlist their help in solving the problem, which sets him at odds with List at various points.
.
.
.
Franklin is asked by Ivanova to help her in running the station as Sheridan asked her to help. At first, he declines, he's a doctor, not an administrator. She has to heal wounds in the newly-formed alliance, and he can help...her bedside manner isn't terrific. Besides, with Garibaldi gone, she needs someone to confide in, a confidante.

So it sounds like, at some point, there was some iteration of Season 5 that would have included Garibaldi being away from the station for a while, before coming back. It wouldn't have been so rushed. (Now, keep in mind, this is part of a memo that includes a bunch of story ideas for how to set things up for the spinoff series, and JMS indicated that he ultimately scrapped the idea to do a bunch of setup for the spinoff in Season 5. However, some of this may have been intended to be part of Season 5 from the beginning.) I don't know if Garibaldi rushing back to the station so quickly was for budget reasons, or some other reason, but there was definitely some point at which the story would have had him staying on Mars for a while, before ultimately returning.